alcohol production

Discussion in 'Survival Medicine' started by tacmotusn, Dec 22, 2010.


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  1. tacmotusn

    tacmotusn Mosquito Sailor

    Someone mentioned alcohol might be handy to have for disinfecting wounds. The following site/forum, has a thread header called "home brewing" that has a wealth of info for making all types of alcohol.
    .
    Home Brewing - Alcohol Reportb::[beer]b::
     
  2. MicroBalrog

    MicroBalrog Monkey+++

    What is the shelf life of stored alcohol?
     
  3. ghrit

    ghrit Ambulatory anachronism Administrator Founding Member

    Essentially forever if sealed/unopened. If opened, the water and alcohol will evaporate over time. Dunno about what's left.
     
  4. tacmotusn

    tacmotusn Mosquito Sailor

    At my house [booze]not very long. :oops:I have no large alcohol storage area except my "Budda belly". [boozingbuddies]
     
  5. fedorthedog

    fedorthedog Monkey++

    make sure you are distilling the type of alcohol you want the medical stuff is isopropyl vs ethonol drinking and driving
     
  6. BTPost

    BTPost Old Fart Snow Monkey Moderator

    The main reason Isopropyl Alcohol is used medically, in todays world, IS, it is cheap, and a byproduct of other chemical processes. The second reason is that ethanol is drinkable, and therefore TAXED and Regulated by the Governing Authority. As far as their disinfectant properties go, they are basically the SAME for external uses, HOWEVER, the later can be used for internal AND medicinal, anesthetic, and curative properties as well, where as the former can NOT. The same is true of Wood Alcohol, (Methanol) in most instances.
     
  7. tacmotusn

    tacmotusn Mosquito Sailor

    I will be making the sippin' type of alcohol. Strictly for medical purposes however. Damn its cold outside..... I better sit by the fire and have a nip or three to take the chill off.
     
  8. tacmotusn

    tacmotusn Mosquito Sailor

    In my continuing search for the truth with regard to stills and alcohol production I have found that the laws were different from what I thought they were, and there are some odd twists and turns to it all.

    Still Supplier; http://www.milehidistilling.com/Mr_Distiller_Moonshine_Alcohol_distilling_p/16049.htm

    name Mile Hi Distilling
    address P.O. Box 150110 - Lakewood, Co. 80215-0110
    phone 303-987-3955 - 10am - 6pm EST M-F

    In Use Video clip; http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CfAjzXlsmTY

    It is not illegal to own a still, but according to BATTB the following applies;

    S3: I've seen ads for home distilling equipment in catalogs ("turn wine into brandy," "make your own essential oils"). Is it legal to buy and use a still like that?
    Under Federal rules administered by TTB, it depends on how you use the still. You may not produce alcohol with these stills unless you qualify as a distilled spirits plant (see earlier question). However, owning a small still and using it for other purposes is allowed. You should also check with your State and local authorities - their rules may differ.
    A still is defined as apparatus capable of being used to separate ethyl alcohol from a mixture that contains alcohol. Small stills (with a cubic distilling capacity of a gallon or less) that are used for laboratory purposes or for distilling water or other non-alcoholic materials are exempt from our rules. If you buy a small still and use it to distill water or extract essential oils by steam or water extraction methods, you are not subject to TTB requirements. If you produce essential oils by a solvent method and you get alcohol as a by-product of your process, we consider that distilling. Even though you are using and recovering purchased alcohol, you are separating the alcohol from a mixture -distilling.


    and;

    S4: What requirements are there for people who sell stills?
    Under regulations in part 29 of title 27, Code of Federal Regulations, TTB has the right to require manufacturers of stills to give us the name and address of each customer. If we choose to impose this requirement, we inform the manufacturer of the stills by letter.



    Use of the still to produce essential oils or clean distilled water is perfectly legal.


    These same stills could produce spirits (high proof alcohol) from beer or wine


    Almost any fruit or vegetable that has natural sugars can be used to make a fermented liquid that then can be distilled into spirits.


    Once a still has been used to produce spirits without prior BATTB permit and taxation it is an illegal still, if it can be proven to have been used to do so. Obviously if proper cleaning with accomplished with, soap and water, then bleach and water, then denatured alcohol, and then soap and water again proving useage to make spirits would be 99.9 percent impossible. Deny, deny, deny! If they can't prove it, it didn't happen.


    The following are exerpts from the BATTB website 12/25/2010



    S7: Can I produce beer, wine or spirits for my personal or family use without paying Federal excise tax and filing Federal paperwork?
    Beer
    Production. permitted, quanities limited.
    Wine
    Wine for personal or family use. production permitted, quanities limited.
    Spirits
    You cannot produce spirits for beverage purposes without paying taxes and without prior approval of paperwork to operate a distilled spirits plant. [See 26 U.S.C. 5601 & 5602 for some of the criminal penalties.] There are numerous requirements that must be met that make it impractical to produce spirits for personal or beverage use. Some of these requirements are paying special tax, filing an extensive application, filing a bond, providing adequate equipment to measure spirits, providing suitable tanks and pipelines, providing a separate building (other than a dwelling) and maintaining detailed records, and filing reports. All of these requirements are listed in 27 CFR Part 19.
    Spirits may be produced for non-beverage purposes for fuel use only without payment of tax, but you also must file an application, receive TTB's approval, and follow requirements, such as construction, use, records and reports.
     
  9. tacmotusn

    tacmotusn Mosquito Sailor

    The essential oils and fuel thing seems to be the key to legally obtaining a small still that could be used for producing essential oils or for making alcohol strictly for use as fuel.

    Below is a bit more data.
    .
    The last word on legal or illegal Home Alcohol Production (Spirits - not beer or wine)

    What all this basically comes down to is ...
    1. Americans can own a still, but it must be no larger than 1 gallon, and may only be used for water purification or the extraction of essential oils from plants.
    2.Dealers/manufacturers of stills in the United States must surrender any address or other info on any customer who buys a still to the BATF, when they request it.(no warrant is required.)

    What this means is that anyone who buys a still in America can at any time expect a knock at the door and a man with a badge demanding to see what is being done with the still they bought. How this effects the companies seen advertising 5 gallon stills for use as a water purifier, was not listed, nor is there any info on solar stills. It is probably VERY illegal to import a still too.

    If you're trying the angle of making alcohol as a fuel (yes, this is legal!), see Steve Spence's site for all the details.



    Whats the cost of doing it right ? Don advises ...
    • State (varies from $75-$3,150 per year) & a Federal license ($500 per year) plus State & Fed. production taxes. Registration of all supplies, suppliers, formulas (Subject to classification and approval) and label reg. (Subject to classification and approval). More paperwork than money. If you already have a brewery or winery (bonded premisis) an "alternation of premisis" may be obtained to operate a distillery (with the additional license) on site. Well worth the trouble, because there is still room at the top.
    Pop advises:



    Here is the straight poop from Pop on what you need to do to walk the fine line of legality.
    • How to obtain an alcohol fuel permit in the US. Here are some basic guidelines to get you started.

      For fed. rules and regs. Go to http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov .

      In the browse box, select "title 27"
      Where it says "browse parts" click on the numbers "1-199"
      Scroll down to "part 19" (Distilled spirits plant)and click on the numbers "19.1 to 19.1010"
      You are only interested in "subpart Y" (Distilled spirits for fuel)

      If you just want to produce fuel for personal use, and to be used on your own property, you aren't subject to bonds, taxes, and denaturing your product unless it is removed from the premises.

      If this is what you want, then you will want to choose the "small plant" ( less than 10,000 proof-gallons per year)A proof-gallon is a US gallon times proof divided by 100.

      For an on line permit application – click on the following link… http://www.ttb.gov/forms/pdfs/f510074.pdf

      Or you can call them toll free and request a permit packet. There is no charge for the permit
      You read that correctly. It's Free !!!

      Tax and Trade Bureau
      National Revenue Center
      550 Main Street Suite 8002
      Cincinnati, Ohio 45202
      Toll Free 1-877-TTB-FAQS (1-877-882-3277)
      (513)-684-3334

      To learn more about alcohol fuel production check out this site. http://running_on_alcohol.tripod.com
    When the Feds knock on my door. I will show them my "Mr Distiller" 1 gallon countertop unit, that I will assure them I purchased it to efficiently extract essential oils from flowers, fruit, and herbs, which I plan on using for the making of High End Homemade Soap for personal use and for gifts to friends and family. I will indeed have some homemade soap to show them as well as well as a few books on the subject. I will then tell them, that since all I am doing is strictly legal, and I am growing tired of the conversation, are they satisfied, or shall I call my attorney. If asked about producing alcohol for fuel. I will tell them I got the permit with the intend of looking into doing it, but had not yet given it a try. Maybe soon, strictly for fuel for use on the property however.
     
  10. ghrit

    ghrit Ambulatory anachronism Administrator Founding Member

    Why buy? Building a still is child's play.
     
  11. tacmotusn

    tacmotusn Mosquito Sailor

    I am cross eyed, I drool, and I got 10 thumbs.
    .
    besides, did you watch the video of how slick that unit works. specs claim they put 4 liters of fermented wash in it and turned it on. 110 minutes later they had 1.2 liters of hooch.
     
  12. Quigley_Sharps

    Quigley_Sharps The Badministrator Administrator Founding Member

  13. The column still is indeed the way to go for someone wishing to distill at home. But there are a LOT of advantages to building your own over buying.

    1 - No paper trail leading to your door (remember that posession of an unpermitted still is a felony)
    2 - Extreme ease of manufacture (a column still can be assembled from little more than a section of pipe and a bag of marbles
    3 - A homemade fractional distillation set up (AKA column still) can be broken down into its component parts and is not recognizable as distillation equipment

    I have a copy of The Alaskan Bootlegger's Bible, which is full of history, stories - and recipes and plans. Note that all of this is for information purposes only - I do not advocate violating the law. However, prosecution of hobbyists is rare.

    My biggest thought is that distilling could be an important skill to have in a situation where law and order have broken down. As has been pointed out alcohol is a good antiseptic, fuel, the basis for numerous medications in the forms of tinctures of herbs, and will be a valuable trade good in any SHTF scenario.
     
  14. tacmotusn

    tacmotusn Mosquito Sailor

    I do not agree with point #1 above. I think I covered that in detail in posts 8 and 9 above. Mere possession of a small 1 gallon still capable of producing alcohol is not against the law. I quoted BATTB directly from their FAQ page on the subject.
    .
    Other than that and for the same reasons, I agree with you whole heartedly.[boozingbuddies]
     
  15. tacmotusn

    tacmotusn Mosquito Sailor

    Those who abuse most anything on a regular basis are indeed weak links. Those who condemn others with little knowledge also are weak links. Many of our founding father smoked and drank as well. I would trust them far more than than the present crop of politicians. You failed to note an awful lot of what was posted on this thread. A thread posted in "medical" no less.
     
  16. I understand what you're saying, tacmot - but please understand my point. If you purchase a still you open yourself up to being investigated. If you build it yourself and keep it out of sight you do not. That is why I state that avoiding a paper trail leading to your door may be a good idea for the home distillation hobbyist. You make a lot of great points, and have contributed a LOT of great info to this thread!
     
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  6. Dont
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  14. melbo
    Alcohol Fuels
    Thread by: melbo, Oct 14, 2012, 3 replies, in forum: Resource Discussions
  15. tacmotusn
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