Could the last days of the Marine Corps be here?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Quigley_Sharps, Jun 7, 2013.

  1. Quigley_Sharps

    Quigley_Sharps The Badministrator Administrator Founding Member

    Could the last days of the Marine Corps be here?
    By: Ryan Bell, We Are 1776, Contributor
    With almost two hundred and thirty-eight years of service, there has been one branch of the United States military which has been known world renowned. That branch of service is the United States Marine Corps (or the “Marines.”) The Marines have always held a certain form of respect and fear from almost every one of the United States’ enemies and, so, it can be considered rather disheartening to hear that it might be time for the Marine Corps flag to be folded up and put away.
    Even though the discussion on whether or not to dissolve the Marines has been ongoing since the Marines formation on November 10th, 1775. But, the final hour for the marines might be this time. The argument that the Marine Corps should be eliminated is gaining more and more of a foothold in the capitol and within the Department of Defense.
    In 2010, Former Secretary of Defense Robert Gates questioned the Department of Defense about their need for the United States Marine Corps. The main point Former Secretary Gates made was that the main mission for the Marines, amphibious landings, is no longer a feasible form of invasion and, as such, because their mission cannot be fulfilled, there is no longer a need for them.
    However, the Marines have served in many different positions. As a constant force of readiness, the United States Marine Corps can be deployed anywhere in the world within seventy-two hours. Not only that, Marines have a historical record of performing at a higher rate than the United States Army. Additionally, Marines also guard United States Embassies, the President of the United States, and areas with classified information.
    One other issue which the Marines have is that they are not their own active branch of military. The United States Marine Corps is actually part of the Department of the United States Navy. Recently, United States Congressional Resolution 124 passed which renamed the Department of the Navy into the Department of the Navy and Marine Corps. Even so, the Resolution does affect how the Marine Corps will receive funding.
    The United States Marine Corps, partly, does receive funding directly from Congress under the annual United States budget. However, the other part of their budget is provided to them by the United States Navy. The second half of their funding goes towards housing, food, training and maintaining the readiness of the force.
    Nevertheless, with top Naval officials who dictate the amount of funding the Marine Corps will receive and with personal cut within the Corps, the Marines Corps still have a history of completing their mission with less money and less supplies. In fact the United States Marine Corps $18.8 billion for the 2014 fiscal year is small compared to other branches of military and Department of Defense projects.
    Now, there is a need to cut back on war-time spending and, overall, cut spending in the public sector. If the United States slowly eliminates its overseas presence, such cuts will occur gradually and, perhaps, more so if the United States can effectively cut spending in other areas. However, eliminating part of the military which is utilized at the President of the United States’s discretion and has a history of completing the objective in the most effective way possible is not the best action to take. So, Semper Fidelis (“Always Faithful/Loyal“) and keep the Marine Corps.

  2. Yard Dart

    Yard Dart Vigilant Monkey Moderator

    Speaking as a former Army paratrooper and the father of a young Marine- The Marines are an essential component to the U.S. Military and if they were eliminated that would be a major impact to the security of the country and of our ability to protect our national interest worldwide.
    It would also be a huge slap in the face to all current and former Marines that have served honorably throughout their great history.
    I think there are a thousand areas within the national budget that need to be cut before we ever approached the idea to eliminate the Marines!!
    oldawg, Sapper John, kellory and 3 others like this.
  3. tulianr

    tulianr Don Quixote de la Monkey

    As the article points out, there have always been discussions about disbanding the Marine Corps; and there always will be discussions. Marine Corps leaders have historically been aware of the danger of becoming a second Army, and thus redundant; and have worked hard to think outside the box, and to provide a value added service to the nation beyond what is provided by the other branches.

    I personally don't see the Marine Corps ever being disbanded, no matter how many discussions on the subject are held. Principally among the reasons I don't see the Marines being disbanded is often pointed to by detractors as a liability - the Marine Corps isn't an independent branch, it is part of the Department of the Navy (and Marine Corps.) I don't see it as a liability though. It is that special relationship that allows the Marine Corps to be an effective, forward deployed force in readiness. The business suits may look at the question and wonder if we really need a Marine Corps, but Naval Officers, by and large, understand that the symbiotic relationship between the Navy and Marine Corps is a serious force multiplier for both services, and provides for a near unique level of capability. So, not only will the Marine Corps resist being disbanded, the Navy will similarly defend its continued existence.

    Further, the idea that amphibious landings are obsolete is a fallacy. Large scale World War II style amphibious landings against major world powers are indeed obsolete, but the Marine Corps understands this, and is continually working to reshape its capabilities to provide for a littoral combat capability that is not at all obsolete in today's non-polarized world. Given that two thirds of the earth's surface is covered with water, there will always be a need to control coastlines and ports, and to approach nations from the water.
  4. DarkLight

    DarkLight Live Long and Prosper - On Hiatus

    The arguments change from time to time but I see the reasoning behind it in this administration as being a little more...nefarious isn't the right word but it's headed in the right direction. The Marine Corps has a history, starting with Semper Fi, of being just that...Loyal, Faithful, True to the End. That is the last thing this administration wants or needs.

    A well trained, and I do mean well trained, fighting force whose allegiance isn't to a man or an office but to the Country they love. A branch of the service that always has and always will, to a man (or woman), taken The Oath as seriously as life or death (no disrespect to the other branches of service but to hear my brother talk, it's scary how many are in just for the paycheck). This administration does NOT want or need that force around, period! They are an impediment, nothing more.

    Thank GOD for the US Marines and may they stand as a bulwark.

    If I sound overly melodramatic it's because I'm in the middle of a purge/cleanse...long story, Icefoot knows what I'm talking about, and when I read the OP I damned near burst into tears. Now THAT would have been a sight here at work...:(
    tulianr and Yard Dart like this.
  5. Yard Dart

    Yard Dart Vigilant Monkey Moderator

    Maybe the administration wants to use the $18.8 billion budget the Marines have for the new FEMA troops, that are only loyal to the .gov and nothing more........
  6. As if that would ever happen anytime in the foreseeable future.....
  7. Pax Mentis

    Pax Mentis Philosopher King |RIP 11-4-2017

    I notice an inordinate number of Marines among Oath Keepers compared to their percentage of vets/military as a whole.

    This is not an attitude DC wants to foster these days.
  8. VisuTrac

    VisuTrac Ваша мать носит военные ботинки Site Supporter+++

    just send in the sons and daughters of our elected officials.
    Brokor and BushcrafterAnthony like this.
  9. BTPost

    BTPost Stumpy Old Fart,Deadman Walking, Snow Monkey Moderator

    Can you imagine the STINK, that would be made, by all those JarHeads, who are now out in the American Society... They are ALSO Voters, and they would be VERY Upset, at any Announced Plan to eliminate their Corps..... Once a Marine, ALWAYS a Marine...... I never meet One, who didn't think that, clear down to the tip of his toes..... ......
    Yard Dart, KAS, kellory and 1 other person like this.
  10. Brokor

    Brokor Live Free or Cry Moderator Site Supporter+++ Founding Member

    As long as mankind continues to wage war, and more than this, wage wars for profit of international banking cartels and their corporate minions, we will continue to have standing armies. Let's face it, the Marines aren't going away --not until the whole of the Middle East becomes a nuclear wasteland, at least.
    Yard Dart and Quigley_Sharps like this.
  11. chelloveck

    chelloveck Diabolus Causidicus

    Do away with the Marine Corps??? As important as traditions are, even if the functions of the marine corps were devolved on to other services, the loss of capabilities for the Defence of the USA and it's ability to project force around the world would be considerably diminished. It is a loss of capability that the PRC must look at with much approval.

    The logic of doing away with the Marine Corps is like deciding that a pit bull could be more economically managed by removing one leg....and re-allocating the flesh to make the other three legs stronger....and expecting it to be as capable as before surgery. Might just as well cut off its nuts as well....though....cutting off the nuts of some of those in the five sided building might be a better option.
    oldawg, ghrit and tulianr like this.
  12. -06

    -06 Monkey+++

    BT, easy on my toes my friend--lol. The whole of the armed forces is a team--different parts have different tasks. Today it seems that the hierarchy is the anus instead of the head. But that is self evident to many.
    Yard Dart and chelloveck like this.
  13. NWPilgrim

    NWPilgrim Monkey++

    Does Obama REALLY want a few hundred thousand pissed off Marines at his doorstep?

    When you want a group of troops who, with no more than basic training, will stand their ground, use the rifle to good effect, never abandon their brother in arms and will make the enemy bleed for every inch of ground, then send in the Marines. Whatever they do to make Marines in basic they come out forged tough as steel in spirit. Not tough talking types. But I have seen a couple face down tough odds by shear will, and some who endured a lot of pain without a comment.
    Sapper John, kellory and tulianr like this.
  14. -06

    -06 Monkey+++

    What we need is a few hundred politicians and a few thousand bureaucrats replaced ASAP. Sad that we have the crowd up there now that is the way they are.
  15. bfayer

    bfayer Keeper Of The Faith

    Actually a better argument would be to keep the Marines and put them in charge of the Navy.

    The mission of the Marines has not changed, that are now and should remain America's rapid deployment force.

    The Navy on the other hand is no longer needed to fight other Navies in surface combat. What they are needed for is to get ground pounders and aircraft into an op area as quick as possible.
  16. bfayer

    bfayer Keeper Of The Faith

  17. ghrit

    ghrit Bad company Administrator Founding Member

    I don't know if it's a better argument, but it's interesting anyway. How would the Marines use submarines or realign the mission of the Air Force? How would the Marines handle humanitarian missions like the Aceh tsunami?

    Perhaps a useless and questionable view remains that the Marines are a strike force with rapid deployment capability. (Seals, Rangers, and the other small units do the surgical bit, and the drones to mindless things.)

    Yes, the various services are going thru mission changes, it has to be that way. I'm just not ready to see one service morphed into another.
    tulianr likes this.
  18. chelloveck

    chelloveck Diabolus Causidicus

    I think this suggestion will have the old salts at SM rolling around on the deck in apoplexy....Marines are excellent at what they do...but driving vessels and naval strategy and tactical ship handling is possibly not some of them...sure, the Navy provides a taxi service for the marines for inshore assault landings by landing craft or helo, but the navy has a much broader range of strategic tasks, than just as a taxi service for assaulting marines. Yes, surface vessels no longer duke it out with gunnery these days...though they'll give pirate boats a grand kick in the arse with their gunnery...they still have a role in convoy protection, and in destroying opponent naval forces with stand off missiles, drones and aircraft. Naval blockades and interdiction of opponent merchant maritime operations are other tasks not requiring a significant USMC presence.

    let each service perform its designated role, and do what it does best.
    oldawg and tulianr like this.
  19. bfayer

    bfayer Keeper Of The Faith

    I'm not talking about changing the Navy's strategic missions, just the who works for who part. The Navy would still maintain operational control of its fleet.

    It would not effect much of the day to day operations of each service, but it would have a significant effect on budgeting and long term mission focus.

    Why is a Navy Admiral better suited to run the whole shebang than a Marine General?
  20. tulianr

    tulianr Don Quixote de la Monkey

    As long as there are oceans, there will be a need for a Navy, and as long as there is a Navy, there will be a need for a corps of Marines. The Greek and Phoenician navies recognized this in 500 BCE (and before). The Marines' mission, composition, and uniform may change, but they are a fact of warfare.
    kellory, chelloveck and bfayer like this.
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