Energy Anybody know anything about solar systems?

Discussion in 'Off Grid Living' started by Lilikoian, Aug 24, 2017.


  1. Lilikoian

    Lilikoian Monkey

    IMG_0290.JPG
    The "kit" I bought from a store ripped me off. I could have purchased each item individually and it would have cost about $1000 less. Also, after they sold it to me, they gave me NO customer service, NO information. So, no, can't go back to them. I'm in a rural area on a rural county in the most isolated island chain in the world. I can goods from China shipped here faster and easier than Amazon, so my resources are not as vast as most of y'all.

    I have a handyman from CL coming with a voltmeter tomorrow, for a free inspection :)
    Here is my battery: (I have 2 of them)
     
    Last edited: Aug 26, 2017
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  2. Lilikoian

    Lilikoian Monkey

    Thanks so much for all of that!
    Questions:
    1. The inverter is a POS. I've already had to have the two outlets replaced. The power button is already busted from my fingernail turning it on/off. I know it saves power to turn it off every night. My question is: will it wear out faster if I do that?
    2. What is the benefit to the red inverter you have pictured?
     
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  3. Lilikoian

    Lilikoian Monkey

    I'm learning from you guys :)
     
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  4. ghrit

    ghrit Bad company Administrator Founding Member

    OK, don't buy the hydrometer, those look sealed, at least they are deep cycle. Your handyman should take open circuit voltages before and after the charge controller for starters. That will give some information about the state of charge at the time the readings are taken. He should show you how to do that, then you should do it again when the sun is overhead, that is, at max insolation. And again after the batts have charge as high as possible with no power taken off. Meaning use no power at all from morning until dark. That will be the best the system can perform with no demand. We'll see what that looks like, then do some experiments with loads.
     
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  5. techsar

    techsar Monkey+++

    I'm going to disagree with ghrit on one item here...the three caps on top of the battery are tied together with those two rails. Just grab hold of each end and give about a quarter twist counter-clockwise...yeah, it's kind of awkward. They should lift off after that.
    IMPORTANT NOTE: any fluid on the caps will be acid. It can and will eat through paint, deteriorate clothes, and cause burns on your skin or potentially cause blindness if splashed in your eyes. Wear at minimum goggles...protective gloves are recommended. Baking soda and water will neutralize any spills, but you don't want to get any in the battery cells.
    No need to be scared of any of this...or electricity, for that matter. Just be careful, use common sense and you'll be fine.
     
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  6. ghrit

    ghrit Bad company Administrator Founding Member

    OK, if they are NOT sealed then one is going to rightly jump to the conclusion that they are really low on water since Lili has not mentioned maintaining them.
     
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  7. DKR

    DKR Raconteur of the first stripe

    1st - You have good quality batteries.
    Interstate Batteries' GC-2 golf cart battery line has the longest drive time between charges in the industry of deep cycle batteries. The XHD means extra heavy duty, meaning you'll get even more value for your dime. Voted "best battery" four years in a row by real users and technicians gives an undoubted assurance that Interstate Batteries will be outrageously dependable and a quality choice to replace your original lead acid battery.

    Deep cycle batteries are constructed to maintain a continuous flow of energy. Some applications which require deep cycle batteries are golf carts, RVs and campers, as well as appliances run by solar power. They are designed to endure the frequent, complete discharge and recharge required by these applications. They are made with thicker plates which deliver less peak current but are less susceptible to degradation caused by cycling.

    [​IMG]
    (Equalization is a big deal)

    Specifications of the GC2-XHD:
    • 6 Volt
    • 20 Hour Rate Ah of 232
    • Reserve capacity of 475 minutes
    • Made from 18 internal plates
    • UTL terminal connectors
    • Flooded Lead Acid chemistry, wet cell
    • QuickCaps technology allows you to open all vent ports with one easy twist
    • Technician's choice "best battery" four years in a row
    • 40-50% more cycles than top competitors, meaning at least 150 more cycles!
    • Guaranteed freshest batteries sent
    • 1 year manufacturer's warranty
      ________________________________________________
    The inverter is a pure sine wave unit rated at, I believe, 1Kw (1000 watts)
    It really wasn't designed to be switched on and off a couple of times a day - a lot of systems have a DC cutoff, However, it doesn't hurt the inverter to be cycled on and off - if there is no load. So, turn off anything plugged in before switching off the inverter..

    The red unit - being only 300 watts has a low 'overhead' or idle current. I didn't list part numbers, as I don't know if it can even be found on the island... The point was to see if, in the interim, you can even find a lower wattage inverter as a possible replacement when your unit finally bites the dust.... Quite literately, to take your fan along and have the salesperson prove a (possible replacement) lower wattage unit can handle the load...
    For a fan and a LED light, I would be surprised if you needed even a 500 watt unit.

    If you look at the fan, it should have a label showing power used in watts.
    [​IMG]

    For example
    a Honeywell HT-900 TurboForce Air Circulator Fan, Black uses up to 35 watts at high speed.
    Speed 1 = 25 watts, speed 2 = 30 watts, and speed 3 = 35 watts, this is as per a "kill a watt" unit to measure power use.

    This translates to about 0.3 amps of current - well less than half of the idle current of your inverter.

    Also - does the panel sit out in the open for full sun exposure?

    I actually feel your pain. Places that offer 'free shipping' often charge more than an item costs for shipping to Alaska. I normally see if a vendor will ship via US Post office before bothering to place an order. Some places won't even ship to Alaska. UPS/FedEx are horrible for shipping to AK. And as I'm sure you know, their 'service' sucks rocks.
     
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  8. arleigh

    arleigh Goophy monkey

    I use 12 volt automotive and computer fans, they are very cheap and need no inverter to run them, very cost efficient .
     
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  9. BTPost

    BTPost Stumpy Old Fart,Deadman Walking, Snow Monkey Moderator

    Only battery, Better, is the L16HD... Twice as BIG, Twice as Expensive, and TWICE the AmpHours....
     
  10. Lilikoian

    Lilikoian Monkey

    Handyman coming later today with a voltmeter. In case he doesn't know how to do this, I'd like to know if the reading should be done with a load or with everything turned off.

    The controller never goes below 11.7. But it's taking longer and longer each day to recharge, and this is August.

    You all have determined I have good batteries, and that they AREN'T sealed.
    I've never done ANY maintenance.

    I'm pretty sure the handyman will only be good for reading the charges, and not know what to do with the battery and readings. So I'll come back with the readings, and then hopefully if it's just a matter of maintenance and adding distill water, can somebody point me to an easy resource for how to do that?

    You guys have no idea how helpful ALL of you have been. For the first time, I feel like I'm not helpless.

    Can you tell from my photo whether the batteries are wired correctly?

    I'm going to have to buy my own voltmeter and plan ahead for a day with zero power to do this - ack - no water, no internet!

    When handyman comes today for free troubleshooting with his voltmeter, I'll turn the system off. Question: What does getting a voltage reading "before and after the charge controller" mean?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 27, 2017
  11. DarkLight

    DarkLight Live Long and Prosper - On Hiatus

    Before - between the charging source (panel) and the charging controller, or before the charging current enters the charging controller.

    After - between the charging controller and the storage (batteries) or after the charging current has left the charging controller.
     
  12. DKR

    DKR Raconteur of the first stripe

    This measurement set does (or should) two things

    Shows the open or no load voltage of the panel in direct sunlight.

    So - everything off - voltage at the input to the Controller. (wires from the solar panel) Hopefully will see 16+ volts. Maybe even more - is a good thing.

    Everything still off - Voltage at the battery terminals. Should be 12.6 VDC (plus of minus a bit) on a good and fully charged battery. below 11VDC may indicate a problem - MAY. Wait till we see the measurements.

    Then,
    Controller ON,
    Inverter OFF

    Voltage at Controller input (this is the solar panel voltage from the panel under something of a load) and should still be well over 12 VDC

    Voltage at the battery terminals - should be around 13.8 to 14 VDC.

    Finally, Controller ON
    Inverter ON

    Voltage at battery terminals - just to have a base line.

    Pay attention to how the HM uses the voltmeter, you can make these same measurements - just nice to have someone show you the ropes...

    Looking forward to the readings

    Controller Input with
    Controller OFF____
    Controller ON____

    Battery terminals with the
    Controller OFF ________
    Controller ON _________

    Battery terminals with Controller and Inverter both ON _______

    BTW - we still need power use (WATTS) data on your water pump.
    BTW - you were never helpless - you just needed a bit of training and a tad of help. As they say - We can do this!
     
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  13. ghrit

    ghrit Bad company Administrator Founding Member

    You have those voltages to measure and you can also watch the battery voltage drop over a bit of full load running in full sun will give a clue as to system health but is of academic interest other than keeping track over a period of time as a qualitative trend. To add, measure the battery voltages separately, that will show if one is not as healthy as the other.

    BTW, since it seems that these are open, that is, not sealed, cells, a hydrometer should be in your future. While you're out for the multimeter and hydrometer, get a jug of distilled water, methinks you are going to need it.
     
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  14. oil pan 4

    oil pan 4 Monkey+++

    Hopefully the solar panels are making at least 18 volts when not connected to anything but the multi meter.
    Let's put it this way. I would use those batteries if I was going to use individual deep cycle type batteries.
     
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  15. Lilikoian

    Lilikoian Monkey

    Well, the guy had to buy a voltmeter and then call a friend to figure out how to use it. Sigh.

    He did discover there was a loose connection of all the lines on one of the batteries, so he wrenched it down. Opened the batteries and he said the water level looked ok but to get distilled water and fill them up to the top.

    Readings of each battery were 6.3 after tightening connection. He thinks the problem was the loose connection.

    He was unable to get any of the other requested readings. The numbers just kept moving around constantly from 3-14.

    I've ordered a USB fan, as the one I'm using now is 20-30 watts, so that will decrease my usage. Will get distilled water next time I'm in town.
     
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  16. Lilikoian

    Lilikoian Monkey

    Will get these later this week.
    Looks like I'll need to know more about how to measure the lines going into the controller, since HM didn't know how, and I even had him read DKR's post. It's hard to get good help.
     
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  17. ghrit

    ghrit Bad company Administrator Founding Member

    There should be a fill line someplace. Don't go above that, and make sure the plates are always covered.
     
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  18. Cruisin Sloth

    Cruisin Sloth Special & Slow

    THESE ARE NOT CAR BATTERS BUT GEL CELLS (NOT FOR THAT CHARGE CONTROLLER) IT WILL BOIL THEM & DEAD IN A YEAR !


    MOW THE LAWN Ms , AND AT NOON , MAKE SURE YOUR PANEL IS @ RIGHT ANGLES TO THE SUN (BEST YOU CAN DO) NO SHADING EVER !

    THAT IS A SQUAT LOAD , (BATTERYS KILLED) .
    yOU NEED TWO BATTERYS & ONE KID (NO SEX INVOLVED )
    iNVERTER IS SO-SO , BUT TO HELP ON A BUDGET !

    Sloth
    Kid is bought = : http://www.midnitesolar.com/pages/kid/index.php

    Buy once & don't get locked in Ms.

    PM me is fine
     
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  19. Dunerunner

    Dunerunner Brewery Monkey Moderator

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  20. Cruisin Sloth

    Cruisin Sloth Special & Slow

    Rereading ,
    Toss the junk & BUY real items , Im saying a KID & MS300 SS will do you loads .
    THEN for the wall warts (110Vac to 12V {or any other voltage } use a buck or voltage converter )
    EVERY TRANSFER COST MONEY OR POWER !!
    GIRL TO GUY COST AND MORE THE OTHER WAY !! ;)
    AC TO DC POWER COST
    LEARN THIS ELECTRICAL STUFF , IS SO EZ !! & MATH WORKS

    i HOPE YOUR OLD ! & can do math , calcs are fine
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 28, 2017
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