A Better Way To Defend Your Home Against Armed Intruders!

Discussion in 'Firearms' started by Lone Gunman, Mar 14, 2017.

  1. Lone Gunman

    Lone Gunman Draw Varmint!

    Well, the snow outside is coming down ‘in buckets’; and it looks like we’re going to be snowed-in, here on top of the mountain, for the next several days. There’s already a good foot to a foot and a half on top of the cars; and the front steps and walkway have, all but, disappeared under a heavy coating of the wet white stuff! (The large plow-trucks are having trouble climbing the road; and one of them has already slid off into a drainage ditch where one of his buddies is going to have to chain up and pull him out.)

    All in all it’s a good day to think about home security and go over some of the rather unique security adaptations we’ve adopted in years past. Back in 1990 my wife and I survived a rather intense (and totally unexpected) home invasion event. Bright and early that Sunday morning none of the usual home safety precautions applied.

    I was only 3 days out of the hospital and on crutches for the next couple of months. My wife had been watering the vines on the front porch; and the front door was unlocked. Me? I was in the middle of the living room, hobbling over to my La-Z-Boy recliner when, all of a sudden, the front door opened wide and in walks one of the largest and most filthy dirty dudes or ‘dudettes’ I had ever seen.

    (Because ‘he’ looked like a real bad case of, among other things, frustrated sexual confusion. I don’t know quite ‘Why’; but these people always remind me of some sort of fish; and I can never really tell exactly what piscine sex they either are or would really like to be?)

    Yesterday evening, just as it was starting to snow, my wife mentioned that she had left the snowblower out on the porch; and she wanted to know if I thought anyone could see it there and come in off the road to steal it? I laughed and replied that we could, both, be dead in here for a week before anyone found us; so, the snowblower would, probably, be safe. She thought about it for a moment, and agreed.

    She, then, reminded me of our home invasion experience (That neither one of us had ever, so much as, dreamed could happen; but …… it DID!) and how if it weren’t for our two superlatively well-trained Bulldogs she didn’t think either one of us would have survived! She’s probably right, too!

    Both large AND small dogs do make for excellent (non:electronic) burglar alarms, as well as fearless and unhesitating home defenders; and, that morning, our Pit Bulls certainly proved their worth! Without those two Bulldogs I think she and I would have definitely been ‘checking out’ early.

    The small dogs are quite useful for raising an alarm; something that the larger ‘catch dogs’ are always curiously reluctant to do. It’s the big dogs, though, that are needed to take care of the problem AFTER it has arrived.

    For almost 40 years my hobby was breeding and training large: guard, search and rescue, and attack dogs. (I’ve owned some superlative canines, too!) Power can go out, equipment can either fail, be cross-wired, or mechanically fooled, too. Personally I do not think any home defense system is complete without a combination of one large and one small dog inside the home. This home security method was, for many years, our first line of home self-defense; and, voilà, it worked very well for everybody except that burglar!

    With us the dogs always came first, and individual self-defense equipment has always come second; however, at our house I like to think that, over the years, we’ve developed the best of both approaches. Each of us owns and knows how to use our (awesome) ‘black rifles’ — which are, as far as I’m concerned, the finest home self-defense weapons ever invented! At our house armed self-defense is NOT an individual task. Instead, my wife and I have learned how to work together as a single cooperative unit.

    Me? I never play the ‘lone wolf’ and attempt to do silly things like run around the house with a gun and light in hand. That’s about as foolish a thing to do as, say, standing at the top of the stairs and loudly racking a round into the chamber. (Which, if the other guy is also armed and knows what he’s doing, is sure — SURE — to get an ingenuous shotgun-toting homeowner promptly killed on-the-spot.)

    Just like the National Rifle Association (correctly) teaches, we use a ‘safe room’ home defense technique. We work together; and neither one of us would ever walk around the house in the dark looking for whatever might be ‘going bump’ in the night. With the possible exception of animal hunting (Animals don’t shoot back, right!) I have never attached a light to my gun; and, for a fact, I know that I never will. Why? Because, most of the time, I’m a lone (or stand-alone) gunman; and I need my muzzle to be able to point in one direction while my forward-held light is pointing in another.

    When it comes to safe room self-defense I teach the standard home course, literally, ‘by the book’; but, privately, I tell my friends that the best way to use a light in self-defense is to always have somebody else work the light for you. Although I’m sure that I’ll be dead and long gone before the general public finally ‘gets the message’ the only self-defense people who should ever affix a light to their guns are SUPPORTED — NOT UNSUPPORTED — shooters. (Not in my lifetime, though, right!)

    Anyone who might enter our home at night and attempts to breach our safe room is going to get lit up; that’s for sure; BUT, the light will be coming from one direction while the gunfire will be coming from another!

    Now, before anyone starts firing inside a home, the safest and most advantageous LINES AND ANGLES OF GUNFIRE must be known; and, in addition to knowing your best lines and angles of gunfire, the principal engagement points around the home should also be carefully preselected.

    (Hint: stairs, hallways, and doors are the first places that need to be considered and mapped out. Some of my own personal favorites? I like to lie down at the back of a hallway and watch the top of the stairs for the first head to appear. I, also, like to stand behind open-backed stairs to wait for the first intruder to come down. Stairways are, then, the most dangerous contact points inside any dwelling.)

    Hallways and doorways are, about, equally dangerous and need to be traversed as quickly as possible. In this regard there is one hard fast rule to which I know of no exceptions: (Ready?)


    This tactic applies equally well to: large groups, small groups, and individual combatants. Hence, the strong advantage to using a safe room, rather than stalking around in the dark looking for an intruder (or intruders). What’s the best way to defend any non:hardened room? First, once the fight is on, remember that sheetrock doesn’t stop bullets; and, second, stay out of the corners.

    Personally, I like to be somewhere close to the middle of the room; ideally as one of several different pieces of furniture; one of which will be me, hunkered on down, and looking straight at the middle of the doorway! (Applegate used to recommend that the best place for a room defender to position himself against a breaching attack force is smack-dab in the middle of the room while lying across the top of a table!)

    Another home self-defense technique (Perhaps my personal favorite!) I like is to exit the home the moment an intruder enters. (Getting out through either a window, or a door doesn’t matter.) One fellow I know realized that he was about to face multiple assailants; so he slipped out a side window and waited to engage the intruders as they attempted to leave his home. He made it; but they didn’t.

    Now, let’s talk about self-defense equipment: Every nighttime bedroom should contain a: cell phone, firearm, set of house and car keys, and high-intensity flashlight. What question do I hear and see all of the time, especially on internet gun forums? (You probably already know!) (1) ‘What gun should I keep by the side of my bed?’ There are, also, several ancillary questions: (2) ‘Should I keep an extra reload with my bedside gun?’ Then there’s my own personal all time favorite IGF question, (3) ‘Should I keep a round chambered in my semiautomatic pistol while I’m sleeping?

    My own answer to Question #1? 'Yes, you should keep a firearm with which you are, both, well practiced AND familiar by your bedside.' Are there any caveats? Yes, there are! If there are children or elderly (not quite or mostly ‘non compos mentis’) people in the home then all firearms should be kept unloaded, and locked up in either a gun safe, or high-security lockbox.

    Generally speaking: Shotguns are also a very poor choice for home self-defense. Shotguns are not practical for either precision fire and/or hostage situations. Shotguns are remarkably capable of doing a lot of structural damage, too; and, while shotguns are certainly ‘killers’, I remain in complete agreement with Jim Cirillo that, most likely because of imprecise shot patterns, shotguns can too often be really anemic ‘stoppers’.

    Neither are small caliber pistols ideally suited for home self-defense; and I do NOT care that the American public is currently in the midst of a torrid love affair with small pistols. Like shotguns small pistols ARE also ‘killers’; but they are NOT rapid ‘stoppers’; and rapid stopping is what every home self-defense scenario is ultimately all about. (The fact that an attacker might die an hour later in the hospital isn’t going to do a home self-defender any good in ‘real time’, right here, or right now — Understand!

    On Question #2 the correct answer is, I would hope, obvious. ‘Yes, you should!’ With a revolver: five, six, or seven rounds might not be enough; and with a semi-auto: It’s feeding malfunctions that are the principal reason ‘Why’ an extra magazine should always be kept with the gun. (With many high-capacity pistols extra ammo is simply an additional plus that’s nice to have.)

    Common question #3? The correct answer is an emphatic, ‘No, you should not!’ I know of, at least, six people who have shot themselves with an assortment of different bedside semi-autos; and, in general, (because there are a few exceptions) nobody should attempt to: wake up, grab a pistol, and perform competently with it ALL at the same time — OK! (Sorry, Glockeroos!)

    Finally a few words about caliber and that great bugaboo of home self-defense scenarios: Bullet penetration. (Which, although it shouldn’t be, is often referred to as ‘over penetration’.)

    Let’s get this straight: ALL bullets penetrate, ALL of them! ALL bullets are, also, 100% capable of ‘over penetration’ too. ‘Why?’ Because the expression ‘over penetration’ is too often used as a catchphrase for just plain, good old fashioned, piss-poor marksmanship; and, in my personal (carefully considered) opinion, it’s naïve to think of fired bullets in any other way.

    THIS is the reason ‘Why’ Jeff Cooper’s Fourth Firearm Safety Rule (@ Post #9) is so important; and every home self-defender should always be extra careful to predetermine each of his open and available LINES AND ANGLES of fire. (You can’t always do it, OK; but when these lines and angles are available they should be used.)

    What follows is an article by ‘Jeremiah Johnson’ someone whose self-defense opinions I have learned to respect. Before closing this out I’m including it here because, after a long lifetime of doing these things, I am not personally aware of a better answer; so I might as well let ‘J.J.’ say the rest of THIS for me.

    Remember, when it comes to home self-defense: ‘Tactical carbines’ are superior to both rifles and shotguns. Rifles (If you've got the maneuvering room to use them.) are superior to all handguns; and all self-defense handguns should be either 9 x 19mm, or 45 ACP and capable of holding, at least, a bare minimum of 10 rounds.
    Last edited: Mar 14, 2017
  2. GOG

    GOG Free American Monkey

    Excellent, thanks.
    Aeason and Sgt Nambu like this.
  3. Oltymer

    Oltymer Monkey++

    I'm definitely on board about using the light - I'm over here, yeah, right here...
  4. Trouble

    Trouble Monkey

    Thanks for that write up. But now I have some questions. I know you advocate using a safe room but if you were to clear the house is there any special way you'd go through doors or around tight corners with a rife or shotgun? And I assume the light only comes on when you're about to fire, but does the light 'override' the muzzle flash? Or is it just something to practice so you're use to it in the dark?
    Aeason likes this.
  5. Brokor

    Brokor Live Free or Cry Moderator Site Supporter+++ Founding Member

    If you're alone:

    Mix magnesium powder and potassium nitrate in equal amounts, fill into the cardboard of toilet paper roll, cut to size, duct tape outside with fuse inserted. Flash bang grenade.

    This is for post apocalyptic scenarios and educational purposes only. If you attempt to do this within the borders of police state America, you risk certain death and execution from the corpolitical gestapo, or at the very least some broken windows and a possible house fire. Also note, you're supposed to throw it, not hold onto it.

    Yes, this is illegal without licensing. Do not try this under normal societal living parameters. Ever.
  6. Lone Gunman

    Lone Gunman Draw Varmint!

    'Back in the day' it would have been my Bulldogs that led the way. Nowadays, though, it would have to be just little ol' me; and I can't say that I'd enjoy the task because this would be an extremely dangerous thing to have to do — especially with a full-sized rifle! I’ll offer you three suggestions; but none of them are foolproof:

    (1) Just like when still-hunting you MUST be extra patient, and move very softly and very slowly. Not everybody can do this; but, for someone who has spent a lot of time in the woods, I would suggest

    (2) USING YOUR EARS as much as your eyes. I’ve been doing things like this for all of my long life; and I KNOW that very few prey animals or people will remain completely silent and/or anchored-in-place for longer than 3 or 4 minutes — So

    (3) Teach yourself to stay put and wait for an intruder in the same way that you would still-hunt for a nervous doe!

    I'm a Home Firearms Safety Instructor; and it would be highly remiss for me to even suggest that you should not use your light in order to clearly identify your intended target BEFORE you fire. Navy SEALS might do things like this; Glockeroos might do it, too; but you and I should NOT! I've had this same conversation many times with people who do things like this for a living. Lone survivors, to a man, have all told me that, once upon a time, they used to attach their tac lights to their pistols; but one, subsequent, unsupported operator event or another eventually cured them of this 'bad habit'.

    Every one of them still used a light during searches in dimly lit areas; but that light was always handheld OUT IN FRONT OF AND SLIGHTLY AWAY FROM their bodies. (One form or another of an FBI extended flashlight hold.) You're right that I wouldn't turn on a light until just before I was ready to fire; but, again, I'm almost always an unsupported shooter; and many years of outdoor sports have taught me how to protect my night vision and rely on my senses while I'm in the dark. So, again, clearing a darken home is very similar to still-hunting.

    I've also done a lot of nighttime shooting with modern handguns and ammunition. With many of today's cartridge powders there's either no flash, very little, or only random muzzle flash. It's never been a problem for me. I'm able to 'look' right through it; and, so far, I've yet to lose a sight picture.

    As for firing a rifle at night: Quite honestly I haven't done anything like this in a very long time; and the best I can tell you is that critters moving around at dusk have always shown up very clearly in my high quality rifle scopes; but, even though, I remember seeing muzzle flash in my scope, I don't remember ever being blinded by it. (I always used either 308 Win. or 30-06 Springfield rifles; and, after the first shot, the muzzle would be rising up and above the flash; so I very well might not have seen all there was to see.)

    With this in mind I might not be the best person for you to ask this question. I will add this, though: If I were in any such situation I think I'd prefer to be working from outside rather than from inside the home. I like outside the windows and wall techniques; I know one man who has used this method quite successfully; and he told me that, even when he couldn't actually see them, it was his ears that kept him informed to where the intruders were inside his home; and he was able to follow them by listening through the wall as they moved from room to room.
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2017
  7. Bandit99

    Bandit99 Monkey+++ Site Supporter+

    @Lone Gunman Excellent post! Really got me looking at our plan and I was pleased to see that even using your guideline it actually is quite good.

    So, I am following all the rest of your advice except the dog part and reading your post has convinced me that we indeed need to get one and since we live in the country there really isn't any reason not to do so.

    It sounds like you are a proponent of a carbine that uses the 9mm or .45? I recently shot a Sig MPX but wouldn't even consider it unless it had some sort of shoulder stock, couldn't hit crap without it, but to put a stock on it one would then need to get paperwork from the all powerful BATF which is not a show stopper, just saying... I do like the idea and it would increase my wife's accuracy immediately...the more I think of this the more I like it. But, what to get?

    1. But, you left us hanging about the intruder! How did it play out - exactly? I like to learn not only from my own experiences but everyone's experiences. EDIT: Changed wording here as far as I could see you didn't make any mistakes except maybe leaving door unlocked...which we all do at times. The 'it' just showed up.
    2. Dog recommendations?
    Last edited: Mar 14, 2017
  8. Lone Gunman

    Lone Gunman Draw Varmint!

    Thank you! For whatever it’s worth, a great many families I know who live, somewhat, ‘off the beaten path’, but still in very nice houses, own dogs. In fact I expect to see dogs whenever I go to one of their homes.

    The only reminder I’ll offer is that when you take on the responsibility of dog ownership, it’s really a two way street! The dog learns to protect you and yours; and, for your part, you assume the responsibility to: keep, train, socialize, and control the animal. (I was an avocational dog breeder and trainer; and, believe me, I’ve seen every kind of sorry mistake a purchaser could make with a dog. Some of these mistakes were tragic too — Especially for the dogs!)

    This being said: I think we were unusually successful with our dogs because we genuinely loved and cared for them; and the animals, quite naturally, reciprocated. Both dogs and cats seem to, somehow, absorb their owners’ personality and general approach to life; which causes me to believe that: ‘Nice people have nice animals;’ but you’ve got to give them the same kind of attention that you would give to your children.

    (All of our dogs would have given their lives for our family; and, somewhat to my surprise, one day I realized that I felt the same way about each of them, too!)

    No, I'm not (necessarily) a proponent of pistol-caliber carbines. Some of my acquaintances seem to love their Kel-Tec carbines, though! Here are two of the 'tactical carbines' that I prefer to use. (The organized FAKE NEWS media's bogus 'assault rifles' — OK!) One is a Colt Manufacturing LE-6920; and the other is an Arsenal Inc., SA-M5-S, #101 Variant, AK74. Both are 5.56 x 45mm.



    Now that we’ve finally reached ‘that age’ in life, and as I’ve often told many an elderly couple, an AR15 ‘tactical carbine’ is considerably easier to shoot straight than any pistol ever could be. (Our local gun ranges even sell highly frangible ammo for them!)

    What to get? Tough one, but speaking broadly, I’m not ‘crazy’ about either Bushmaster or S&W’s M&P. The tactical carbine market is highly competitive, presently glutted with numerous choices, and there are plenty of other both higher and lower priced AR15’s out there.

    (You’ve just got to become familiar with the choices and specifications. AR15.com might be able to help you with this.)

    Yeah, you think I'd learn and stop posting about this event; but it's a part of my life; and, quite frankly, I didn't do anything to either regret or be ashamed of. The whole neighborhood, including the Town Council, knew that we kept large, aggressive, but very well trained Pit Bulldogs. Among our neighbors nobody in their right mind would have just walked through our front door; but 'it ' wasn't from our neighborhood!

    Neither will I ever understand 'How ' that idiot could have walked right past a large metal sign on our front porch that clearly read in large black letters on a white background, 'Warning! Do Not Enter! Guard Dogs On Premises!' But, in the guy came, anyway!

    He, sort of, ignored my beautiful wife as he (it?) walked straight by her, and came all the way down the hallway heading for me. When he saw that I was on crutches he (it?) broke out into a huge leering grin; and his right hand began to move into his front right pocket. I'm not going to lie to you. I wasn't scared; I was terrified, instead. As I looked at this guy's face I thought that I finally knew how I was going to die; and, subconsciously, I began to recite The Lord's Prayer.

    That's when we, all, heard the first deep growl come rolling down from upstairs. Our big, dark red male, Pit Bulldog, Danzer, didn't hear any noise; but he must have smelled him, and instantly realized that our home had been invaded. When that ridiculous leering grin suddenly disappeared from the guy's face, I very nearly laughed. (In the excitement, and the pain that I was already in, I had completely forgotten about the Bulldogs!)

    The guy was smart, much smarter than I imagined he might be. When he heard that first growl he was already more than 20 feet down the hall; and he realized — He actually realized — that if he took the time to turn around he wasn't going to make it back out the front door. So, with surprising speed, he ran backwards down the hallway, hit the door backwards and opened it behind his back just before my 78 lb PitBulldog slammed into the closing door! Our 80 lb female was right behind him; and the both of them almost destroyed that door trying to get at him. (It?)

    I hobbled over to the door, my wife put down the large kitchen knife she had picked up; and, here is where my love for our animals took over. I wanted, really wanted, to let the Bulldogs have him; but I knew that they would have torn him apart; and, without blinking, the police would have confiscated the dogs.

    (At the time the organized FAKE NEWS media had created an amazing amount of anti Pit Bull fear and animosity among the general public. Consequently, I knew the dogs wouldn't do well in court. So, I closed and locked the inside door and called the police. (Who took more than 25 minutes to respond from the police station that was only 3 or 4 blocks away from our home!)

    By the time the police arrived, 'it ' was long gone; and, even though we kept an eye out for the guy, we never saw him again. I've taken a lot of IGF grief from various know-it-alls and wannabes over that door having been left open; but, like I said, I didn't do anything that I'm either ashamed of, or need to feel guilty about. I know who I am; and what I'm capable of; and, for me, that's all that matters.

    My thinking on guard dogs and home protection is identical to what FerFAL has previously posted.

    One small 'alarm dog'; and one large 'catch dog'. Our small 'alarm dogs' have been either 12 to 15 lb Rat Terriers, or 15 to 25 lb Dachshunds. Personally I love both breeds; and I've spent many a pleasant hour training and playing with them.

    Our large 'catch dogs' have been either: Boxers, Doberman Pinschers, or Pit Bulldogs. I've owned Pit Bulldogs all of my life; and I grew up in a law-enforcement family where my maternal Grandfather, a well-known and respect county sheriff, kept Pit Bulls in our home, and used them for police work. (There WAS a time in America — before the organized FAKE NEWS media began — when Pit Bulldogs were thee American police dog of choice!)

    You will get out of an animal what you put into it; and any unsocialized animal can be dangerous. Period!
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2017
  9. Brokor

    Brokor Live Free or Cry Moderator Site Supporter+++ Founding Member

    Something to consider, motion lights. Indoors.
    Yes, they are solar. They charge well on the window sill for one day per week, a few hours at most. You can charge them while you make breakfast. Affix to the rooms of your choice with velcro, makes for easy on/off for charging. Optionally, you could go with battery powered (non-solar) if you like buying batteries all the time. (these work well outdoors, too -as they are designed for such purposes)

    These lights have variable settings, from low light to medium and high, as well as off. They detect movement very well in low light and in the dark. They do not get set off during the day in normal lighting.

    Mpow Solar Lights, 2-Pack LED Motion Sensor Wall Light Bright Weatherproof Wireless Security Outdoor Light with Motion Activated ON/OFF for Step, Garden, Yard, Deck - - Amazon.com

    They move, they die.
  10. Bandit99

    Bandit99 Monkey+++ Site Supporter+

    @Lone Gunman That is a most excellent story and I had a good laugh this morning while drinking my tea imagining 'ITs' face going from glee to horror! Hee-Hee! Boy that's funny! Surprise! Surprise! But, how horrifying to have someone just walk into your home while you go about your everyday affairs...and you on crutches! And, this thing smiling in anticipation, licking its chops for the feast. Horrifying and a good lesson to all of us. Yes, this is good warning to all of us and cannot be heard enough. You know this would make a perfect commercial for advocates of home self-defense for dogs as well as guns. All my instructors have all said the same thing that one's gun should be worn all the time and this incident proves it... Sadly, I do keep my weapons handy but don't wear them around the house...hopefully I don't have to pay for this some day.

    As for taking a lot of stick from 'greater-than-thou' people (how I hate that condescending type!) about 'door having been left open' - screw'em - because everyone does so at times and if they say they don't they're liars. The wife and I are in a habit of locking the door always (over a decade in 3rd world country together) but freely admit that there are times it's open either because we need it unlock (doing something) or somehow one of us simply screwed up and forgot, seldom but it does happen.

    As for dogs, I might need something with hair as pretty cold and wet up here in Northern Idaho so not sure the Pit Bull type would do well unless it was inside all the time. But, in truth, I am actually more concern with them being able to warn me as oppose to protect me so a purely 'inside' dog might be the answer...much to my cat's demise. LOL!

    Strange enough, I do have a Colt LE-6920 and strange enough after speaking to you it is now sitting by the bed (along with the Glock :)) until I can put some mounts on the wall. It is exactly 32 inches from barrel end to butt with stock fully retracted and, honestly, perfectly sized for home used. I just never really considered it until now. So again, thank you!
  11. Dont

    Dont Just another old gray Jarhead Monkey

    A lot of folk's in North Idaho keep Pit Bull's.

    I may have mentioned in the past, I am partial to Rott's. All the folk's living in my A.O. has seen that bacon loving, black and tan, 110 pounds of snarling fur directed at anyone that has the audacity to step close to "his" truck. Lot's of smirking as the truck rocks back and forth. He is also good at keeping the forest critters at bay.
    Yard Dart, Gator 45/70 and Bandit99 like this.
  12. Lone Gunman

    Lone Gunman Draw Varmint!

    I hear ya! However my personal opinion is that constantly wearing a weapon is (at least at the present time) a bit more paranoid than I care to be. Instead I have compromised on the habit of keeping my EDC (a nicely rebuilt G21) in the same room as I am.

    Personally, I prefer to keep and carry my Glock in C-3. C-3 is much safer for my family and friends; and, so far, it hasn't slowed me down even a little bit. I'm able to draw and rack my slide just as 'smooth as silk'; and my daily practice sessions with snap caps help me to, 'keep everything real '. My C-3 EDC is always with me; and, at night, it's under my pillow; but, then again, I have sound practical reasons for living this way.

    My own best advice for your daily use would be to, more than anything else, 'use your antennae ' and stay alert! A dog WILL help; and our dogs and cats have always gotten along well together. Any early 'meet 'n greet ' problems can be solved by a brief period of confinement for one or the other of them until everything settles down.

    Did you say 'warning '! Trust me on this: Giving out warnings is a job for the smaller dogs. If you've never owned a dog before I'll offer you the same advice I've given to many a buyer: The second thing you should purchase after selecting a canine is an open wire cage that is large enough for the full-grown animal to stand up and turn around in. An open wire cage is THE SINGLE BEST training tool you'll ever own! (You cannot physically punish a Pit Bulldog; but you can confine him for a while until he 'sobers up'.)

    Whenever a bitch disciplines one of her pups she'll pinch-bite the top of the pup's neck. You can do exactly the same thing with your thumb and index finger. Use a loud voice when you do this; but do NOT ever shake the animal because, in a dog's world, THAT is an unmistakable killing technique.

    (I've just given you the essential essence of how to successfully raise an animal that will, one day, be able to take you out with a single bite — So any and all forms of corporeal punishment are absolutely verboten! Canine training is all about using an open wire cage, brief 'clean' neck-pinches, and issuing no more than one or two commands while using only a loud voice.) ;)

    Good! You've now got 28 rounds (I always download my magazines.) instead of only 13 to 17. If you take a hit at room-fighting distances you can tuck the retractible stock underneath your arm and continue to fire accurately. Fewer reloads, and better accuracy than any pistol. I hope you have a source for M855, or equivalent, 62 grain ammo because the more commonly available M193 (55 grain) really doesn't shoot all that accurately in my LE-6920's 1:7 barrel.


    I'll consistently print inside 1 inch @ 100 yards with my 8 locking lug LE-6920 and M855 ammo; but my 6 locking lug AK74 (also with a 1:7 barrel) and M855 ammo will print inside 3/4 inch! (So go figure?) Hope I've helped!
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2017
  13. Bandit99

    Bandit99 Monkey+++ Site Supporter+

    @Lone Gunman 'I hope you have a source for M855" Yes, I do, a good one and currently keep plenty of it on hand, currently ~2000 rounds. I do have the M193 also and its what I normally practice with, currently have ~4000 rounds of it. I do shoot the M855 on occasion but I try to keep it for - a rainy day - it you know what I mean...

    Thanks for the advice on the dogs! I will remember it. I need to wait until wife gets home to decide what type of dog but I am thinking small or smaller. Won't a normal size Labrador (or etc.) give adequate warning?
  14. Bandit99

    Bandit99 Monkey+++ Site Supporter+

    You know Dont, I have heard tell that Rott's have been slandered for being ill-tempered but the truth is they are a really loving family animal, though possibly ill-tempered to those they don't know and a bit over-protective. How long you had yours?
  15. Lone Gunman

    Lone Gunman Draw Varmint!

    Last post of the night: (We're still heavily snowed-in!)

    Believe it, or not Labrador Retrievers have AN EXCELLENT REPUTATION for being solid home protectors; and they are especially good around children. Some of them can reach a good 80 lb + though! We had one here for a while; it was an abused animal that I'd rescued; and I have to say it was a very large, but very even tempered, and attentive animal. I really liked it; but, at the time and with all of our other animals, we had no room to keep it. I finally 'lucked out' by being able to place her with a local family who had recently lost their old Labrador; and they seemed to be genuinely delighted to take the mature dog I offered them.

    Now, I just reread you previous reply; and I'd like to add this to what I had to say:

    Be extra careful with those gun wall-mounts. You don’t want to ever go to bed at night and do what one of my shooting buddies does: He leaves a wall-mounted carbine hanging in the living room while he’s upstairs asleep in the bedroom! (He’s got ammo all over the downstairs, too.) The other precaution you’ve got to keep in mind is to remember to lock that wall-mounted gun up each and every time you leave the house!

    Confession Time! :D

    I DO leave a 22 LR carbine mounted on the wall; and my wife always complains about how it's out there 'for all the world to see' whenever we leave the house. (Not that I blame her!) What I’ve had to explain to her is,

    (1) If that carbine isn’t mounted on the wall when we return home then, before the front door is all the way open, I KNOW we’ve got a problem waiting for us inside; and,

    (2) If none of our animals are standing there looking at us as I open the door then, again, I KNOW we’ve got a problem waiting.

    A law enforcement officer once told me that he couldn’t wait until after he retired, and could finally walk into his house at the end of the day WITHOUT holding his service pistol in his hand. (Makes good sense to me!) :p

    Good night!
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2017
    Gator 45/70, Bandit99 and Dont like this.
  16. Dont

    Dont Just another old gray Jarhead Monkey

    This is the 6th Rott I have had.. And he is coming into his 8th summer. By nature they are very devoted to the family and are pretty good with children, as long as they are raised with those children. This one tolerates the grandchildren, but he tries to get away from them. He wont suffer strangers trying to "buddy" up to him, and usually gives them a attention getting growl and they back off. I usually smile and tell them he is just rude.
  17. Bandit99

    Bandit99 Monkey+++ Site Supporter+

    @Lone Gunman I hope you survive your snow storm. This is my first real winter here and I am fed up with snow. I just wasn't prepared for this much but next year I will be. I have got to find something to plow with, that's the short and long of it.

    "He leaves a wall-mounted carbine hanging in the living room..." No. No. No, that will not do. I will hang it on the wall next to my bed so all I will have to do is stand up and reach out an arm to grab it. Actually, it's a perfect spot for it. It will go into the safe whenever we're not home with the rest of the guns, laptops or anything of value. I normally have two guns out (Glock 19s) for home defense. We've no kids and the cats don't care for shooting so no problem. One sits on top of the refrigerator and one is in the bedroom on my bed stand. Come night the refrigerator gun is moved to my wife's bed stand and the gun safe is locked, it is sort of our routine before brushing teeth. I cannot see the sense in given an intruder access to either my firearms or ammo so the safe is locked each and every night... Our home is single level, it's a small house only for the two of us and was purchased with retirement in mind so it's not a big issue to lock and unlock the safe as it's in bedroom next to ours.

    "Labrador Retrievers have AN EXCELLENT REPUTATION for being solid home protectors" I like Labs a lot so this is good news. But, @Don't has me thinking about Rotts now also. I would like either one actually. Wife gets back end of April so we'll look into it then...

    I hope you can dig your way out tomorrow. Best of luck! Stay warm.
  18. oil pan 4

    oil pan 4 Monkey+++

    Labs aren't as scary as rots. People tend to forget where the lab breed comes from and what they were breed to do.
    But nothing says you're going to be opressed or possibly systematically executed like a German Sheppard.
    I think that's not as scary as "I'm going to peel the flesh off your bones before I eat them" like a 120lb+ Alaskin malamute says (they look like a wolf) because after all they have no problem eating a deer that's been frozen solid.
    Gator 45/70 likes this.
  19. chimo

    chimo the few, the proud, the jarhead monkey crowd

    I keep my .22 bolt action and my 28" pump hunting shotgun on a rack for much the same reasons. I also consider them as decoys...if your run-of-the-mill goblin does break in, he/she may think those two guns and the piddling two boxes of .22 and bird shot near them, are the extent of my firearms...and won't go looking very hard for hidden gun safes and stuff...not that I would ever have anything like that. ;)
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2017
    3M-TA3 and Gator 45/70 like this.
  20. Lone Gunman

    Lone Gunman Draw Varmint!

    Well then I got 'a 'tip my hat to ya', Chimo! Just like me, you can be one sneaky fellow! I, too, have been known to leave (comparatively) inexpensive small caliber guns out in the hope that one of the neighborhood's hobgoblins will take the gun and run away, thinking he's made a really big score! 'Why?' Because I don't want any thief who might have discovered this place to start hanging around the house, looking for the really 'heavy duty' merchandise!

    You, probably, know the same as I do: There isn't a gun safe made that can resist a (competent) mechanical break-in attempt for more than about an hour. If a thief has the right tools, and knows what he's doing, give him an hour and he'll be inside YOUR gun safe! Like you I'd much rather have an intruder grab a (possibly defective) 'lesser gun' and get out of the house quickly, while thinking that he's done all right for himself!

    Remember what the US military used to do in Vietnam? LRRP troops used to 'seed' Viet Cong ammo dumps with what they called 'hot rounds'. I'm not saying that I'd ever do something like this; (There ARE legal liabilities, you know) but, a number of years ago when too many of the homes in our area were getting hit by young neighborhood druggers who liked to specialize in 'while you're at work' household B&E's, leaving out a (possibly defective) old gun with a magazine full of (possibly) 'warm ammo' didn't seem like such bad ideas to me.

    Fortunately, though, I never had to do or use anything like that in our home. We had the Bulldogs, ya know! It was comforting enough for me just to know that such an option was available. I would NEVER have filled up a cartridge case with fast burning Alliant 'Bullseye' powder in the same way that the US Army used to do to those poor Viet Cong fellows during the war in Vietnam. (You have to know when enough is enough — Right!) :)
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2017
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