Talk me out of it: Business Decision followup

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by AxesAreBetter, Nov 30, 2018.


  1. AxesAreBetter

    AxesAreBetter Monkey+++

    So, I have been looking at options, and I think I am going to go get certified to teach survival courses. It is an expensive move (several thousand upfront), that has the real potential of being a career move instead of an attempt to buy time or throw money willy nilly at a problem.
    I should be able to see a full return on investment in the first 18 months, with the further caviot that I will have a source of income that is not based on my stock or location. It also will see me covered by their insurance, marketing, and several other side perks that translate to it being cheaper to get hooked up with them than to buy all the licenses myself and start from scratch building a name.

    I am not entirely sold on the subject, this being a big move by any standard, and figured I would ask the monkeys to "shake the tree" with me while I am making up my mind.

    Also, I appreciat ethe feedback from the previous post, and intend to get back to a few of you once I get some time to think again after the Christmas rush.
     
  2. Altoidfishfins

    Altoidfishfins Monkey+++ Site Supporter+

    Anything like that sounds shaky to me, kind of like Amway or Shaklee
     
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  3. AxesAreBetter

    AxesAreBetter Monkey+++

    It is a little less sketchy than that. Haha.
     
  4. Yard Dart

    Yard Dart Vigilant Monkey Moderator

    I had a long talk with a 26 y.o. that just started a business 6 months ago detailing cars. He put a lot of money towards training/certs. and getting started, but had no marketing going on other than word of mouth.

    Have a well rounded plan to advertise, get a web site set up, start your direct marketing to parallel business to advertise/recommend your business....good luck either way and if you need hep, here anytime to bounce ideas off of. My wife just started one two years ago and has lot's of lessons learned.
     
  5. sec_monkey

    sec_monkey SM Security Administrator

    it does sound a lil bit risky

    gud luck :) :)
     
  6. ghrit

    ghrit Bad company Administrator Founding Member

    Watch the franchise agreement. They are OFTEN loaded, but not to your benefit. DO NOT SIGN AN AGREEMENT THAT INCLUDES ARBITRATION OR MEDIATION!!!
     
    Last edited: Nov 30, 2018
  7. Zimmy

    Zimmy Wait, I'm not ready!

    Check your market and aptitude then match your skills to it.

    Desert survival won't sell in a flooded forest swamp.
     
  8. SB21

    SB21 Monkey+++

    Word of mouth is the best advertising . Print some catchy looking cards or flyers and hand out or place in areas of that interest to people . But in these days of computer usage , a website may work . Not exactly sure what all you're looking to do , and how many thousands you're planning to invest , but , this is just my opinion , but if you're talking several thousand dollars , for instance , say
    $ 5000 , if you are talking of 18 months to earn your 5000 back , that's a slow return. it would take another 18 months to make 5000 . If that's the case , its not going to make you a living . But if you're doing it as something you enjoy doing , like a hobby , and just making a little cash while doing what you enjoy, then that will be ok . That's just the way I see it .
     
  9. AxesAreBetter

    AxesAreBetter Monkey+++

    @SB21 -Good way of looking at it. I like teaching, and the return on investment of 18 months is actually pessimistic from the information I have been able to glean on it. Just figuring on it taking that long to get everything in place for he marketing to work consistently.
     
  10. UncleMorgan

    UncleMorgan I like peeling bananas and (occasionally) people.

    I shall try HARD to talk you out of this!

    Mostly because they seem to want your money first.

    News Flash! You don't need anybody's permission or "certification" to teach survival.

    All you need to do is start teaching with the survival knowledge you presently have, even as you progressively expand that knowledge.

    Teach what you know.

    You and one student constitutes a Survival University.

    If you know only one thing, teach exactly one thing very well. Then double your store of knowledge.

    If you aren't familiar with edible wild mushrooms, don't teach people to eat wild mushrooms.

    Teach them how to make a fire instead. Or cordage. Or a basket. Or whatever you already know and are proficient at.

    What are these "certifiers" going to do? TEACH you to be a survival instructor? Give you a year of intensive hands-on training? Or ten?

    And who certified them, anyway? And how?

    Or, God forbid, are they going to teach you to be a teacher?

    Here's what I recommend:

    First: Find someone who has already done exactly what you are considering, with these same "certifiers".

    Sit them down with a case of beer and have a heart to heart talk. Find out exactly how much money they paid, how much they made, and how long it took them to make it.

    "Certifications" are worthless unless the certifying body has a legal standing. It's one thing to be "certified" by Survival Jack Enterprises, Inc. and something else entirely to be certified by the American Medical Association.

    Second: Pay last, not first. Don't give them a dime until they have given you a dollar's worth of something. Then, don't give them more than one dime--until they earn more.

    I am an Internationally Certified Master Survival Instructor rated to teach Arctic, Open Water (Ocean), Island, Boreal Forest, Swamp, Desert, and Tundra Survival to up to 20 persons per class at up to $200.00 per hour each, plus expenses.

    It cost me nothing to get all my Certifications, since I gave them to myself at a very deep discount. I will have a very handsome Certificate of International Certifications in about 10 minutes when it finishes printing out and the gold ink dries.

    I may have to read a couple of books first, but then I figure after that I can go directly to Franchising...

    (ta-dumphf!)

    Take to heart one of UncleMorgan's Maxims: In every relationship it's important to know who gets paid, who gets laid, and who gets played.
     
  11. SB21

    SB21 Monkey+++

    Uncle Morgan made sense there . You could team up with Bishop and run your students thru a 2-3 week Boot Camp survival type school . Have them pay their 2500 dollar learning fee up front . Give them a small list of supplies to bring with them . Lead'em out into the bush and terrorize them for 2 weeks , then bring'em back in for the last week for a therapy session before you spit'em back out into the world . :ROFLMAO:
     
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  12. AxesAreBetter

    AxesAreBetter Monkey+++

    In the middle we could bbq and sell beer for $6 a can. haha.
     
  13. TnAndy

    TnAndy Senior Member Founding Member

    Yep.....that right there.

    And most likely they have figured out you can probably CAN make more money certifying folks than actually teaching anyone survival.


    People that want to learn stuff (whatever) are gonna learn stuff.....the rest are simply looking for reality entertainment.
     
  14. Motomom34

    Motomom34 Monkey+++

    Survival school. I have seen lots of them and many take time to complete. Many people do not want to put in 4 weekends in a row to learn. How long are the classes and what are your patrons paying for?

    Example: I am a member of CERT. CERT certification is 3- 8 hour classes. Yes it was free training but it was 3 Saturdays in a row. Many start but not as many completed the course. When it comes to paying, people are even more hesitant to sign up and participate. I have paid for day long courses. The courses I have paid for range from $30 to $200. The $200 course was a waste and failed IMO. I was promised X and the instructor wasted my time & money blathering on about him and letting the conversation drift. They got a bad review. On-line reviews stay and people read them.

    Maybe you should get involved in a CERT program, then the FEMA training. All free. Then promote your skills. One of the CERT students was educated in psychology and held a specialized class for $25 dollars. It was advertised in partnership with CERT. All the students were notified and many attended.

    What level are these survival courses? IMO survival skills are like stairs,, one step at a time. People choose whether they want to continue to the next step. Personal and family ABC's basic preparedness is #1. Those can be simple classes that teach what to have in your 3 day, 2 week etc kits. If that goes well, some will want to know the next step and want more. The first class/ step should be free or at almost no cost. Hook the people into wanting to learn more then expand.

    BTW- does this franchise have dues? A yearly fee?
     
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  15. BlueDuck

    BlueDuck Monkey+++

    I think UncleMorgan and I think a lot alike. Who, what and why, came to mind as I read your post. I would have to know a lot more before I could buy in to something like that.
     
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  16. Meat

    Meat Monkey+++

    I get ideas all the time that I think are genius. Over a period of a few weeks the feeling fades. Then off I go to repair power lines. :whistle:
     
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  17. Dunerunner

    Dunerunner Brewery Monkey Moderator

    Going the weigh in here and this is just my two cents and a few points... FWIW

    One. Is there a market for what I am selling? (doesn't matter what it is)
    Two. Have I tested the waters to see if there are sufficient numbers of clients to support my venture long term?
    Three. Will I eventually saturate my market in the short term?
    Four. Do I have the financial horsepower to produce training materials for my classes before I start?

    Here is what I would do, given your plan...

    Write your course outlines.
    Write a training manual.
    Keep my current job.
    Market said training manual.
    Update my training manual and republish as a second edition.

    There is little risk in publishing and distributing your own work. I emphasize your own work, not someone else's as that can become troublesome if you are successful. There are ways to become self published.

    This will provide you with an indication of the interest in what you have to offer without much financial commitment and will test your commitment to this endeavor as well. If you decide to teach the skills you have obtained, you will have a ready made training manual to sell or hand out to students.

    There are many who would like to attend training at Gunsite Academy or The Culinary Institute of America, or even go back to college and take courses in technology. Many look at the tuition requirements and time required and never pursue any of it. Some will start and never finish (as Moto suggested in her post). I have, in the past, thought of opening a brewery but after studying the economic demographics and talking to the local bar owners about what sells, then looking at what the local super markets stock on the shelves; I doubted that the community would support the venture to the level necessary for it to be successful. I guess it took that fact check for me to see that in reality the business would not ever be self sustaining, but would always require additional financial input from me to stay afloat.

    If you decide to go ahead, I wish you the best of luck, but go into it with your eyes open and a fire in your belly, not because you have a dream.
     
  18. SB21

    SB21 Monkey+++

    I have seriously come up with ideas , never acted on them . Years later , they were in production and selling . I know of at least 2 times this has happened .Ya snooze , ya loose .
     
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  19. Witch Doctor 01

    Witch Doctor 01 Mojo Maker

    Where do you plan on having the courses? if you don't have a large area you are limited to the number of courses you can offer annually, additionally you would potentially need several locations with different environments, How much will the travel cost? do the locations have transport from airports? hotel services? etc... You will need a support staff to provide transport, emergency connections , extraction if necessary, and lots of Insurance...
     
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  20. AxesAreBetter

    AxesAreBetter Monkey+++

    The argument I have for a lot of these questions is, after running the math, it would be cheaper to get the schooling, the certification gets you a sign on with the company, with their insurance, they get the land issue sorted, basically all the problems get solved by
    "I give them money, then use their resources as an employee" to at least get my feet on the ground running.
     
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