Prelude to War, the 2nd Civil War

Discussion in 'Politics' started by tacmotusn, Mar 28, 2017.

  1. tacmotusn

    tacmotusn RIP 1/13/21

    The Civil War is Here
    My abilities to copy and paste, just don't seem all that great since I started getting double clicks from my mouse about 90% of the time. Otherwise I would have printed a large excerpt of this excellent article. Please click on the link. It is an interesting read, and in many ways explains things. At the very least it will make you think hard about it all. Tac
    Since links seem to disappear, If someone can and would copy and paste the article below IT WILL BE HIGHLY APPRECIATED. Thanks.
    Tully Mars, Dunerunner and GOG like this.
  2. ghrit

    ghrit Bad company Administrator Founding Member

    Daniel Greenfield, a Shillman Journalism Fellow at the Freedom Center, is a New York writer focusing on radical Islam.

    A civil war has begun.

    This civil war is very different than the last one. There are no cannons or cavalry charges. The left doesn’t want to secede. It wants to rule. Political conflicts become civil wars when one side refuses to accept the existing authority. The left has rejected all forms of authority that it doesn’t control.

    The left has rejected the outcome of the last two presidential elections won by Republicans. It has rejected the judicial authority of the Supreme Court when it decisions don’t accord with its agenda. It rejects the legislative authority of Congress when it is not dominated by the left.

    It rejected the Constitution so long ago that it hardly bears mentioning.

    It was for total unilateral executive authority under Obama. And now it’s for states unilaterally deciding what laws they will follow. (As long as that involves defying immigration laws under Trump, not following them under Obama.) It was for the sacrosanct authority of the Senate when it held the majority. Then it decried the Senate as an outmoded institution when the Republicans took it over.

    It was for Obama defying the orders of Federal judges, no matter how well grounded in existing law, and it is for Federal judges overriding any order by Trump on any grounds whatsoever. It was for Obama penalizing whistleblowers, but now undermining the government from within has become “patriotic”.

    There is no form of legal authority that the left accepts as a permanent institution. It only utilizes forms of authority selectively when it controls them. But when government officials refuse the orders of the duly elected government because their allegiance is to an ideology whose agenda is in conflict with the President and Congress, that’s not activism, protest, politics or civil disobedience; it’s treason.

    After losing Congress, the left consolidated its authority in the White House. After losing the White House, the left shifted its center of authority to Federal judges and unelected government officials. Each defeat led the radicalized Democrats to relocate from more democratic to less democratic institutions.

    This isn’t just hypocrisy. That’s a common political sin. Hypocrites maneuver within the system. The left has no allegiance to the system. It accepts no laws other than those dictated by its ideology.

    Democrats have become radicalized by the left. This doesn’t just mean that they pursue all sorts of bad policies. It means that their first and foremost allegiance is to an ideology, not the Constitution, not our country or our system of government. All of those are only to be used as vehicles for their ideology.

    That’s why compromise has become impossible.

    Our system of government was designed to allow different groups to negotiate their differences. But those differences were supposed to be based around finding shared interests. The most profound of these shared interests was that of a common country based around certain civilizational values. The left has replaced these Founding ideas with radically different notions and principles. It has rejected the primary importance of the country. As a result it shares little in the way of interests or values.

    Instead it has retreated to cultural urban and suburban enclaves where it has centralized tremendous amounts of power while disregarding the interests and values of most of the country. If it considers them at all, it is convinced that they will shortly disappear to be replaced by compliant immigrants and college indoctrinated leftists who will form a permanent demographic majority for its agenda.

    But it couldn’t wait that long because it is animated by the conviction that enforcing its ideas is urgent and inevitable. And so it turned what had been a hidden transition into an open break.

    In the hidden transition, its authority figures had hijacked the law and every political office they held to pursue their ideological agenda. The left had used its vast cultural power to manufacture a consensus that was slowly transitioning the country from American values to its values and agendas. The right had proven largely impotent in the face of a program which corrupted and subverted from within.

    The left was enormously successful in this regard. It was so successful that it lost all sense of proportion and decided to be open about its views and to launch a political power struggle after losing an election.

    The Democrats were no longer being slowly injected with leftist ideology. Instead the left openly took over and demanded allegiance to open borders, identity politics and environmental fanaticism. The exodus of voters wiped out the Democrats across much of what the left deemed flyover country.

    The left responded to democratic defeats by retreating deeper into undemocratic institutions, whether it was the bureaucracy or the corporate media, while doubling down on its political radicalism. It is now openly defying the outcome of a national election using a coalition of bureaucrats, corporations, unelected officials, celebrities and reporters that are based out of its cultural and political enclaves.

    It has responded to a lost election by constructing sanctuary cities and states thereby turning a cultural and ideological secession into a legal secession. But while secessionists want to be left alone authoritarians want everyone to follow their laws. The left is an authoritarian movement that wants total compliance with its dictates with severe punishments for those who disobey.

    The left describes its actions as principled. But more accurately they are ideological. Officials at various levels of government have rejected the authority of the President of the United States, of Congress and of the Constitution because those are at odds with their radical ideology. Judges have cloaked this rejection in law. Mayors and governors are not even pretending that their actions are lawful.

    The choices of this civil war are painfully clear.

    We can have a system of government based around the Constitution with democratically elected representatives. Or we can have one based on the ideological principles of the left in which all laws and processes, including elections and the Constitution, are fig leaves for enforcing social justice.

    But we cannot have both.

    Some civil wars happen when a political conflict can’t be resolved at the political level. The really bad ones happen when an irresolvable political conflict combines with an irresolvable cultural conflict.

    That is what we have now.

    The left has made it clear that it will not accept the lawful authority of our system of government. It will not accept the outcome of elections. It will not accept these things because they are at odds with its ideology and because they represent the will of large portions of the country whom they despise.

    The question is what comes next.

    The last time around growing tensions began to explode in violent confrontations between extremists on both sides. These extremists were lauded by moderates who mainstreamed their views. The first Republican president was elected and rejected. The political tensions led to conflict and then civil war.

    The left doesn’t believe in secession. It’s an authoritarian political movement that has lost democratic authority. There is now a political power struggle underway between the democratically elected officials and the undemocratic machinery of government aided by a handful of judges and local elected officials.

    What this really means is that there are two competing governments; the legal government and a treasonous anti-government of the left. If this political conflict progresses, agencies and individuals at every level of government will be asked to demonstrate their allegiance to these two competing governments. And that can swiftly and explosively transform into an actual civil war.

    There is no sign that the left understands or is troubled by the implications of the conflict it has initiated. And there are few signs that Democrats properly understand the dangerous road that the radical left is drawing them toward. The left assumes that the winners of a democratic election will back down rather than stand on their authority. It is unprepared for the possibility that democracy won’t die in darkness.

    Civil wars end when one side is forced to accept the authority of the other. The left expects everyone to accept its ideological authority. Conservatives expect the left to accept Constitutional authority. The conflict is still political and cultural. It’s being fought in the media and within the government. But if neither side backs down, then it will go beyond words as both sides give contradictory orders.

    The left is a treasonous movement. The Democrats became a treasonous organization when they fell under the sway of a movement that rejects our system of government, its laws and its elections. Now their treason is coming to a head. They are engaged in a struggle for power against the government. That’s not protest. It’s not activism. The old treason of the sixties has come of age. A civil war has begun.

    This is a primal conflict between a totalitarian system and a democratic system. Its outcome will determine whether we will be a free nation or a nation of slaves.
    duane, Tully Mars, tacmotusn and 4 others like this.
  3. apache235

    apache235 Monkey+++

    Thanks for posting. I read this yesterday and forgot to get the link, then I couldn't find it again. Very good article and it explains a lot.
  4. Brokor

    Brokor Live Free or Cry Moderator Site Supporter+++ Founding Member

    Anything which focuses on blaming the other political party exclusively is certainly omitting the crux of the matter.
    Don't be fooled by the two party false paradigm; you will only end up being bitter and hateful for believing in illusions.
    Money, Greed, Power, the Corporate Age, Globalism, Fascism, Despotism...These are not the means of the left alone.

    Accept what is, see with eyes unblinded. Slave.
    (said to nobody in particular - to all humanity)
  5. Motomom34

    Motomom34 Monkey+++

    Sessions said yesterday that there will not be federal funding for sanctuary cities. Things exploded on social media but all that it exposed was that some are willing to overlook the laws. Let California ignore the law. Some lessons need to be learned. As for civil war, we said that during Obama's reign, it did not happen. I do believe that Americans are more level headed that we think. The internet is a huge [stirpot] tool.

    PS- I am not happy with President Trump and his family.
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  6. mysterymet

    mysterymet Monkey+++

    I voted for trump not because i liked him but because i hated hillary. I wish themlibs would shut up and give him a chance to see what he does but they are so interested in [stirpot] that it defies logic. It does make me think that someone pulling the strings does want a civil war. I do hope that we are more level headed than that.
    Legion489 and Bandit99 like this.
  7. Bandit99

    Bandit99 Monkey+++ Site Supporter+

    I hope that federal funding is yanked from these cities and that it's not all talk... Anyway, I am more concern with your comment "I am not happy with President Trump and his family." and would ask you to elaborate. Specifically, why? I feel neither one way or the other about him and, like most, I voted against Hillary not so much for him. However, I do have some hope that a few things will get done mostly because he is not a politician, obviously is tough skinned and more importantly a billionaire so hard to control by the puppeteers. But, I have learned on this forum this past year that you normally to not make these sort of remarks casually.

    EDIT: BTW @tacmotusn extremely good article, insightful and well written. I will remember this 'Daniel Greenfield' and watch for him in the future.
    Tully Mars, tacmotusn and Legion489 like this.
  8. Dunerunner

    Dunerunner Brewery Monkey Moderator

    The Left never negotiates a compromise to a more Conservative position, but always pushes the agenda further Left. It is like a ratcheting winch with no release lever, ever tightening its grip and never yielding.
  9. enloopious

    enloopious Rocket Surgeon

    I agree with Br0k0r. I am not sure if he is just blaming the left or using their tactics as his point of attack but it is certainly not something that is only being done by one side.

    The problem as I see it is that this article is pointing out the obvious. These problems have been going on for a long time and even in the 1980s you could see it starting. That was the breaking point. When we went from Reagan to Bush everything changed publicly. Before that time it changed behind the scenes but in reality it started long before that in the early 1900s. People are seeing the results of those changes today and complaining about them as if they have a new cause.

    The article is presumptuous to think that we can undo any of the damage that is already done. There have never been any backwards steps that have fixed these problems at any point in history.

    The real problem is that people want someone to rule them. This is THE biggest problem we face as a species. Why do we need a government?
    To have a space program? SpaceX proved this untrue and before that all the private trains, airlines, car companies, etc.
    To coin and regulate money? They stole the money and left us the receipts. Who still uses gold and silver?
    To protect us from invasion? They have let other governments rape the country. China, England, Israel, ETC. The doors are wide open.
    To stop murder? I'm pretty sure murderers don't follow the law... they run for political office or join the military/police.

    The real answer is to protect our rights. There is no other reason for a government.

    I'm all for people joining forces for defense and growth but when you start using that club to make people follow policies they might not agree with, like abortion and gun control, you have over stepped the line.

    BTW, make no mistake. The powers that be WANT a civil war. They want an excuse to move us into cages or coffins. That IS their objective. It always has been since before the time of the Pharaoh. What? You think because its happening to us its different?
    Tully Mars, Dont, Bandit99 and 2 others like this.
  10. Pax Mentis

    Pax Mentis Philosopher King |RIP 11-4-2017

    Unfortunately, you may be correct about what you call "level headedness" and I call terminal apathy and "it can't happen here" denial. If you are correct, I believe there is no real hope left for the Republic. Those of you with enough years left are pretty solidly headed for a totalitarian world.

    There is no way that I can see to protect the constitution through the ballot box or peaceful change. You have one "side" that basically thinks the constitutional road is a good one, but most of them don't recognize that it has effectively been taken out of the equation and only retains the illusion of it's power. You have another side that is determined to destroy the constitution and are willing to lie, cheat, steal and quietly kill while using the schools to assure that each generation will grow up hating the American ideal more.

    The '18 elections will result in the Dems taking back the Senate because they are willing to do whatever they must in order to make that happen...that will be the end of any potential there might have been for a return to something resembling constitutionalism. Too many who would go the other direction have decided that where the liberal media makes smoke, there must be fire and all the things they say about those attempting to turn things around must have some basis in truth.

    (PS...what the hell has Trump's family done? I make it a point to check both CNN and Fox on a daily basis but I must have missed something)
  11. Yard Dart

    Yard Dart Vigilant Monkey Moderator

    Well none of us voted for Trump's family.... so live and let live as far as they are concerned. I suspect his family members, much like the rest of ours, have all sorts of degrees of various dysfunctional issues if you dig deep enough. I do not care about the man nor his family personally..... I only care about his policies and what he accomplishes in the course of protecting the U.S interest and people.

    The flip side is having Hillary as the pres..... could you even imagine the crap we would be enduring at this point if she was in charge. The effort to fix what Obbumer had done to the constitution and our way of life would have never even been started to get corrected by congress or anyone else... and we would be stuck with those policies and I am sure, worse ones to follow. As an example, we had what, 60 votes by congress to repeal obbumer care up till the election..... now that they have all chambers and the presidency, they can not even agree on that item and get chit done. With hillary in place, it would be even worse.
    How quick folks forget about the bullet, we as a nation, dodged when Trump defeated the witch!!!
  12. Brokor

    Brokor Live Free or Cry Moderator Site Supporter+++ Founding Member

    The republic is long dead, there's no way to "fix" this nation in terms which would restore it to what it once was. Even a violent revolution would spurn change to the magnitude of dozens of factions each vying for supremacy --and that's assuming there is victory. It's fair and easy to say that most folks don't even know who the enemy is, let alone attempt to solve the greater issue. Not too many people grasp the entirety of private banking, its history and implications, or corporations, their powers, and how they originated. Very few care to even entertain the idea of breaking outside the boundary of "rational" thinking for the "sane", too afraid of being shunned by these "normal" mimetic culture zombies.

    The country is a fascist oligarchy disguised as a democracy, and patriots still cling desperately to the idea that it once was a republic. I say, too many movies and far too much television has programmed them to believe in a false hope. It's best to accept what is and just try to enjoy the time you do have left, it truly is a gift not afforded to every nation in its death throes. Any major alteration to the monetary system and it all collapses --every last shred. The majority, if not all government (Federal, State, Local) are incorporated. These corporations invest in other corporations and produce annual financial reports. Every bureau, agency, and municipality are corporations, from the local news station to the police department and your town itself. If you were to cut the head off the snake (FED-IRS) the monetary system would collapse and the convulsions would take down primary assets that would cause panic and utter calamity. Most, if not all corporations not prepared would lose all monetary assets and investments (and that's a whole bunch if you've ever read a CAFR before). You simply cannot go from what we are now and rewind a couple hundred years to "republic" without burning it all down. Then, you still have all the countless idiots to convince they've been misled and teach them the basics of Constitutional Law.

    Perhaps in the distant future if humanity somehow still exists among the other creatures which haven't gone extinct, and the remaining survivors actually learn from the experience, teach those who follow, and unlock the secret to living selflessly and without greed or foolish desire to have control over others...perhaps that is when there will be a chance. But, then again nothing lasts forever. There's always a value of entropy we must consider and it applies to everything organic, all energy, even a simple piece of parchment or, apparently in our particular case --a concept like freedom. Nothing really lasts forever, and humans are amazingly fallible.

    All government is wrong and unnatural. A sovereign being should not have to beg permission to exist or kneel in submission to it or its servants for chaos. Governments are like a wildfire, and they will always consume the beauty of this world. And to ruin the poetic moment, it's my purpose to remind you that people aren't the fabled phoenix --we burn, we die. Just like any good novel, it requires a proper ending, so without further adieu, I give you "THE END".

    Now, go do something fun. Nobody ever said life was permanent. ;)
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  13. Motomom34

    Motomom34 Monkey+++

    We cannot afford the Trump family. The count-down clock say 3 years, 9 months and 24 days till he is out of office but they will have broke us long before then.

    So far-
    Trump to florida- 3 trips (goes every other week), $3 million per trip
    Melania/Barron- $1 million per day to stay in NY, she may move to the WH in June
    Trump Children Aspen trip- $8 million
    Eric's business trips- Uruguay ($97,830 in hotel bills alone.) to check progress on an unfinished Trump tower. About a month later, he was in the Dominican Republic, seeing whether an earlier resort project could be revived. He joined his brother, Donald Jr., a couple of weeks later at a ribbon-cutting ceremony for a Trump-branded golf course in Dubai. Then the two popped up earlier last week in Vancouver, Canada, for the opening of a new Trump hotel.

    These people travel. They are rich, they go where they want, when they want. Not one trip to Camp David which would be cheap. Ivanka just got back from 2 weeks in Aspen then took her kids to the zoo. Secret Service protects these people everywhere they go. It is not cheap. Meanwhile Obamacare will not be repealed. For some reason he has stopped draining the swamp. I have read Trump's ratings are anywhere between 35-45% depending on where you read. A lot of angry Americans elected him and they are getting angry again. Brief happiness then reality set in.

    ** PS- at this rate, it will cost billion + to protect this family for 4 years.
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2017
    chelloveck likes this.
  14. Bandit99

    Bandit99 Monkey+++ Site Supporter+

    @Motomom34 I must admit that I haven't been following things very closely recently due to some personal details but those figures seem way out of line, even for a President. Yes, I do question their validity however it does bring up a good point that you made which I doubt few if any thought of - for sure I didn't, "These people travel. They are rich, they go where they want, when they want." And, where they go an entire security entourage must now go also. My guess is the press will jump on this with both feet and either they will slow down the trips or come to financial terms/agreement with it, probably the latter as it's not like they can't afford it and they do have a business empire to run.

    @enloopious You are spot-on today! Definitely well said and you are correct in all regards but; nevertheless, I still enjoyed the article. It was well written and I like good prose. But, sadly, you are right in, "There have never been any backwards steps that have fixed these problems at any point in history." Yes, sad and tragic but so true.

    @Brokor You and enloopious muses must really be singing sweetly (and in sync) because you are also on form today!
    "The country is a fascist oligarchy disguised as a democracy, and patriots still cling desperately to the idea that it once was a republic." "Governments are like a wildfire, and they will always consume the beauty of this world." Great food for thought...can't say I like where those dark thoughts take me but nevertheless stated very, very well.
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  15. Pax Mentis

    Pax Mentis Philosopher King |RIP 11-4-2017

    Well...I suppose a billion here and a billion there will eventually add up to real money...

    If (as it appears he will to the extent the nervous Nellies will stay out of apoplexy) he follows through with the proposed budget and the real cuts (not decreases in the rate of growth) it includes, that billion and hundreds like it can be "saved" in the first year. We have protected the family of Presidents for about 150 years now, there is nothing new here. Some are more expensive to protect than others. Whether that billion is total estimate for protection or the estimated difference between them and some relatively young family where the kids don't have actual lives that involve travel, it isn't really a level that is going to come close to "breaking us" any further than we are already broke.

    While (as I have mentioned) Mr Trump is not aiming at cutting back the government to the level I would like to see (and which would cause 100% of Dems and about 50% of everyone else to have strokes), he is advocating cuts that would not only reverse the direction of the budget for the first time since I was a kid (eliminating trillions in spending), but potentially eliminate federal interference in at least some of those areas where they don't belong.

    To me the whole "OMG we're spending millions on protection" is just more statist/liberal noise...and apparently pretty effective noise if they got you.

  16. ghrit

    ghrit Bad company Administrator Founding Member

    I have to admit that I don't care a whit about Donnie's family or where they live or what they do in their spare time, with the exception of that kid (inlaw) he's given an office to. That one bears watching simply because he's been demoted from private citizen to politician. Railing against the expense of SS guards pales when you remember zero's extended family, including feeding the bleeping dog and mother in law.
  17. DKR

    DKR Raconteur of the first stripe

    If I may swim against the tide for a bit.

    The State of Utah, Dept of Education, took a hard look at Federally mandated programs - like the well-loved Common Core - then looked at how much dough the FedGov served up to make it happen.

    (Note - key words to watch for is Unfunded mandates, it isn't just the Dept of Non-Education)

    After they did their sums, they found the FedGov ponied up less than 17% of the total cost of their mandated programs.

    After some deliberation, they told the Feds to jam most of their programs where the sun never shines (metaphysically, of course.)

    Now they are running their Ed programs as the citizens have called for, less the pittance offered by the dolts in DC.

    You may remember when the SoU handed the Feds their ass in court over GI Bill payments counting as the reason a well known University would have to provide Co-ed dorm rooms.

    I really don't care from most of their State politics, but that State has been one of the few to turn down Fed dollars and reject the demands that go with the dough.

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  18. Ura-Ki

    Ura-Ki Grudge Monkey

    Yup, things are circling the drain ever faster and time is running out for this republic, it's not a question of "IF" but when, and how many lives it's going to cost before the dust finally settles! I say let it all burn, the sooner the better, I would much rather start building something else, then waiting for it to finally slow burn down to the powder keg! All societies ever created fail, it's how man kind works. As soon as some one is put in charge of something, some one else resents it, or wants it for them selves, make it big enough and last long enough and it grows and grows all the while it self consumes! We are near the end of the prosperous time, people are waking up to the bitter taste of reality before us. Can it be saved? NO, to little and much too late to save what we had, it's now a question of what will we end up with, and will it be worse then what we have now!
    Legion489 likes this.
  19. OldDude49

    OldDude49 Just n old guy

    I have had the impression for some time now that both parties were taken over by the left long ago...

    and what we are getting now is more of a dog and pony show...

    how many times has the public voted in so called conservatives based on the claim they will fix something and then the so called conservatives do nothing?

    IMHO this kinda thing has been going on since around 1970's...

    and remember they did give us the patriot act and etc...

    and pay close attention... just how many politicians now seem to be moving to the libertarian party?

    and one of you major left wing groups the DSA or is that DAS? democratic socialist party...

    have you looked at who is who within that group?

    just my humble opinion...
    Bandit99 and Yard Dart like this.
  20. enloopious

    enloopious Rocket Surgeon

    ...Yeah I can't even say there are any that still think its a Republic... like the Chinese Republic. Name only. The concept is so foreign to the average people walking around this planet that they wouldn't know it if they saw it.
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