Advice for a coworker on home defense carbine

Discussion in 'Firearms' started by Idahoser, Feb 9, 2016.

  1. Idahoser

    Idahoser Monkey+++ Founding Member

    I have this female coworker friend who probably isn't going to do the work to be competent with a pistol, and says she doesn't want a revolver (which I've been letting her borrow). Yet she wants to keep a gun at home. So I've been thinking of a carbine.

    I have several pistol caliber carbines but only one semi-auto, a Ruger PC4. I like it for her purposes, but they're not easy to find these days, nor are the others that come to mind, like a Camp Carbine.

    She's not at this point picky about what she buys, would take advice but more expensive is going to make her wait and probably not do it at all (so M1 carbine and HKs are probably out).

    So I was wondering what folks think about the (seems to be) only presently manufactured, inexpensive PCC on the market - the Hi-Point. I'm assuming we'll be able to find one in a local shop to try on for size, though I don't expect we'll be able to borrow or rent one to shoot. My Ruger should be close enough to tell if she's going to be able to handle it.

  2. ghrit

    ghrit Bad company Administrator Founding Member

    Does it have to be semi, or can she deal with a lever gun? Say a henry.
  3. techsar

    techsar Monkey+++

    If you don't expect her to do the work to become competent with a pistol, do you really expect her to do differently on any other weapon?
    Anyhow, the HiPoint is a cheap, clunky, ugly, but reliable carbine. Hardly any recoil. Forget the junk laser some come with. Can't say how well the .40 or .45 acp versions work, but the 9mm has never given me any issues.
  4. 3M-TA3

    3M-TA3 Cold Wet Monkey

    HiPoint review:
  5. UncleMorgan

    UncleMorgan I like peeling bananas and (occasionally) people.

    For home defense, one of the things to worry about is over-penetration. The round that may go through two walls and kill a neighbor or family member. Another thing to consider is intimidation. Scaring off an intruder without having to fire is almost always a good deal.

    For those two reasons, I'd argue against a carbine, and suggest instead a pump shotgun in either 20 gauge or 410.

    Shot usually stops in the target or the first wall after, and nothing beats the sound of a shotgun being racked for discouraging a home invader.

    Inexpensive used 410 pump guns are around, but the old ones are often high because of the collector value. Or, if buying new, the Mossberg 510 Mini costs no more than a decent handgun.

    The recoil of the smaller gauge is also easier to handle.
  6. Yard Dart

    Yard Dart Vigilant Monkey Moderator

    Great point @UncleMorgan !!
    Over penetration is a serious issue living in a residential area, when it comes to home defense. It is one thing to scare or knock down an intruder in defense of your home and family, but it is entirely another matter to also kill the neighbors kid in the process of protecting yourself.... and getting brought up on man slaughter charges....

    A person that is not well trained with a firearm (as this coworker noted above will be), they will make many types of common mistakes using the weapon and hence a shotgun is a good option for that type of individual... to minimize at least the over-pen issue.
  7. BTPost

    BTPost Stumpy Old Fart,Deadman Walking, Snow Monkey Moderator

    20Ga Shotgun with extended tube, loaded with Low Base Dove Loads, and the last two rounds, 00Buck.... The last two, are for if the Perp is still wiggling....
  8. Yard Dart

    Yard Dart Vigilant Monkey Moderator

    My 12 GA 9-shot 590A1 shotties are set up with the first round being a low base load (warning shot) and the 00Buck and slug alternating for the remaining with 5 additional slugs on the stock side saddle.
    Gator 45/70 likes this.
  9. AxesAreBetter

    AxesAreBetter Monkey+++

    Hate the Hi-Point. Keltec, Bereta, Tuarus all currently have on the shelf pistol caliber carbines.
  10. 3M-TA3

    3M-TA3 Cold Wet Monkey

    Gator 45/70 and Yard Dart like this.
  11. Kingfish

    Kingfish Self Reliant

    @ BT POST I have the Rem. 870 in a 20 gauge pump with the extended tube (7 shot) We shoot all Buckshot (#3 Buck) however from it. It doesnt over penetrate like the 12 Gauge does. Nasty shotgun.
  12. Gator 45/70

    Gator 45/70 Monkey+++

    A load of #6 shot is real nasty at close range....Just say'n
    Garand69 and Yard Dart like this.
  13. ghrit

    ghrit Bad company Administrator Founding Member

    Bear in mind that at close ranges (say within a house) shot is still in a lump that will penetrate nearly as well as a solid. That tends to punch a hole in the sheetrock far more readily than dispersed shot, say at more than 60 feet. You can get a better feel for this looking at shotgun choke patterns.
  14. BTPost

    BTPost Stumpy Old Fart,Deadman Walking, Snow Monkey Moderator

    The Low Base Dove Loads, are designed to give your Lady, experience with the weapon, while building her confidence, in using it.... It takes a while for a non-FireArm Person to get used to the Operation of the weapon, and you do NOT want to discourage her, with heavy Recoil, while she is still uncomfortable... After some Range Time, you can upgrade the Ammunition, if needed, but those Rounds will make ANY Perp, "Run for this Hills" if he is looking down the wrong end of that weapon... He doesn't know what is in the chamber, and getting hit, with even those Low Base Dove Loads will give him a VERY Large Belly-Ache, Post Haste....
  15. AxesAreBetter

    AxesAreBetter Monkey+++


    PLEASE, for the sake of all of the people out there who are not really prepared to take a life, quit coddling them with this LIE. It gets people killed.
  16. Kingfish

    Kingfish Self Reliant

    3cyl and AxesAreBetter like this.
  17. Yard Dart

    Yard Dart Vigilant Monkey Moderator

    I think to better refine that statement....for me and mine.... If you pull it.... be ready mentally and physically to use it. As always, verify your target (your son, Johnnie, rummaging around the kitchen in the middle of the night is not a burglar), ensure you have a safe shot with a known background and so on..... preaching to the choir I know.... but there is a whole bunch of stuff involved in pulling that trigger.... on top of being sure it is actually loaded. ;)

    Best advice to the co-worker once they procure a weapon.....get trained, learn how to care for the weapon and know your local laws regarding self defense.......
    3M-TA3, kellory, BTPost and 1 other person like this.
  18. duane

    duane Monkey+++

    Know a couple small young ladies who didn't like pistols larger than .22. Noisy, recoil, flash, short sight radius, and so on. Have an old clunky hi point 9 mm carbine, 1 st generation, without all the tracks for lights etc. They tried it at the range and loved it. Almost no recoil, flash is away from face, seemed quieter to them, they could hit the target at 25 to 50 feet, no problem with limp wristing the gun and not feeding right and so on. I found one that shoots quite well and in good condition with 2 mags for one of the young ladies for $150 and am still looking for another one. It may be a cheap lousy carbine, but it also seems to work quite well for home defense and plinking as a super clunky almost pistol, just my humble opinion and I am sure your mileage will vary.
    Idahoser likes this.
  19. Yard Dart

    Yard Dart Vigilant Monkey Moderator

    I see that Cabelas is selling them right now in this week flier for $250 brand new...... Not a bad unit for the cost IMO.
    I picked up two a while back and they are great to shoot.

    Here is a video that @Brokor shared a while back in another Hi-Point subject thread.... shows the carbine going through its paces.
    3M-TA3 likes this.
  20. AxesAreBetter

    AxesAreBetter Monkey+++

    Been there when three of them broke, and one of those fell into pieces.
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