POWs - Personally Owned Weapons

Discussion in 'Firearms' started by Illini Warrior, Sep 17, 2020.


  1. Illini Warrior

    Illini Warrior Illini Warrior

  2. Grand58742

    Grand58742 Monkey+++

    Two part post...

    It's an interesting turn of events in the "world" of military issued firearms since WWII. By and large, I think the POW pistols in hot zones have gone by the wayside for the most part (I do recall an article from a few years ago about a General that carried a POW .357 revolver on an overseas trip that garnered a lot of negative attention... can't find the link though).

    Anyway, I think it's also going into the mindset changing about pistols in particular and more people are being issued a pistol that needs one. Changing times and all. In WWII, pistols were seen as "status" symbols for officers and there wasn't a "need" for Enlisted to have them. Most of the Lugers, Walthers and Nambus were more of a bring back item more than a serious secondary weapon for use in combat. Not saying they didn't get used, but I would think by and large, they were more of a curio than because they weren't issued one. During that time, the rifle was the first line of weaponry for infantry. Nobody really carried an issued sidearm as much during those times. Officers, pilots, machine gunners and support elements, sure. But for the most part, infantry and a lot of support carried rifles, carbines and SMGs. However, WWII was actually a time when a secondary sidearm would have been very useful for rifle toting US Forces especially during the urban combat in Germany.

    Korea, Vietnam and Desert Storm to an extent reinforced the "rifle first, rifle always" with the types of combat since there really wasn't a great deal of combat where a pistol would be needed as much. In the "Big Army" and USMC mainly. But with the 21st century, we started seeing a need for a secondary armament in pistol form especially in places like Iraq where we had significant urban operations. Pistols were starting to come out of storage and into the hands of combat troops that needed them. The .mil as a whole (not SOF who used them for years) started seeing it was useful rather than just something tossed at a supply or command post troop.

    I don't think you'll ever see a lot of POW pistols in combat theaters since the .mil has started a wider issue with them. Mainly because most unit leadership wouldn't allow such a thing. Second, and something I somewhat agree with, is support. Ammo commonality, spare parts and maintenance would be needed on such weapons even if they are "on their own" with such things. Again, SOF does their own thing with secondary weapons, but the budgets and support they have a far greater than normal units. Plus, there may be a need for such a thing. Some of the units I cleared through customs on one of my deployments had a far more eclectic inventory of weapons than some guns stores I've been in. But I'm not going to tell a SEAL team or an ODA "you can't have that Glock because it isn't issued..." Just mark it as cleared and move on with my life.
     
  3. Grand58742

    Grand58742 Monkey+++

    Part 2

    Now, non-issue parts and mags? Different story. He certainly hit the nail on the head with troops taking matters into their own hands by bringing what worked as opposed to the beat up, past it's life magazines that units continued to issue. The only problem with that is the fact some troops wouldn't know the difference in a "good" mag as opposed to a bad one. They'd be more than willing to pick up the cheapest Tapco or Promag they can find and think it works as good as a D&H, a Pmag or a Lancer.

    I am guilty of adding things to my issued carbine that I "shouldn't" have. I had no need for a PEQ-2 on my deployment to Iraq since: A) I wasn't issued nor did we have NODs. B) It wasn't sighted it for me anyway. C) extra weight I didn't want or need. Instead I tossed on a white light purchased on my own as well as a visible laser since the operations we were involved in made them far more useful. And replaced each of my mags with brand new aluminum Okay mags since the ones we were issued sucked. Came back and added a sling to my issue carbine on my own dime since the 3-point slings sucked with a QD white light (again, they weren't issued). I think unit leadership gives a lot more latitude to such things especially in hostile fire zones, but JWR hit the nail on the head of the "hide it before the higher ups see it" thoughts he added.

    Overall though, I think units across the .mil are getting to be far more open to the idea that a Commercial Off The Shelf (COTS) purchase of optional items may be the better route than spending millions of dollars to create something the private sector came up with first. (the new M-16 FOW magazines with the tan followers is a prime example of stupid waste in recreating an item that already existed) Slings, mags, holsters and other weapons accessories are slowly making their way into the procurement system.

    But by and large, I think "optional extras" on weapons generally have a blind eye turned to them during hostile fire zone deployments by a lot of unit leadership. I'm not saying you don't have some sticklers for the rules, but if a trooper ends up with a Magpul stock on his issued carbine while on deployment, I don't think a lot of leadership will say much. But it better be back in "issued" condition by the time it hits an armory back at garrison.
     
  4. Navyair

    Navyair Monkey++

    Aviators have often carried privately owned weapons into combat. Most Veitnam era helicopter pilots "acquired" SMG's or their choice of carbines usually carried slung over their seats. I personally carried a Browning Hi-Power in my flight vest the years we had .38 air weights and .45's. In those days I didn't own a .45, and the ones we had were not in great shape (WWII leftovers). The air weight .38's were fun to shoot, but only 5 rounds and not effective beyond about 20 feet.

    Was it strictly legal? No. All of my CO's pretty much said "put it in your vest or keep it locked up otherwise." They were all Vietnam Vets and understood.

    Only guy who ever gave me grief about it was the CO I was XO for.
     
    Oddcaliber likes this.
survivalmonkey SSL seal        survivalmonkey.com warrant canary
17282WuJHksJ9798f34razfKbPATqTq9E7