TOTM February 2015- Bugging In

Discussion in 'General Survival and Preparedness' started by Motomom34, Feb 1, 2016.


  1. ssonb

    ssonb Confederate American

    To reply on the sealing of a sewer line.......Find the cleanout stub in the yard, It will have a screw in cap then find an old set of pants and cut off a leg sewing one end shut, remove the cap, next insert the "leg sack" into the cleanout tube usually the tube is about 4"in dia.. Hold the open end and fill with sand then let it slide down until it sets in the T intersection.
     
  2. Kingfish

    Kingfish Self Reliant

    Our goal has been self reliance from day one. We have a solid 10 year plan for limited electric power,water and wood heat, and ammunition. If things go longer then that we will have to transition to a non electric plan. If a shtf scenario last more than 10 years we are certainly screwed anyways. After that it would be hand cutting wood, hand pumping water and scavenging for food and things like salt. Most likely only have .22 rimfire ammo left , hand tools and hand carts. I dont see the world going all the way back to the stone age.
     
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  3. yeti695

    yeti695 Monkey+

    We plan to bug in as well. We live in a rural area with a few neighbors around. We dont know them very well other than just normal chit chat. Mostly older folks. We need to plan to have more people to start a group, get a solar pump for the well and stock more items for a SHTF event. My wife and I are really more prepping for a natural disasters that happen here in pur area. After we have that covered better, then we will talk more long term. We have to start somewhere. Since we have moved away from the city the option of bugging in is more favorable than before.
     
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  4. VHestin

    VHestin Farm Chick

    Well some of my contingency plans might have to change now. One of our neighbors who's been good to us over the years, they died this morning(suffered hemorrhagic stroke yesterday). :(
     
  5. DarkLight

    DarkLight Live Long and Prosper - On Hiatus

    Been holding off on this until I had some time to sit down and give it the time and attention it deserves.

    There's a lot going on in the topic, and I'm glad because while it's good to focus on one thing occasionally, very few of our decisions, preparations, plans and contingencies are going to occur or be made in a vacuum.

    The act of bugging in, for me, is going to be complex. From water use to food preparation to refuse removal, of all kinds, it's not a simple, linear flowchart. I started a conversation with @Motomom34 with the "3 things you can do without with planning" because I wanted to drive myself to really examine where I'm at, what I'm doing, what I have and what I need. Need being a key word. I'll start there and then ramble for an hour or two so grab a beer I guess (not writing books, need to get the keyboard time in somewhere).

    Thing(s) I can do without right now, without any (or any more) preparation:
    1. Sugar candy. Doesn't matter the variety, I've all but tossed those. Not good for me, horrible for the waistline, screws up my hypoglycemia.
    2. Grain based snacks. Tortilla chips, puffed "cheeze" doodles, "healthy" wheat thins/triscuits, crackers, etc. I've gotten to the point that 10 minutes after eating them I can taste the sweetness in my mouth, especially from corn based snacks (corn syrup anyone?).
    3. Hard liquor. Rarely drink it anymore. There's some in the freezer (vodka) that's been there for a almost a month since I touched it last.
    Things I can do without with a little weaning:
    1. Caffeine. I don't drink much of it but sometimes the hankering hits and I want a soda (diet is "fine") but it's usually for the caffeine hit. Energy shots do the same thing as do those "energy fizz" concoctions (no, not Emergen-C...not the same thing).
    2. Beer. Still like me a beer occasionally. Anything from a Miller Lite to a Sam Adams Seasonal to a local craft brew. I'm not Primal dangit, no matter how much I think I want to get there.
    Things I need to wean myself off of:
    1. The internet. I bring this up because I'm addicted to it now. Not just the Internet but technology (next) in general. I obviously can't store a backup of the Internet so I need to be better about walking away from it before it goes away.
    2. Technology. This is going to take some serious weaning. I know that if it's gone, it's gone and I could deal with it but I'd feel lost for a while. I'd like to have the ability to draw that out as much as possible. Solar chargers, etc.
    3. "Idle time". I will miss this. I have had times in my life when I was so busy that I quite literally (the appropriate use of that word, by the way), woke up, showered and left the house in 20 minutes, was on my feet and busy working all day long and then ate, showered and fell into bed within 30 minutes of getting home. 7 days a week. Made for a grumpy DarkLight. I know things will get very busy and hectic "post fan event" and I'll miss the down time I've grown accustomed to.
    So, what am I doing to help with these items? I'm planning to spend some money on a few additional preps. Solar is on the list but I need to quit screwing around. Tools to assist with the manual labor that will be required (gardening implements is a big one, other types of tools is another. I've been invited hunting a couple of times and need to start taking people up on the offer and getting those tools as well). I don't plan on stocking up on beer, and for me I don't see myself learning to brew. I'll miss it but I'll be busy so maybe that's actually something I could drop cold turkey.

    Things I'm not willing to do without (or at least not yet...time will tell) is another story. Water, "running" if possible. How do I do that though? There's the manual method (carry a bucket to a high point and let gravity do the work), there's powered via solar or generator and then there's "not running". We will be able to have clean water, at least for the first while (couple thousand gallons with what we have now). How to clean more? I need some powered pool shock but so much of it now days is crap and full of other stuff I don't want. I need some different filters and I want to learn how to make charcoal.

    I'd like a well but I live in a subdivision so that's out. We live in an area with at least some flowing water all year. I need a catchment system though. I really don't want to have to walk several miles each way every day to hit the lake, and realistically I'd get stopped more likely than not. I'm looking into capturing rainwater from the downspouts but that's going to require filtering, so I'm researching the best way to capture and then treat/use that water (still legal here). Water is obviously important, we die without it, but water and the use of it is kind of a...it's almost a wealth. I don't want to do without "enough" water.

    Soap is another one. You gotta stay clean or you get sick. When services shut down, staying clean is going to become even more important. I'm looking into learning how to make soap. No matter how much you stock up now, you will eventually run out so knowing how to make it is a must for me. I really like the Featured Thread on that and plan on trying it soon.

    Food is obvious but that boils down to store as much as you can reasonably store and learn to grow a lot in a small space. Can the extra. All of that requires planning and preparation and "stuff" to make it happen. I'm acquiring the parts to do it, it just takes time and is slow going. We learn every year what works and doesn't work in the garden. We are so far away from being self sufficient it's not funny but we're learning. If push came to shove, with a group of people and enough land we could probably scrape by (more people for more labor basically). I'd love livestock of multiple varieties but it's not in the cards for the next decade probably. So, I put stuff away.

    Heat in the winter is a big one and would be rough. I don't have nearly the propane supply I would like. We don't have a real fireplace and so we're down to the Big Buddy and blankets (and a cracked window to keep from dying which defeats some of the purpose). I've looked into some stoves but again, money. Not in the cards yet. That is actually a big one I want to remedy though.

    And of course, security. Getting a bunch of stuff to ride out the apocalypse is great...right up until someone comes to take it from you. By myself I can hold off a half dozen people if I have enough notice. More than that or no notice and I'm out, the family is out and the stuff is gone. I don't have a mag which really concerns me and I'm in a location where everyone is either living hand to mouth or is a bit...insular. There is one HAM operator in my neighborhood and I need to get to know him. He and his wife put in some raised beds and then as they were putting more "stuff" in their back yard they put up a fence. I get the feeling I'd like to have that guy on my side. There are a couple of Mormons in my neighborhood (grew up Mormon) and I know them but I'm an apostate and they don't have much to do with me (family ages are different as well and we just don't mesh). They may or may not have food storage and/or security measures but I they just don't come across as wanting to be in a MAG with an ex. Everyone else...zombies waiting to happen. That scares me and I really can't do anything about it right now. I'm looking for ways but monetarily and where I'm at in life...well I guess I'm not willing to force the family to make those sacrifices. Silly? Maybe. Dumb? Probably. I gotta live with 'em though and I guess that's the trade-off I'm making now.

    Things that concern me are how would I cook and not draw attention to myself? Haven't figured that one out but a LOT of what we have can be eaten cold so it probably will be.

    If word gets out that I have and they don't and they come a knockin'? That's not going to end well. If they push hard enough someone will wind up dead. Might be me because they overwhelmed me but threatening my family is a non-starter. 4 people on this planet I'd both kill for and die for and they are all under this roof. I know, that doesn't necessarily mesh with the above where I'm not willing to do "whatever it takes right now" to get them out of harm's way, but that's a debate for another time.

    I'd like to work together as a "community" but that's only going to come after the zombies to be are dead and gone.

    Long term recovery is something I spent a lot of time thinking about and researching. There are some really in-depth sites out there that have a ton of information on how to put things back in place to bring civilization back. I have a lot of it on DVD but without a way to read it, it's just shiny plastic discs. One such is Pole Shift Survival Information. Ignore the "OH MY GAWD WE'RE ALL GONNA DIE" and it's a wealth of information. Another was cd3wd (CDs for the 3rd World) by Alex Weir. I have the full set (final before he passed away in 2014) and the amount of information there (37 DVDs I think) is phenomenal. How to do damned near anything. Those two sources would be amazing resources for putting things back together.

    Putting things back together, however, is not a one person job. It even takes more than a spotter (Motivational Poster thread). That takes commitment from a large number of people and I don't know where I stand on that. Great idea, don't know how I'd execute it. But I've got the books if you have a laptop.

    Do I know what I need to do? Some. Am I doing it? Some. Do I have it all figured out? No, that's why I'm here. I get a LOT of out this site, certainly more than I put back in. Come to think of it, SurvivalMonkey is probably one of those things I'll miss the most (I did come back after all).
     
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  6. Legion489

    Legion489 Rev. 2:19 Banned

    They are set up and ready to go.

    As to minimum wage, back in the 1950s and early 1960s the minimum wage was something like $0.75/$1.25. Lets take that $1.25, that was five silver quarters. Now those same silver quarters are worth (around, depending on what day) $15.50. We don't need to increase the minimum wage, we need to fix the money.
     
  7. mysterymet

    mysterymet Monkey+++

    We need a nice group camping trip somewhere in the middle of the country this summer.
     
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  8. T. Riley

    T. Riley Monkey+++

    @Legion489 there are 2.4 million people in Houston alone. I read about FEMA camps. Where are they, one that could house and feed even one third on that pouplation? There is suppose to be one around Beaumont. I lived around there 20 years, never saw it. The pictures shown as proof are of a State jail for teens, which might house 500. There are 312 million people in this country. FEMA will do well to feed their own employees when the SHTF. They weren't even prepared for Katrina, much less a long term national disaster.
     
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  9. Kingfish

    Kingfish Self Reliant

    I take for granted that everyone here knows to stock things like soap and toilet paper. We have talked about outhouses and burning barrels etc. The many ways to pump water. storage lengths of preps etc. Propane versus gas or diesel , oil and coal versus wood etc. Opsec opsec opsec , Im going have a smoke trail no doubt. If someone gets within a quarter mile they might hear the generator or smell the wood smoke. That is the down side of having preps. That is why we patrol and defend as a rule and every day ,,,not "if " someone comes around. intel on your surroundings is the most important part of any long term survival plan. YOU HAVE TO PATROL out away from your home because almost every house is a death trap if you get caught inside. Even cement blocks are easily shot through with fmj rounds from my AR-15 or any larger round. A .22 rimfire will shoot through my 2 by 4 walls. So I have to engage any adversary OUT AWAY FROM MY AND MY NEIGHBORS HOMES. This why we brought in a couple of trained young men to help who needed somewhere to go if shtf. People need to sleep in shifts stand as sentries in shifts . Watch the road and patrol the woods in shifts to keep the rest of us safe. The children and women have jobs to do as well. They work the gardens and prepare the meals and are also part of the defense plan. My wife for instance is a very good shot with her Tika lite 30-06 rifle or our short barrel 20 gauge pump Shotgun. We have encrypted coms which I got THE IDEA AND A COUPLE OF RADIOS from BT Post. He knows his shit about radios trust me.

    Force multipliers created by my own sick mind are something that anyone trying to invade us is going to really get hurt by without us ever firing a shot. I have several 5 gallon buckets of old 16 and 20 penny spikes they are like 3 to 5 inches long and we know how to use them. Rusty nails will be EVERYWHERE we expect intruders to try and move through. And trust me you cant see them in the dark even with a light. Black powder , steel pipe and lead splitshot make nice directional mines as well. A smart man can build hundreds of force multipliers with legal materials in any workshop in America. I spent many hours learning to build these wicked traps. Bugging in is the Idea that nothing will move me out. Im here to stay, I make my stand here. It is far easier to stockpile the things you need at your home or your BOL . For the guys I have coming here this is bugging out to them. Kind of funny really we did the bug out thing in 2008 when we thought it was hitting the fan. W e left the city and we looked hard for the right place. It took 5 years to get it ready and we are still a work in progress. Still no solar but we have what we need to go 10 years , Maybe longer.
     
  10. ssonb

    ssonb Confederate American

    #2...WATER...but we know that. but my very first priority item is to obtain INFO....you cannot start a plan of action that deals with long term issues unless the crisis is going to be long term. Collect info or dots as I call them, do the cell phones work..no one dot there,power out two dot, TV .local radio out dot three, check CB radio 40 ch then ssb do you hear chatter about the crisis yes or nothing dot 4 dot 5, weather radios,scanners with this you are checking the local sitrep....If the news is not good now I break out the HAM radio now I can get a flavor for the region and most the time further with this I can pick up Radio Australia and other far low band broadcasts.
     
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  11. UncleMorgan

    UncleMorgan I like peeling bananas and (occasionally) people.

    @ kellory: Actually, I think we're both right, but just looking at different ends of the work scale. Down where a person is (for example) setting cabinets in a mobile home factory where muscle is the first tool and a screw gun is the second, adequate training may be a week of having a work-buddy show you the ropes. That worker is highly expendable.

    In the nitroglycerin factory it's an entirely different situation.

    The worker with critical skills is the most valued and least expendable. The guy with ordinary skills is not.

    I guess the obvious conclusion is to pick a job that requires more than just a warm body.
     
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  12. UncleMorgan

    UncleMorgan I like peeling bananas and (occasionally) people.

    @Kingfish: Great post there, and a lot of wise preparations.
     
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  13. Kingfish

    Kingfish Self Reliant

    Our check list is pretty simple. If the power goes out my first test is the grid. I have one of those smart meters so it bilnks on and off (little red light) If that is off ? I go to my main panel and shut off the Breaker to the grid. Then I go to my sub panels. I have two of them both with slide Isolation plates just like my main 220 panel. Now all three breaker panels are Isolated and I hook up the 120 volt Honda generator to my Panel marked Essential circuits. Before starting the Genny I shut off all the breakers to make sure we have no shorted lines or blown appliances . Also do a sniff and visual check of things like coffee makers and other small appliances. If anything is fried I I unplug it and examine the wall socket. I had a Lightning strike here last summer that blew our cable box. Once Im satisfied I start the Honda and fire up the circuits to the freezer and refrigerator. If they both start and run I leave them run. Then it on to the computers and television. If there is television , radio and Internet I know it wasnt an EMP. If however all of the above are down then we go to survival mode and the second list kicks in.

    Now its time to test the cars. If they start Ill be a bit confused and will recheck radio and television . If the cars are dead Ill know it was a pulse and open the garage and try the jeep. It should start as it has no computer in it. Ill make sure its full of Propane and go get the Grand kids and get them here . My wife will hold the fort while Im gone . I will not stop for anyone or anything , my goal is to get the kids before panic happens. This little short hop will also let me see what is going on out there. Once back Ill go around and call together the neighbors and we start the community plan of shutting down access to the lake. Only family and friends on the list come in . As soon as our people are in we start patrols and defense plans. Behind us as we set up our sentries others are building and deploying force multipliers and filling and placing sand bags in key defensive fall back points between the choke and our homes. We will push our perimeter out to the main choke point and hold that position as long as we can. There are three fall back points from there and all will be bagged and ready by the end of the first day. Radios and extra batteries will get charged asap and we will continue to monitor radio and television for any government updates. Ill have everyone in the group do a food and ammo check and see who needs water. For the first few weeks most of the neighbors will have gas powered generators running and will have water. Once they run out of fuel we will be the main source of water for our group. We have enough Propane to pump 1/2 hour per week for 20 years which is why I call our plan a 10 year plan. W e know we will run the main 240 genny more than 1/2 hour per week. Several of the people here will most likely leave as they are Liberals who will go and look for the government. We will let them go but will try and convince them to stay as we don't need people out there telling others where we are. I plan on a central command center at my house as we are in the middle of the group. I have one neighbor with working solar so he gets battery charging duty. There are 7 gardens and 4 of us have small live stock like ducks and chickens. I have rabbits which I will start them breeding asap. We will also have a small group who will go fishing every day. Food should okay for several years before we start needing things like cooking oils and spices. But there is still much to do.

    Then there are all the other disasters. What if Yellowstone blows? what if the economy crashes, ww3? nuke attacks? Ice age , asteroid strike? earthquake? There is theory the the United States could be split right up the Mississippi river valley all the way to Lake Michigan. Disease is another real possibility. If we make it past the initial start we still go to defensive plan. You cant fight an Ice age though . I would have to load everything we could carry and head south. Build the jeep and our truck into mad max vehicles with armor and weapons ports. I try not to think about an Ice age.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 5, 2016
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  14. Altoidfishfins

    Altoidfishfins Monkey+++ Site Supporter+

    You must be a mind reader. Thought about that myself. Just an off-the-cuff idea?
     
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2016
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  15. Altoidfishfins

    Altoidfishfins Monkey+++ Site Supporter+

    Don't think I'd even attempt bugging-in, at least for more than a few days. We have only one neighbor who will talk to us occasionally, and then it's a one-way conversation - he never stops talking.

    Two others will sometimes wave in passing. There's no such thing as mutual support, and no reason to believe that would change if SHTF. The only saving grace to this neighborhood is the fact that we have maybe four FFLs within a half mile or so, which is only a small advantage pre-SHTF.

    I get the strong feeling that if something really bad happened, it would within a week or two deteriorate into a situation of every person for him/herself. Best to keep some food/water on hand and a spare reliable 4wd vehicle full of gas. I'd lay tracks to the BOL where there's shelter, food (which is cycled through such that none of it becomes too old as well as becoming a growing stockpile) a well with a solar pump and most importantly, other property owners with the same mindset - protecting what's ours.

    In SHTF, it's going to be extremely difficult going on your own for any length of time unless your name is Rambo.

    At some point in the not-too-distant future, BOL will change its status to primary residence.
     
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  16. Tikka

    Tikka Monkey+++

    Historically, or a 100 years ago or so, there was plenty of families who lived on their own. They had the skills to do it or died. They lived without much of what we are stockpiling; for the most part because it didn't exist. Maybe I should have said eked out a living without much of anything?
    If one lives in a thinly populated area well off the beaten path; IMO, the less problems from others, one would face.
    We plan on bugging in for short term events; weather, power outages etc. If it would be SHTF, we will load the truck and the wood trailer and go to our campsite in the mountains.. Maybe we will get there and depending on who we run into on the way, maybe not.
     
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  17. Altoidfishfins

    Altoidfishfins Monkey+++ Site Supporter+

    There's a certain factor of luck involved no matter how well you plan.
    But if you don't have a plan, you'll either be a victim or a ward of the government in a FEMA camp. Neither fate is very appealing.
     
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  18. Tikka

    Tikka Monkey+++

    @Altoidfishfins
    As the baseball player Lefty Gomez said "I'd rather be lucky than good." ;)

    As I said, we have 2 plans, we agree with you and same as you we act on them. That being said, as sooner or later they will be exhausted, preps are finite.

    If and when
    SHTF happens, there will be a lot of victims. Some victims will be the unprepared and others will be well prepared.
    Those who want to fight, may get the fight they don't want. IMO, getting far enough away from looters and scavengers, it isn't worth their effort it is a wiser plan. First nothing is close by and second, find us.

    Judging by all the people who are essentially a ward of the government already; they don't need FEMA camps.
     
  19. Kingfish

    Kingfish Self Reliant

    Bugging out to a predetermined place that is stocked and ready is a good plan. Bugging out into the mountains with what you can carry is a fools errand. We left the city in 2008 and bugged out ahead of the 2008 real estate crash . W e put ourselves in a good place to hole up and live. Away from the masses but still close enough to see the kids etc. Not the mountains by any means but on a road that goes no where else. No one heading south is going to walk this road. They will pass by and never know we are there. At least that is the plan. :)
     
  20. DarkLight

    DarkLight Live Long and Prosper - On Hiatus

    I think there's a couple of definitions for going it alone though.

    Going it alone in the wilderness with just your family because you've spent decades building up the ability to do anything and everything you need to do would be definition one.

    Going it alone as in the only prepped person in the neighborhood with no backup and no hope of help from the outside would be definition two.

    I agree with a couple of the other responses as well that luck plays a role and your job is to minimize the impact of luck (good or bad) by prepping. Some things will be completely out of our control though. We can be smart about it and try to stay out of the bad situations but a lightning strike or a tornado at the BOL, or a well concealed band or roving thugs in an ambush on the way, or the flu that turns into pneumonia or any number of things that end up being out of our control could cut survival short.
     
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