Should this actually be the case... I have to ask a question... “the Satanic abortion ritual provides spiritual comfort and affirms bodily autonomy, self-worth, and freedom from coercive forces with the affirmation of TST’s Seven Tenets.” does this become a sacrifice? If it does... who or what is that sacrifice for/to? "Jane Essex, a reproductive rights spokesperson for TST, claimed that abortion is a ritual for members of the Satanic temple. Comparing killing a child in abortion to partaking in Communion, Essex stated, “Many states have laws that interfere with our members’ ability to practice their religious beliefs. No Christian would accept a mandatory waiting period before they can partake in Communion,” she said. “No Christian would tolerate a law that insists state counseling is necessary before someone can be baptized. Our members are justly entitled to religious liberty in order to practice our rituals as well.”" hmmm.... well you can see it for yourself and make up your own mind... Satanic Temple says pro-life laws violate freedom to perform 'religious rite' of abortion
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Under the US Constitution's 1st Amendment's Establishment, and Free Exercise clauses, the Satanic Temple consider that their members should enjoy the same rights as adherents of other religious faith and creed traditions: i.e. the religious freedom not to be unreasonably burdened by the State in the exercise of the citizen's sincerely held religious beliefs and rituals. This thread could just as well have been be created in the Freedom and Liberty Forum....the issue that TST is advocating is, after all, fundamentally about the freedom of exercising (in the USA) one's rights of "Free Exercise of Religion". Instead of relying on an anti abortion website's biased take on the matter, perhaps go to the source....just a thought ...TST | Reproductive Rights Campaign No...the ritual is not a ritual of redemptive sacrifice. It is a ritual affirming some of TST's central tenets of faith...namely: Article III : One’s body is inviolable, subject to one’s own will alone. Article V: Beliefs should conform to one's best scientific understanding of the world. One should take care never to distort scientific facts to fit one's beliefs. The ritual is not a sacrificial ritual.
Well, that should settle the status for those women that would partake in that ritual. Even most of those that do not participate in a "religious" human sacrifice when aborting will have some sever complications the Lord. Just one more sign of the increasing wickedness for these times.
It is still murder, and has no parallel to faith in God, in fact quite the reverse there were men in there old testament rebellious to God sacrificing babies. The open destruction of man, abhorrent evil especially to the innocent. Satan worshippers not only kill babies but any human, any living thing they can find, and the greater torture they strive for. Through Satan is worshipped as a god He is no god but a fallen angel a demon , a liar and deceiver, worthy only of distain and judgement, and the pit of hell for his influence on mankind.
Please don't refer to OldDude49 in that disrespectful way....please abide by the site's CoC I commend you to the thread "The Mannerly Art of Disagreement: The Mannerly Art of Disagreement It may help you in avoiding skating on the thinner ice in this forum I look forward to your views on the issues raised in posts #1 & #2, rather than merely expressing personal opinions on the authors of those posts: Just a thought.
My conclusion is you that you can't reason with people who celebrate killing their unborn as a right. But you have to remember the people who seek these services are overwhelmingly poor and minority. So the only thing you earn from stopping them is the left rallies and removes our conservative rights. As we all know: No good deed goes unpunished. So the question is what are you willing to trade allowing the unchecked growth of useful idiots? Ban and confiscation of all semiautomatic firearms? Full communism? Seems like a shitty deal to me.
Did you read the seven tenets? They contradict their stated purpose for abortions. One should strive to act with compassion and empathy toward all creatures in accordance with reason. - Apparently not the unborn The struggle for justice is an ongoing and necessary pursuit that should prevail over laws and institutions. - Make up your own justice - true is subjective. One’s body is inviolable, subject to one’s own will alone. - You should be able to kill yourself for any reason The freedoms of others should be respected, including the freedom to offend. To willfully and unjustly encroach upon the freedoms of another is to forgo one's own. - THIS they ignore completely Beliefs should conform to one's best scientific understanding of the world. One should take care never to distort scientific facts to fit one's beliefs. - What a contradiction to their own beliefs. People are fallible. If one makes a mistake, one should do one's best to rectify it and resolve any harm that might have been caused. - I'm sure they mean anyone but themselves. Every tenet is a guiding principle designed to inspire nobility in action and thought. The spirit of compassion, wisdom, and justice should always prevail over the written or spoken word. - Killing the unborn has become a "Noble Act"
No-one cannot say you're a good sport about things directed you're way...Irregardless of the name calling! Carry on Ol Sport !
TST's recommended religious ritual has not, of itself settled the legal status of those women who would wish practice that religious ritual. The women's legal status (in complying with unnecessary and onerous State legislative requirements both pre and post medical procedure) would be settled in the courts by invoking the application of RFRA (in the same way as Hobby Lobby and Masterpiece Cakeshop et al had done) to their particular circumstances. The ritual recommended by TST is not a religious sacrifice, any more than consuming a consecrated wafer and sacramental wine would reasonably be considered cannibalism. (that said, some faith traditions who believe in the doctrine of transubstantiation could be considered to be committing a metaphorical act of the ritualistic cannibalism of their deity) Cannibalism A substantial proportion of the US population who have an abortion, are prepared to take their chances with the 'Lord', assuming that such a supernatural entity does actually exist, and has a view on the matter. Apparently the 'Lord' is only concerned (in the Tanakh) about male spouses' insecurities about marital infidelity, and seems satisfied to permit the aborting of fetuses conceived as a consequence of adultery....vide Numbers Chapter 5 Verses 1- 31 Numbers 5 / Hebrew - English Bible / Mechon-Mamre (my text emboldening) The Christian Bible says little about abortion as a medical procedure, Abortion - RationalWiki but it does have a lot to say about child killing. What Does The Bible Say About Abortion? - Freedom From Religion Foundation I guess it depends upon how one defines wickedness (the quality of being evil or morally wrong). One can argue that compelling a woman to complete a pregnancy against her will, and denying her bodily autonomy is also evil and morally wrong. Without a doubt, as moral agents, wickedness is an inevitable component of the human condition...the question is, to what extent does the anti-abortion regulation of women's bodily autonomy contribute to wickedness or diminish it?
And you presume to know who will be occupying hell and who won't??? Israelite men and women BCE, would have been puzzled by the notion of an after life. I am as troubled of the modern Christian notions of the afterlives of heaven and hell, as you would be as concerned with the after lives of other cultures and religious traditions such as Hades, Valhalla, Yom Afterlife - Wikipedia, In my view, 'Heaven' and 'Hell' are the superstitious constructs of clever priests and other clerics. They are the carrots and sticks that encourage the ill educated and uncritical, to keep the bellies and purses of clerics full, and to enable the theocrats to wield temporal power over their pliable sheep. Of course to Calvinists... EVERYONE IS PREDESTINED TO HELL....except 'The Elect'...it is not clear what qualifies one for inclusion as one of 'The Elect'; which makes for a lot of anxiety for those who are ensnared in Calvinist beliefs. I take same comfort in the fanciful notion that there will be enough room in hell for both you and me to continue our culture wars conversations together into eternity...now, that's the kind of hell i'd welcome!!
No killing the unborn is not a “noble act”,it’s a sin the same as murder. At least I won’t be going to hell because I said abortion was ok. Anytime you kill a baby that has a beating heart,you are a murdering a human being. The poor baby can’t help being there. Our country started on its down hill slide after our courts said abortion was ok. I just had another great grand child “a pretty little girl“ that would not be here if her parents had believed in abortions. One of my granddaughters adopted a little boy at birth whose mother did not want because of the daddy being black. The little boy is fast becoming a fine young man who would not be here if he had been aborted.
I believe there will be a judgment day a life review and consequences whether one believes or not, all their inactions, actions and inter actions with others in their life time will be brought to the surface for all to see. There are many youtube testimonies of those that have experienced life after death even an atheist neurosurgeon now a believer. For those of you that do not think a fetus is a person may I remind you that the baby learns while still in the womb both the mothers voice and her emotions, especially strong emotions, even music. Loving mothers inspire a good strong connection with their young, while resentful mothers inspire rebellion even with in the womb. Intentioned or not the mother will imprint on her child in the womb traits, even looks, not even genetically connected to the person she cared most about during the event. Murder of another person's life is contradictory all natural law. It is selfish by any definition. There was a little boy that passed away and came back, in his report he met his sister who died miscarried before He was born.
Last I check cannibals were not allowed to practice their religious belief of eating other humans, so I guess their is a recognized limit.
I read your response to not a sacrifice chel... think that is more of a opinion then the actual truth of the matter... I admit I could be wrong on that... but pretty sure connecting with that religion makes such a thing a sacrifice... but I also believe abortion is a sacrifice on the alter of humanistic hedonism... so...
Times are achanging. What was good is bad and what was bad is good. Just one more land mark on this trail we are traveling on. And we may be able to see the end of the trail way off there ahead of us. But there is a fork in the trail coming up for some of us.
Adoption is always a route of saving the uwanted and having productive kids that can change the world.
