Okay, I've been trying to figure out if there is any major differences between a 30-30 and the 30-06. I know different round loads affect the range and trajectory, though that's about all I know. I am thinking of buying one or the other and would like input on which is recommended. If there's no real difference, slap me silly though don't call me suzy. Haha. Or should I skip both and go for the .308? I'm thinking of a bugout rifle. I'm also looking into the breakdown aspect. Can it be broken down with no muss for walking through urban settings. And not counting the above, I have compiled a list of weapons that are on my wish list. Here they are: Yugoslavian SKS Remington 870 Tactical Shotgun Serbu Super Shorty 9 12ga Bushmaster 6.8mm A3 HK USP Compact 9mm Browning A-bolt Composite Stalker 270 S&W 1911DK 45ACP Ithaca M37 12 CZ 750 S1 M1 That's it for now. Haha.
.30-30 and .30-06 compare kinda like a volkswagon beetle to a GTO: though they are both .30 bullets, that's about where the similarity ends. The .30-30 is designed for a lever-action, tubular magazine rifle and is pretty much limited in the type of bullet it will be available in (blunt nosed), whereas the .30-06 has a large variety of bullet types available, not to mention nearly twice the range of ballistic performances. The .30-30 was designed as a medium game hunting round and the .30-06 was designed as a military round that hunters discovered and improved upon. Go for the .308; it duplicates the ballistic range of the .30-06 for all practical purposes, is a readily available cartridge (7.62 NATO will shoot in a .308), and takes up close to 20% less space and weight that the .30-06.
Sea's right go with the 308 . 06 is a wonderfull round I own two bolt guns for hunting in it but for a fighting weapon I bought a semi auto 308 . If you're on a budget consider a Saiga for under $400 http://www.stanleysproshop.com/Rifles-c85-p85.html?&Customer_id=199814&st3=EDELC662205204& If you have lots of money to burn go with a Springfield M1A for $1500+ .
Agree with both the above, with the added note that there are now pointy bullets available that can be used in tubular magazines. I'll say they are Hornady, but don't hold my toes to the fire on that. Polymer tipped to improve the BC significantly.
Hornady and Marlin teamed up to improve the 30-30 as well as the 45-70, the carts are called Lever Evolution. They even came out with a 308 version and the ballistics are WAY impressive. And I am a Lever Rifle fan, so I'm lovin it. With that said, the traditional 308 or 30-06 is still a better choice for what you want. Here's the link to the 308 express http://www.hornady.com/story.php?s=481
ghrit and Blackjack are correct in that the new Hornady rounds are suppose to improve downrange performance of the 30-30 as well as the new Marlin 308 round in their new XTR lever rifle . The bad news is Hornady has no intentions of letting loose of the bullets or the powder specifically designed for these two rounds so they are a factory ammo only deal which for a hunting weapon in normal times may not be a big deal . In a SHTF survival situation would you want to have to be scrounging around looking for what amounts to a very much "Specialty load" that may not catch on with hunters and be discontinued in a couple of years . The powder for these two rounds is designed to not produce excessive pressure and change the pressure curve so as not to develope unsafe pressures in a lever action or so I have read in the gun rags . Of course your 30-30 can still be used with standard ammo and you could load the 308 Marlin with flat bullets but you wouldn't be getting the same performance you had been use to when using the pointed soft points from the factory . If you want a lever gun in a fighting caliber a Browning BLR in 308 would be your best choice .
Thanks for the information guys. I am thinking of going with the Saiga. Seems like it would be a good rifle. Certainly not the best, though good enough to do some spot shooting with. Now I just have to find a nice scope for it and think about night vision if at all possible. Wish there was a duel night and day scope. That would be cool.
The above descriptions are on the money but will add a bit. The 30-30 while not a good choice for hunting bear or for long range shooting (over 200 yards) it is more than adequate out to 150-200 yards for deer or men and was IIRC the cal used by most cavaly in the west. If you are looking for something for long range, extreamly large dangerous animals, and/or massive penetration then the 30-06 or 308 would be better. If the abilities of the 30-30 would do for you though then it is a lighter weight and smaller round to carry (same size projectile though). Also, if the 30-30 fits the bill then that SKS should do fine as well since it fires the 7.62 x 39 cartridge which is about the same balisticaly as the 30-30, the ammo can be had cheap (compared to the others) and the SKS is a good solid and reliable rifle. Liveing in Komifornia however you may run into some troubles with getting/haveing one and would have to find out if there is still alegal configuration of it there.
That's one of the biggest hurdles. I don't have a kommifornia konnection. Haha. I think they are going to outlaw spitwad shooters next. Friggin' idiots might as well just become the overseas extension to the ruskies. I have a telephone book for the area and in it, it being really thick, there is maybe one place that even deals in firearms and that is a pawn shop. I don't even know where I would go to buy a weapon around here. Might have to cross the bay into Oakland or go further south. San Fran is no friggin' fun for a firearm enthusiast. Got to go a long ways to find one and then you have to make sure that it is legal. No fun I tell ya. I remember living where if I wanted to get a rifle, I'd either go to the 5 or 6 pawn shops in the area, to Wally World or to the handful of gunsmiths. That is back home though and as soon as I can, I'm heading back. Gotta try to get a transfer though. Hope I can. Kommifornia is seriously a demanding place on your mental health.
Kalifornia legal assault weapon: http://www.instructables.com/id/E0CW2Q49SAEPORT5QF/?ALLSTEPS You poor bastards...
Funny one... I was thinkin maybe the potato cannon, but then that does have an explosion taking place, and we wouldn't want that.
At least our enemies won't have earwax buildup. Hahaha. Sad but true that most weapons are outlawed here in good ol' kommifornia. I don't know how some other CA people have what they have. It just boggles my mind. I guess I'm looking in the wrong places.
Hopefully if the world goes to pot, it will be in the next four to five months. I'll be real close to home. Going to be having some fun at Sand Hill. I will head home as soon as I can. I have never been in such a gun-unfriendly state in all my life. Every day is something new. Sailors that have been around the world and back usually use that expression, 'Nothin' surprises me'. Well I can tell ya, they never came to San Fran. Out here, no matter what you do to make something more 'Idiot Proof', they make a better idiot. I give credit where it's due and it has some nice places to see, though I don't know why in the world I ever came here. Though I think it was in my destiny to do so. For what reasons I am unclear, though you can bet it's in the master plan. Maybe it's for me to learn what a world should not be like. Haha.
When it comes to long term survival one solid fact is that one set of reloading supplies whill handle all three 30-06, 308, and 30-30 and with the readly available Lee loaders and firing the reload ammo only in the gun that shot it, they work very well for less than the maximum load. I have seen the used Lees for $10 in 30-06, $2.39 per hundred for primers, $32 for a pound of powder that will load hundreds of rounds and about $30 for a couple hundred rounds of .308 bullets that will fit all three. Nice cache stuff and good for many years storage.
I am all for a .308 or a .30-06' over the 30-30. However, when $ comes into play you sure can pick up the lever action 30-30's a lot cheaper. I bought a used Marlin 30-30 with a scope for $150 about four or five years ago. There are a lot of them around, they can be broken down easily, reassembled quick, and are short nice little carbines that swing into action quickly. I wouldn't want to get into a distance shooting competition with someone with a bolt action, but the lever can be manipulated pretty quickly for a faster rate of fire than most bolt actions. If money isn't a problem, buy one of each. Shop the pawn shops, you will run into a deal every great now and then.
I'm sorry tailor, I'm not sure anyone truly answered your original question. Here are the differences: .....................................muzzle ..........200yd..... 300yd load .............................vel/energy ....vel/energy ..drop/in 30-30 150gr. round nose ..2390/1902 ....1581/832 ......30 30-30 160gr. Evolution ....2400/2046 .....1916/1304 ....12 30-06 150gr. .................2910/2820 ....2395/1911 ....8 30-06 165gr. .................2800/2872 ....2403/2115 ....8 30-06 180gr. .................2700/2923 ....2337/2182 ....8.5 As you can see, the 30-06 shoots considerably not only flies faster and flatter, but hits a lot harder, especially after a couple hundred yards. You wouldn't want to have to fight using a 30-30 past 150 to 200 yards at most. The 06 is still whoopin butt at another hundred plus yards past that. Also, you'll only find 30-30 in lever actions, no "evil" looking black autos here, so rate of fire is a consideration too. Older Remington 742 autos in 30-06 or 308 can be found for 300 bucks or so. http://www.gunsamerica.com/guns/976815169.htm Whew! took a while to post that.
Okay, I think I have a plan. I'll try and get a 30-30, 30-06 and a .308 along with the reloading stuff and keep it cached at my destination though keep the 30-30 as it can be easily broken down and carried. The 30-06 can be used for good long distance and the .308 is better for sniping. Sounds like a plan I could put into action. Thanks for all the advice, I find it very helpful.
Actually, Tailor..... I'd probably simplify things and drop the 30-06 altogether. Just about any rifle that is made in 06 is also in 308, and ballistically they are very close. Both great at long ranges, lots of penetration, accurate. 308 will also be easier to find post shtf as it's the same thing as the 7.62 NATO ammo. For SHTF purposes, having both is just kinda redundant imho. Those same rifles that can be found cheap in 06 were also made in 308. In fact, a brand new Remington 7400 can be had for $550 in either caliber. Here's one in 308 w/ scope for 550. http://www.gunsamerica.com/guns/976798064.htm I've seen where you can get 10rd. mags for them too. With that said, I like your plan. Easily broken down and transported 30-30 lever for the bugout and a 308 for the destination. I'd check out the "evolution" ammo for the 30-30. It's more expensive than the bulk stuff, but the ballistics rock!
Thanks Blackjack. See, I like bouncing ideas around and seeing new POVs. This community rocks. Sure as shootin'. Yes, the breakdown is a good thing if you are walking too close to sheeple, LEOs, military, UN, or any other various alphabet orgs in a SHTF situation. They may get a nervous trigger with you toting. Though to have one that is easily put back together will help if you need one where a handgun just won't do. Another thing, can someone explain to me about scopes? Blackjack that rifle that you posted about is very nice. I'd like to own it. Just have no idea about the scope tech. It says that the scope is 3-9x40. What does that mean? I know open sights. Scopes, binocs and range finders are a different deal though. Anyone clear this up? See, I'm learnin' already. Can't learn the answer to a question that you don't ask. Haha.
