So will owning a gun on a 60 Unit Apartment Building Give My Food/Water Long Run Protection?

I'm pretty sure this is the kind of question people in this forum don't like but as an urban dweller in a large city I need to answer. Let's say hypothetically, we're not allowed to leave our premises for whatever horrible event happens. I know in the short run having a gun will likely stop people from invading my apartment and stealing my food and water. The problem is the long run Won't they eventually try to burn me out or overwhelm me so in the end owning the gun will help protect me in the short tun but not the long run. Am I correct? I'm not woke or anti-gun. I also have a balcony on the second floor with a glass sliding door. Appreciate your opinions.

 

I live out extremely rural. Urban living is completely different, I do not know how you would do things urban.

On one day I would think that nobody living in your building is going to 'burn you out' for fear of burning down the entire building, but I have seen things that make it clear urban thugs do not think ahead concerning their own actions.

I have observed looters want foods that they recognize and that are easy to serve. Heat & eat kinds of meals. A 50-pound bag of rutabegas would go unnoticed, because now days very few people know how to cook.

They might recognize a bag of flour, but a bag of wheat would be a mystery to most urban thugs.

 

For the long term as a one man army your assessment is correct. In a dense urban environment you need to be prepared to get mobile. Ideally the other residents in your apartment building are armed and on board, or at least enough of them to be a deterrent. This also assumes you don't have some of them using force to take what they want.

This thread by Ferfal should help to understand what you would be up against: ferFAL Some first hand experience A brief story of Argentina

Also search the site for Selco, who survived Kosovo IIRC.

These are first hand examples of surviving urban warfare/collapse

In general
having guns > not having guns
having more ammo than you need > not having enough ammo
knowing you neighbors > not knowing your neighbors
having a plan > wait and see
having preps > begging others for mercy
having useful and desirable skills (like medical) > being another useless mouth to feed

 

Thank You Great points to consider. The bottm line is as a 1 man Army I would not be able to live indefintiely in my apartment with resources.

 

That's correct. Very few people can go it alone, and those that can are in shape, have skills, and a lot of luck. Get to know thy neighbor and approach the subject from the side. IIRC you are on SoCal, so an opening is general preparedness for an earthquake. Find out who has game and aptitude, but is not a nutcase. Don't talk guns or potential defense until you really get to know them.

Next, your 60 unit complex - does each unit have it's own outside entrance or does it have lobby access? Think about what it would take to defend it or make it a hard target. How many people would it take? What can you do about that sliding glass on your porch? For 60 units you likely have 180 or so occupants. Lots and lots of things to consider.

 

I'm in shape. The problem in Los Angeles is most people are either mrons or don't want to deal with the possibility of survival. My sister & her husband who are a 20 minute walk from me are a prime case. I offered to give them all my food supplies (enough for 2 years for 1 person ecluding water) if they would just burt it in their backtard and I would pay for that too but they don't want to know! The best thing I got from your illuminating reply is, ultimately I am going to have to be mobile to survive and rather than make plans to maintain myself where I am, that won't work in the long term gun or no gun. I appreciate your comments.

 

Basically This:
A Gun will save you ONE time, so unless you also have a plan to Boogie outta there, your chances drop considerably, especially if you only have to brandish, or stupidly fire off a warning shot, so unless you kill and then leave the body to rot ( As a message to others) even that will only buy you a little time, so don't think you can just shoot one and then relax with your feet up and a frying pan full of bacon cooking, and not expect to have trouble return, and in greater numbers! The simple fact is, once you send lead down range, that is a great big signal that A) you have food and or other things others might want, and 2) if you shoot, it means you have something worth killing to protect, both of those things means that whoever comes will come with enough firepower to kill you, or to drive you out! Best thing is to simply not be there, second is not to shoot until someone comes through your door, and third, if you do shoot, plan to boogie fast, your ending might come just as soon as the bad guys hear the shot and figure out where it came from!

Not having a gun makes you a super easy target, if you have no means to resist, let alone defend what's yours, including your life, then your already screwed and you didn't even have the chance to fight!

I would think with the recent events in Los Assholes would have taught you many lessons at just how fast it all can go to shit, and just how alone you will end up in a matter of seconds, and without the means to protect yourself, and willingness to use it, well, your well and truly screwed! If you cannot leave, or you are reticent and refuse to leave, your screwed, if you have no plan to leave, your screwed, and if you do leave, how long can you stay before trouble finds you again? Are you armed ( More then a stupid little .22) and can you actually shoot, and if needed, could you shoot to kill? if you cannot give an honest answer here, it's better then having to answer these questions when faced with the stark reality of the moment! If your plans do not involve buggin out, then you have already lost, the question then becomes how long can you hold out, and if your well armed enough and have enough secure high ground, and can hold it with what you have! Just having a semi auto in a serious caliber like .308 dosn't mean jack squat if the baddies can simple take another stare case up to your level and flank you and then blast you full of holes from behind, or if they can get to high ground near enough to your side of the building to simply send a round through you skull from across the parking lot, or across the complex, and if their good, from nearly a mile, and you never knew it!

 

^ This ^
Suggest you have a place to go and vehicle ready to take you there. By ready I mean packed, fueled, etc., as in you get in and drive away. It should be garaged nearby. It doesn't have to be a lot of money, a original Jeep on frame Cherokee with a straight 6 would be a fantastic option.

Have at least three routs to your destination with alternates for each route. Leave early before the crowd wises up, so go on a hair trigger since yo can always go back on a false alarm. Worst case it's a training exercise.

IMO it's not a case of if in your area it's when.

 

^^^^^^
Bandit and 3M-TA3 gave some good advice ,,
Also , if you've got to bug out during one of them public shit storms you've been having out there ,,don't forget to dress up like they are , so you blend in with them ,, instead of looking like you're running from them .

 

Problem with apartments is one way in and one way out. Paper thin walls and you are only large extension ladder off the ground.
Your best options are, only keep as much as you can carry with you in the apartment plus maybe a 72 hr kit for a natural disaster like earthquake.

and the rest of it should be cached at a BOL or other location further away from the city.

You also didn't mention if you had a car/truck/van. I sure hope you have a vehicle to get the hell out of there BEFORE things turn to shit. If you have to hoof it out. Your odds aren't good. LA is not optimal. It's a 3 day city. after that, all resources are gone there and that is when it's going to go from bad to fecked. A vehicle may offer some more storage in the trunk and under the seats and such.

But staying and trying to protect what you have will probably mean you are going to be a number on the DB line in the bottom of the X.

 

Well hello ED welcome back, Last I heard we had a sailboat for bugging out, Plans have changed?

 

To be a Prepper, you must believe, deep down in your soul, that You and Yours are the most important people on the entire planet! Further, You and Yours must be prepared to do whatever is necessary to ensure your survival! "Whatever is necessary" might include doing things that you can't imagine doing. If you are not prepared to at least kill to defend yourself. others and your means of survival then you are not a Prepper, you are just someone that collected survival supplies and equipment for your killers to use!
That apartment is a deathtrap, be ready to haul ass at a moment's notice!

 

I would concentrate on moving away to somewhere else. I would buy a shotgun and various shells. If SHTF, cities are not where you want to be.

 

no idea about your apartment building - your fellow tenants >>> might be like the Hollyweird movies where they all band together and are like one great family - willing to sacrifice for the others .....

then there's reality >>> where no one gives a royal shit flush - grid down makes the entire building unlivable in a few days - the always present pain-in-azz guy takes the opportunity to rape the woman tenant he always wanted - the other apartment buildings in the same area makes the entire area lost to society ......

short version - wouldn't worry about "other" coming for a raid - doubt you survive your neighbors

 

Best case - you live there. Then you don't risk an ambush on the way.

 

Illini warrior said it all for all survival situations. The big problem is going to be able to survive the government, friends neighbors and RELATIVES. The town cop arrives with a written order signed by a judge from the town council referring to a legal law passed to "redistribute" resources for the good of the community and to prevent hoarding. All of your neighbors think it is a good idea, they are out of food, and are just helping the legal law officers. You have no way other than force to resist and they out number you 20 to 1, they are sure that they are in the right, and you are the criminal. This is before things collapse so the rule of the gun is not a legal defense. Might not happen in an apartment in LA, but the attitude is going to be the same. It isn't the mob of gang bangers that is likely to get most people, it is their neighbors.

Or your son arrives with his wife, two kids, mother and father in law, and tells you that a mob over ran their location and that they had to leave to survive and had to leave behind everything but 3 days food. Their 2 year supply for each is now being eaten by the mob who are complaining and wasting most of it because it is beans and rice and not Mountin House. How do you turn them away, but there isn't enough food to feed them and you?

If you don't get out first, have a secure location with enough reliable people to bug out to, and have a lot of help from God, you aren't going to make it. Even then it might be best to have caches so that you can survive if you have to bug out from the bug out location.

The best you can hope for is to have the luck and help from God to do as I have done. Prep for 50 years and at times bugged out. Cuban missile crisis for one, and never had to use them for real. Love living in the country, have enjoyed my gardens and green house. Shooting is a great hobby and reloading is kind of like a cross words puzzle with real world results that can be seen. Wood heat and alternative power are great when the power fails and Jerry Young, T.O.M, and several other writers are great for both distraction and advice. Make prepping part of your life, let it help make decisions, but lead the best life you can. Hiding in a closet full of supplies isn't a good way to spend your life.

My advice is to get a good bug out location, have your car ready, get out early, and avoid the freeways. Knowledge of the ways to your bug out location are as important as it is. Make friends with and get to know the people at your bug out location as they are going to be just as willing as your neighbors to take your resources for the good of all. You have to be part of a viable group in order to survive.

 

@ED GEiN Glad to see that you are still okay and have weathered the rioting in LA.

I think I would just add a couple of thoughts from my overseas days. Sometimes, I got to live outside the wire in some locations and while a few times I did have houses, most the time it was in apartments so some ideas thoughts from those days:

1. I would always take an apartment on at least the third floor (the best!) but no higher than the fifth. Three floors up is quite a way for an extension ladder. The problem with the 4th or 5th floors is you might have to repel in an emergency. You want to go no higher as standard climbing ropes are 60 meters in length. Don't know how to repel, then stick to the 3rd floor but still get a rope and find a good spot to tie-off so if you can slide down if you need to. Sounds crazy? Yeah, I know but it-is-what-it-is...elevator don't work, fire or bad guys in the stairs... I think you are on the second floor which isn't great as some younger guys would probably chance climbing that freely without a ladder. Might want to consider some sort of alarms (loud ones!) for all your entrance points plus, of course, video camera on the door.

2. Check your outside entrance/exit points for brush or places an intruder could hide, especially at night. Also, check your stairwell because in an emergency your power will most likely be out, so elevator won't work, just make sure you know the danger spots/zones there. Does your stairwell have windows for ambient light or is it fully enclosed so pitch black if no power.

3. Reenforce the door. Sounds stupid but most bad guys will try to force through the front door if you are a couple floors up. Every second they use trying to get through the door gives you more time to react - meaning - to target them or get the hell out via some other way.

Being it's LA, I would definitely have more than one firearm. Why? To give to a neighbor(s) or family member(s) to watch your back, 2, 3 or more sets of eyes are better than one. Also, if possible, I think your firearm should be high capacity (is that even possible in LA?) I mean something like 30 rounds or more like an AR, or if you want something that will match your handgun then a Kuna (think its 30 or 32 of 9mm) or that P90 which @Ura-Ki is always raving about that carries 50 rounds of 5.7 is small and compact. My thought is you want enough to really lay down some suppression to buy you time, a round every couple of seconds, to get the hell out of there.

Anyway, those are my thoughts. You're in a tough spot but if you think ahead, just like you're doing now, and prepare, you've got a chance. Remember, they want the easy pickings and will move on rather than face prepared resistance. However, as things go from bad to worse...well, you better be gone by then.

 

@ED GEiN THIS is critical, but to be part of a viable group you have to make a contribution that makes you worth your keep. What can YOU bring to the table? You need a primary skill like medic, food grower, construction, knowledge of sanitation systems and water purification, etc., with a secondary skill as a trigger man (like everyone else). If you don't contribute when your supplies are gone likely so are you. IMO medical knowledge is the big ticket that will get you accepted anywhere along with the knowledge of making of finding medical supplies once the ones you bring are depleted.

Start with First Aid including the ability to lay a few stitches. Lear about wound care - it is an art all to itself that few consider. We mostly think in terms of stabilizing the wounded, but there will likely be no ambulances, clinics, or hospitals. How to get the wounded healed and back to being productive is ESSENTIAL to long term survival. Not all wounds will be from gunshot, so learn how to set and stabilize breaks, how to make a splint and longer term how to make casts. More soldiers died in the Civil War from dysentery than from gun shot so learn about sanitation and sourcing and purifying water (hint - check out the resources section of SM).

While being a "trigger man" won't be your primary skill you still need to embrace that role. You need to bring your arms with you since they won't exactly be handing them out. Same with ammo, bring whatever you can. You need a pistol (semi auto), a rifle (suggest an AR though you will need a sucky CA model), and consider adding a 12 gauge shotgun. Your pistol needs a holster and your rifle needs a sling.

Basic rule: If you bring more to the table than you take you will be accepted and likewise taken care of. If you bring less to the table than you take you will be an expendable resource. Harsh, but true.

 

How long can you endure while everything is falling apart around you.
During the1929 crash the population was fraction of what it is today.
Most if not all stores had stock in the back. Now days the process is "Just in Time" meaning if there's none on the shelf there is none in the store. When it came to wild life all the deer were gone in short order. During the recovery deer were brought from Europe to repopulate the species. Let that sink in.
Anxious people will be shooting anything that moves for food.
Enemies will be doing the same as well. foreign and domestic.
A well-disciplined group has a better chance than an individual. Everyone is organized into their necessary responsibilities. Anyone with a drug or alcohol problem, WOKE, or skill-less is completely expendable/liability.
The time to start gaining skills was 10 years ago, so you've got a lot of catching to do.

 

You nailed it as far as i am concerned.
In 60 apartment complex...think how bad the stench will be in 3 days with no water...diseases...