An article on: Why we need Utopian fiction

Discussion in 'Survival Reading Room' started by Motomom34, Nov 8, 2018 at 17:19.


  1. Motomom34

    Motomom34 Moderator Moderator

    The true title of the article is Why We Need Utopian Fiction Now More then Ever. It is a really long read and when I first started reading I was questioning if I had ever read a book that had a successful Utopian book. The author of the article seems to be a Star Trek fan and seems to think that was utopia. i watched a few episodes and it seemed that they were always having issues, whether on the ship or at places they visited.

    https://io9.gizmodo.com/why-we-need-utopian-fiction-now-more-than-ever-1830260945


    No work of dystopian fiction has ever stopped the scenarios it portrays from happening,” he argues. “1984 didn’t prevent the surveillance state, and Blade Runner didn’t hinder corporate destruction of our environment.
    That made me think. Dystopia fiction or reality, one cannot stop what is happening from happening. History has not been learned from and humans continue to make the same mistakes. So why do we fight against the inevitable? People crave a utopian society but has there ever been one that succeeded and everyone was satisfied? I think that is the issue with people that want a Utopia, they fail to realize that people are different. As much as some want us all to come together to be one and work together, that will not happen. My wants and needs are vastly different from many of yours. Someone always ends up oppressed and taught to obey. Following the rules starts at an early age.

    She ends the article with: Yet, in such a bleak reality, hope is radical. And the more we dare to dream about our own utopias, then we might just be inspired to stop the end of the world—as impossible a dream as that may seem to be.
     
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  2. HK_User

    HK_User A Productive Monkey is a Happy Monkey Site Supporter

    My Utopia
    A field full of motorcycles to ride at any time with unlimited gas and a freedom to roam the world without cagers around me and a clean neat camping spot at the end of the day's ride with a fresh steak to broil each night.
    Fresh ground coffee at the start of each day and a variety of pastry each morning.
     
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2018 at 17:40
  3. chelloveck

    chelloveck Diabolus Causidicus

    I would contend, that humanity needs both Utopian and Dystopian fiction.

    The problem with Utopia as a human ideal, is that there is no agreed upon overarching idea of what utopia would be for the whole of humanity....there are probably as many notions of utopia as there are humans, many of which are contradictory / incompatible with each other. Utopia - Wikipedia One person's utopia is just as like to be someone else's dystopia.

    Utopian fiction may offer some ideas to humanity that may be worth aspiring to.....dystopian fiction may offer inspiration to some on how to mitigate, and survive the effects of particular kinds of dystopias.... i.e. war gaming TEOTWAWKI (kriegsspiel Kriegsspiel (wargame) - Wikipedia) for the end of the world....or at least, the end of one's world.
     
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2018 at 18:54
  4. Ura-Ki

    Ura-Ki Grudge Monkey

    The Myth of Utopia is what drives modern civilizations! It's always been a noble idea, a sort of return to the Garden of Eden where all people are the same, no one has to work or have need of any thing, and there is nothing but peace! Sadly, this is nothing but wild fantasy, and any promise ,no matter how noble it's intentions, can only lead to one conclusion, Chaos!
     
  5. Bandit99

    Bandit99 Monkey+++ Site Supporter+

    Frankly, I don't think there ever has been a Utopian society and we are certainly far from one. In fact, I will venture to say that I do not believe there EVER will be one. Why? Man is a strange animal, a violent animal, an animal that is never satisfied. I don't wish to deviate too far off topic but man will be the reason there is never an utopian society unless there is some grandiose intellectual leap, accompanied by an technological one so we can get off this rock and like-minded can form their own societies far and away from others then, and only then - maybe - maybe utopia for a short period.

    I think she missed one of the good points of having Utopian and Dystopian fiction, authors can cause us to wander around those worlds and see what works and what doesn't. For example, if I could buy my own Firefly, right now, today, don't pass Go...? Count me gone. In fact, don't count.
     
  6. techsar

    techsar Monkey+++

    Things fall apart

    The center cannot hold...
     
  7. chelloveck

    chelloveck Diabolus Causidicus

    That's entropy man....holding the centre requires energy, which is dissipated through friction...
    The centre can be held temporarily, bit it will eventually fall into chaos, from which a new centre will be temporarily cobbled together and held for a while, and so the cycle will continue until the universe devolves into a state of heat death.

    Utopia is a bit like the perpetual motion machine....a fine idea....but the attainability of which will be perpetually (and tantalisingly) just out of reach. ;)

    Apparently, Utopia is aptly named: Utopia, meaning 'No Place'...

    The following Youtube clip is a fair summary, though the recording acoustics are mildly irritating.
    http://theopenutopia.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/Open-Utopia-fifth-poofs-facing-amended.pdf


    I think utopias are far less interesting than dystopias....

    List of utopian literature - Wikipedia

    List of dystopian literature - Wikipedia

    List of dystopian films - Wikipedia
     
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2018 at 23:08
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  8. Motomom34

    Motomom34 Moderator Moderator

    I am so glad you said that. I read dystopia and you are very correct, some things work and some things do not. Each author will spin a tale of society and the evils. Many dystopian books that I read often have me think that some of the societies, ways and events could happen. I do wonder why so many of the teen, young adults are in the genre.
     
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  9. 3M-TA3

    3M-TA3 Cold Wet Monkey Site Supporter++

    By our own nature an utopian environment would drive us crazy. We need challenges, failures, struggles, even crime and tragedy.
     
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  10. DKR

    DKR Interesting ideas, interesting stories

    There are four basic stories -

    Man vs Man
    Man vs Nature
    Man vs God (diety, Crom!)
    Man vs Himself.

    (Man = Mankind)


    The problem with Utopia - everyone has a different vision, sometime a wildly different vision, of just what "Utopia" might mean.
     
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  11. chelloveck

    chelloveck Diabolus Causidicus

    Because their futures are ahead of them, and it is interesting to speculate upon what kind of future they might have themselves, and what kind of future they have the power to influence as their legacy to those who follow them.
     
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  12. Gator 45/70

    Gator 45/70 Monkey+++

    Utopia is living life the fullest and having fun while you at it.
    Like take for an example,A Democrap!
    Free stuff and money
    No fear of prosecution
    No morals or scruples
    No one to answer to.
    Get to riot,Plunder and pillage!
    Rut with hairy unwashed Hippy chicks
    No taxes!
    Good Lord, The list has no ending!
     
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  13. chelloveck

    chelloveck Diabolus Causidicus

    [​IMG]
    I think the Right-Wing Utopia is a little optimistic..... ;)
     
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  14. arleigh

    arleigh Goophy monkey

    In a utopia NOTHING can change .
    In which case nothing can live .
    Change is the constant in the universe, especially where there is life .
    To add ,all must share .
    To subtract all must yield .
    Fantasies create more problems than they "allude" to fulfill .
    I create things ,have all my life .
    The debate over A-I and robotics ,I am as much a part of being that I have built beings that are time saving ,which contribute to labor saving which contribute to taking another person out of the loupe.
    I among other things, built air compressors , which their purpose aid in manufacturing and doing things more efficiently . with out them productivity is significantly slower . How would you like to air up your tires with a hand pump, a job you might well hire some one else to do, amongst other things ?
    It is not that i do this alone but as a contributing factor in the field.
    In a perfect utopia no need for these things would exist .
    The ghost cities of China are about as utopia as we can observe .
     
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