.308 carbine barrel length?

Discussion in 'Firearms' started by AxesAreBetter, Jun 6, 2017.


  1. AxesAreBetter

    AxesAreBetter Monkey+++

    Since we have been having a lot of gun talk, at what length does a .308 barrel become too short for you?
     
  2. 3M-TA3

    3M-TA3 Cold Wet Monkey Site Supporter++

    Anything under 16" is too short for me. If I need shorter I want a different cartridge.
     
  3. Altoidfishfins

    Altoidfishfins Monkey+++ Site Supporter+

    I had a 16" DPMS (AR10 flavor).
    In my opinion, too much velocity loss. Factory loaded 150 gr Federal Am Eagle clocked between 2500 and 2550. Clocked about the same for Winchester commercial hunting loads. Would have preferred a 20" medium weight barrel.
    Just my [2c].
    It was basically a semi-auto .30-30 that fired spitzers instead of flat points.
     
  4. Andy the Aussie

    Andy the Aussie Monkey+++ Founding Member

    Yep, 17.5/18inches is about as short as I would go the FAL "para" and "bush" rifles are a nice compromise to the standard length. There is a reason to carry a 7.62 rifle and it is mostly best served from something with a little more tube. My most used hunting rifle wears a 21inch barrel (I was going to go with 20 but changed my mind as it was going inbthe lathe). That length with my handloads is giving me @2590fps with 165gn projectiles.
     
  5. Ura-Ki

    Ura-Ki Grudge Monkey

    Keep in mind that most manufactures specify a 21 inch barrel as standard for max projectile speed, so any thing shorter is going to give up some of that speed, and by extension, Energy! How much depends on the load and and the twist rate and type of rifling. In my mind, the whole reason for having a full power round is range and hitting power advantages over the smaller carbines, so having a compromise in that cal, I would keep at 17 1/2 inches or longer! Differing platforms Say a G-3 VS an FAL will show almost 100 FPS advantage for the FAL just because of the action type while using the same barrel specs and ammo, a M-1A having a slight advantage over the FAL of about 40 fps because of the rifling type, again all else being equal. My bolt action .308 with R-5 Rifling in a 24 inch barrel has almost a 150 fps advantage over the G-3 with the exact same ammo, and because of barrel length almost a 500 yard advantage in effective accurate range!
     
    M118LR, Sgt Nambu, sec_monkey and 3 others like this.
  6. BTPost

    BTPost Stumpy Old Fart Snow Monkey Moderator

    The thing you MUST understand... Barrel Length does more that impact Projectile Velocity, and Energy... Matching a Loading to Barrel Length, is a critical part of the Ballistics of ANY FireArm.... If you are using a Factory Loading in a short Barrel, likely all the Powder hasn't burnt by the time the Projectile leaves the muzzle... Then you get a Muzzle Flash... The shorter the Barrel, the BIGGER the Flash, less Projectile Velocity, and Energy, and the more wasted Power, per round.... Consequently, if you are shooting Factory Loads in a Longer Barrel (Say 26") You are getting Maximum Projectile Velocity, and Energy, for that Loading, minus the losses, due to friction between the Projectile, and the Barrel, once the has Powder ceased imparting energy to the Projectile, but before it leaves the Muzzle.... The "Ideal" is to have the Powder just Finishing burning, as the Projectile, leaves the Muzzle.... Usually, somewhere near that point one finds the "Sweet Spot" for that Barrel/Projectile Loading, that Maximizes Projectile Velocity, Energy, and Accuracy.... Any Factory Loading is a compromise that does it's best for the average Barrel Length...
     
  7. oil pan 4

    oil pan 4 Monkey+++

    Anything that requires a tax stamp is too short.
     
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  8. Ura-Ki

    Ura-Ki Grudge Monkey

    And lets not forget, .308 gets might loud with short barrels, and the flash gets pretty hard for flash hiders to dampen!
     
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  9. VisuTrac

    VisuTrac Ваша мать носит военные ботинки Site Supporter+++

    Is it worse than a Mosin-Nagant M44
    [​IMG]
     
  10. BTPost

    BTPost Stumpy Old Fart Snow Monkey Moderator

    If you would tailor the Loading, to the Barrel, instead of wasting all that extra Powder in producing that BIG Flash, you be be much better off, with negligible loss in Projectile Velocity or Energy....
     
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  11. VisuTrac

    VisuTrac Ваша мать носит военные ботинки Site Supporter+++

    Yeah, this guy even chopped off an extra inch off the already too short carbine. Shooting spam can surplus that was designed for the rifle with 8 additional inches of barrel .. and you get this! So if you can't hit the target, you can either blind it .. or if close enough, burn it with the ruskie club.!
     
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  12. Merkun

    Merkun furious dreamer

    Bulgi milsurp is worse than that flash, I have half a spam can left. Milsurp is hard to tailor --
     
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  13. BTPost

    BTPost Stumpy Old Fart Snow Monkey Moderator

    Naw just pull the Projectiles and re measure the Powder... Easy Piesy....
     
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  14. Merkun

    Merkun furious dreamer

    More fun to start fires in the grass from shooting prone ---
     
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  15. BTPost

    BTPost Stumpy Old Fart Snow Monkey Moderator

    Only if you can put them out... otherwise, it is a disaster....
     
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  16. Sgt Nambu

    Sgt Nambu RIP 4/19/2018

    I have an old Winchester M-100 carbine in .308. It sports a 19" barrel, and that's short enough for me! It is loud and at twilight, it's got a pretty good muzzle flash! :D
     
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  17. Seacowboys

    Seacowboys Senior Member Founding Member

    I have a Remington 660 in .308, think the barrel is 18" and it is painful to shoot.
     
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  18. M118LR

    M118LR Caution: Does not play well with others.

    So your at it again AX?
    Okay, I'll bite.
    Barrel length on the .308 Win is determined by the task that needs to be performed.
    (ie) Sport Game Hunting. The standard 16 inch min will allow you to take most any North American game animals out to 300 yards.) I'm happy with the 18 inch barrel on the Old Model 7, but the 20 inch on the Old Model 70 ain't much more to drag around.
    But once you get to Long Distance Shooting 22 inches is the min that efficiently takes the M118 to the 1K Target. (it's like it was designed that way. LOL) Remington came out with a 24 inch 5R (The Milspec Model) that I'm particularly found of, and Big Green was using a 26 inch 5R (M24) until it replaced with the 300 Win Mag in the M2010. Now when Smith revamped the M14, the cryogenic 18 inch was all the rage. But just like the Mexican Match ammo, 18 inches and 168 grains ain't gonna get you past 800 Meters, but 180 grains of PSP out of 18 inches is gonna let you eat any North American critter with hooves at extended range.
    So if it's CQB, min barrel length.
    If it's Sport Hunting, about 18 inches.
    If it's Professional work, no less than 22 inches.
    Guess that didn't solve much? LOL
     
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  19. AxesAreBetter

    AxesAreBetter Monkey+++

    No, it's all good info. Local opinion is...split, between "well, it's a gun ain't it" and "nothing less than maximum performance money dump tactical wheelbarrow gun will hunt at 50 yards". Figured I'd get some more enlightened opinions.

    "At it again"...

    And what of it? Haha. Got a lot of things on my mind for a lot of reasons. Haha.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 7, 2017
    M118LR likes this.
  20. M118LR

    M118LR Caution: Does not play well with others.

    Grab that spoon handle and stir away, I'll do my best to contribute Honestly until the Local's determine that "Folks of my kind ain't wanted anymore!" Somehow, the experiences of a Survivalist seem to clash with the concepts of Peppers, but this is "The Survival Monkey"! So if I step on the toes of folks with thousands of days of preparations ?, and explain that all those things are nice to have, but they can be taken away with one well placed shot from someone along way away with a .308. It ain't personal, it's Professional. At 1K yards, I either have to learn lip reading or just determine how valuable you are to my clan???????? So the basic premise of Survivalist vs Preparedness is placed within the hands of someone that the Government has spared no expense to train. Just how much of OUR taxpayer dollars are you willing to admit that Government Training is worth? (PS. and at what distance?) Now, who is giving that Government Trained Operative the order to "Fire" once they have passed beyond the Military chain of command?

    BEWARE THE VOICES IN MY WIFE'S HEAD! JMHO.
     
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