Are Precious Metals Being Quietly Confiscated?

Discussion in 'Financial Cents' started by Ardent Listener, Nov 26, 2008.

  1. Ardent Listener

    Ardent Listener Monkey+++

    be resisted within oneself.” — Kung Fu
    Are Precious Metals Being Quietly Confiscated?

    November 3, 2008 – In 1933 the U.S. government confiscated gold from the people. In 2008 is it covertly repeating that exercise?

    By Dave Eriqat

    Many people are aware that in 1933, President Roosevelt issued Presidential Executive Order 6102, explicitly confiscating gold from private citizens. Some chilling excerpts from that executive order include:
    Section 2. All persons are hereby required to deliver on or before May 1, 1933, to a Federal Reserve bank or a branch or agency thereof or to any member bank of the Federal Reserve System all gold coin, gold bullion, and gold certificates now owned by them or coming into their ownership on or before April 28, 1933, except the following:

    Section 3. Until otherwise ordered any person becoming the owner of any gold coin, gold bullion, and gold certificates after April 28, 1933, shall within three days after receipt thereof, deliver the same in the manner prescribed in Section 2;

    Section 9. Whoever willfully violates any provision of this Executive Order or these regulation or of any rule, regulation or license issued there under may be fined not more than $10,000, or,if a natural person may be imprisoned for not more than ten years or both; and any officer, director, or agent of any corporation who knowingly participates in any such violation may be punished by a like fine, imprisonment, or both.

    After the issuance of this executive order, any American owning gold was retroactively made a criminal and remained so until 1975 [1], even though the U.S. Constitution specifically states that only gold and silver may constitute money!
    The confiscation of gold in 1933 had little practical benefit, even though the U.S. dollar was still then backed by gold. It was more of a psychological assault on the populace, intended to coerce them into using U.S. dollars. It also enriched the politically-connected insiders who were still allowed to hoard gold when the price was arbitrarily raised from $20 per ounce in 1932 to $35 per ounce in 1934, a quick 75% gain for those in possession of gold. [2]

    While I cannot prove gold is being confiscated today, a number of curious observations have converged, making me wonder if a covert confiscation process is underway, specifically:
    • Prices are being relentlessly manipulated downward, apparently to dissuade people from purchasing precious metals. While many still argue against the theory that prices are being manipulated, I think the circumstantial evidence favoring manipulation is overwhelming.
    • The supply of precious metals, primarily at the retail level (where the masses buy it), is shrinking worldwide. All over the world dealers have shrinking stock to sell, delivery times are increasing and government mints are reducing sales to the public. The U.S. Mint, in particular, cites soaring demand as the reason for its stock depletion. While demand is certainly soaring, in times past the U.S. Mint has been able to satisfy much higher demand than today! So clearly soaring demand is not the sole explanation. Shrinking supply is also a factor. (By the way, falling prices amid shrinking supply and soaring demand is one of the prime arguments in support of the notion that prices are being manipulated.)
    • I see frequent TV commercials from companies offering to buy gold from the public, seemingly irrespective of market price movements. I can’t help but wonder if these companies are actually owned by the government or its agents. Even if they are not agents of the government, where do they sell the gold they collect? To the government? To the Federal Reserve? On the highly manipulated commodity futures market? The point is that the gold is being removed from the hands of the public and sequestered somewhere out of reach.
    • Central banks, which until recently were selling gold like mad to help depress the price, have abruptly ceased selling. Of course, that reduces the supply of physical metal available for ordinary folks to buy.
    • Finally, mining companies are seeing their stock prices pummeled, not to mention that at today’s prices it’s not cost-effective to even mine for precious metals, both of which will eventually reduce new supplies. And a significant portion of precious metal supply is extracted along with base metals, such as copper and zinc. But because demand and prices for these commodities have collapsed as well, the precious metal supply is reduced from that source too.
    If one recognizes that today virtually all markets – stocks, bonds, currencies, commodities, precious metals, and even real estate (bank bailouts, toxic MBS purchases, interest rate reductions, renegotiated mortgages) – are heavily manipulated by the powers-that-be, then looking at the above list it’s easy to believe that the PTB could be behind every one of these trends.
    If one wanted to effect a covert confiscation of precious metals, how would they go about it? They would quietly reduce the supply to keep people from getting their hands on precious metals, while encouraging the public to disgorge themselves of what precious metals they already held. And to thwart the law of supply and demand, which one would expect to cause precious metals prices to rise in a low supply/high demand environment, the prices can be manipulated in a forum that lends itself to that endeavor, such as the paper commodity futures market. (By the way, allowing the paper contracts bought and sold on the futures market to establish the price of physical metal is like allowing a market for apples to establish the price of oranges.)
    I’m not alone in my speculation about confiscation. Here’s an article from The International Forecaster, Slaves To The Orgy Of Money, that suggests something similar:
    In essence, this bottleneck between the wholesale and retail levels of the market in precious metals amounts to a de facto confiscation of gold and silver from the masses.

    In any case, most people in the US no longer own gold and silver. They are slaves to the orgy of money and credit that the Fed has provided, and they now worship paper over metal. This means that no confiscation is necessary to prevent the American sheople from having a place to store the value of their savings. All you have to do today is to keep US citizens from acquiring precious metals, first, by making it look too volatile to be a good investment, and second, by making it hard to acquire, especially in larger amounts. (My emphasis.)

    Why Confiscate?

    Today gold is theoretically even less relevant to the U.S. dollar than it was in 1933, but only theoretically. The U.S. dollar is, or until recently was “backed” by oil, since most of the oil on the planet is traded for dollars. The dollar is also “backed” by military muscle. Yet gold still holds tremendous psychological sway as a monetary alternative to dollars, sometimes even referred to as the “anti-dollar.” The Federal Reserve bank and central banks the world over hoard gold. Why? If the stuff has no value, if it is indeed a barbarous relic as has been asserted, they ought to sell it all. But they don’t because gold still provides an implicit psychological backing for fiat currencies. The fiat currency of a country that has no gold holdings would probably be trusted less than that of a country with gold holdings.
    Nevertheless, although central banks apparently still need gold to imbue some legitimacy to their fiat currencies, they don’t want too much of a good thing. If people wise up and start storing their wealth in gold rather than in fiat currencies, the former will increase in value and the latter will decline in value. Issuers of such fiat currencies obviously don’t want their sole “product” to decline in value. So the trick for them is to balance the appeal of gold against that of fiat currencies. They must maintain a high enough valuation for gold so that it remains a credible asset with which to back their fiat currencies, but not too high a valuation so that people flock to gold instead of fiat currencies.
    Today outright confiscation of gold makes little sense because U.S. dollars aren’t ostensibly backed by gold. Moreover, there are tens, if not hundreds of trillions of paper and electronic dollars floating around the globe. By contrast, all the gold ever mined from the earth is worth perhaps a couple of trillion dollars, and the amount of physical gold in the U.S. is probably worth no more than a few hundred billion dollars. So even if all the gold in the U.S. were confiscated it would amount to a figurative drop in the bucket compared to the amount of dollars circulating the planet. In other words, all that gold would do little to reinforce the backing of the currency. Overt confiscation of gold may, in fact, backfire and decimate the value of U.S. dollars, as people may view such an act as a desperate move to prop up a failing currency. Since dollars are used the world over, even though Americans may be deprived of alternatives to dollars, foreigners would not and they may well ditch their dollars specifically in favor of the very thing the U.S. wants to steer them away from: gold.
    So if the powers-that-be wanted to confiscate gold today, it would be best to do it in a covert fashion, so as to not alarm either Americans or foreigners. But why might the PTB wish to confiscate gold today?
    Demand among the masses is soaring. Remember, the PTB don’t want gold to become too desirable, but that’s exactly what is happening, so the genie must be stuffed back into the bottle.
    This is a critically important time for the U.S. dollar and it cannot withstand the advent of a viable alternative. It’s widely accepted that the U.S. is effectively insolvent, meaning it cannot pay its day-to-day obligations. That’s why it must borrow $2 billion per day to keep operating. Its national debt cannot be paid back either. Ultimately the U.S. will go bankrupt and its currency, the dollar, will be destroyed.
    Taking away as many alternatives to the dollar as possible, especially precious metals, is one way to extend the lifespan of the dollar. Perhaps once the dollar begins its final, irreversible descent to death is when the Amero will be introduced to replace it. Naturally, the people behind the Amero would not want a fledgling currency to have to compete with precious metals as a store of wealth, so weaning people off precious metals now might be part of the groundwork for the introduction of the Amero.
    Such preparations are especially imperative when one considers that outside the U.S. there is frequent talk of creating new regional currencies that are based on precious metals. Perhaps even the Amero might be based on precious metals, which is all the more reason to take precious metals off the market right now, to accumulate the backing asset for these new currencies.
    Another goal might be to steer people away from tangible stores of value, such as precious metals, and into paper realms which can be easily manipulated and looted, such as exchange traded funds, or ETFs. While in theory, ETFs are supposed to back each share with physical metal, I have my doubts, and I expect that ETFs will eventually devolve into the same kind of manipulated sham as the commodity futures market. Some observers have already noted discrepancies between physical metal and outstanding shares in some ETFs, and have even suggested that naked short selling is occurring. Not only is that not supposed to happen in a market that’s ostensibly 100% backed by physical metal, but naked short selling is a favorite tool for manipulation. Moreover, ETFs are managed by the very same insider corporations that are at the center of today’s financial storm. Can they really be trusted? Do they really have all the metal in their vaults that they claim? By contrast, one doesn’t have to trust physical metal, especially if it’s resting heavily in their own hands.

    I have no proof that a quiet confiscation of precious metals is underway, but it looks like a plausible possibility. There are some good reasons why such a confiscation might occur and why it might be done covertly.

    1. The Political and Economic Agenda for a Real Gold Standard, by Ron Paul.
    2. Historical gold prices.
  2. Jonas Parker

    Jonas Parker Hooligan

    Interesting theory. I wonder if the PPT has a PM division tasked with buying up silver coinage and gold bullion coins?

    Naw! I'm just paranoid... ;)
  3. franks71vw

    franks71vw Monkey+++

    precious metals are good to have around however i dont think you will convert gold into a bullet lead would be alot more wanted if you know what i mean...
  4. eeyore

    eeyore Monkey+++

    There are have been numerous reports that Gold is hard to get, i have not found it true, but i don't buy it in any large amounts.

    I would covert it two the 3 "b's" myself
    beans, band aids and bullets in that order, but that is me
  5. RouteClearance

    RouteClearance Monkey+++

    Buying gold certificates is rather easy right now. Buying actual gold is getting hard. The US Mint has suspended all sales of all silver and gold eagles intill further notice.

    My local dealer can only get very little new coins or bullion. He gets a lot of coin and bullion coming from main street because people are hard up for cash and are hawking almost everything that will get them quick cash.
  6. enough

    enough Monkey++

    Last I knew, US Mint was still shipping, but in small portions to authorized dealers. They have stated that they will discontinue some minted products. Did I miss a headline today?

    Please let me know, because I can get some eagles, and I'd like to grab them ASAP, if this is true.
  7. RouteClearance

    RouteClearance Monkey+++

    Yes the Mint is still shipping, and suspending their sales was a bit of an overstatement on my part, but the fact is that with the discontinuation of cetain products and releasing only a very small portion of new eagles, buying them on a regular basis is now a lot harder to do.

    If you have a source for 2009 eagles, then by all means snap them up if you can. The only authorized dealer where I live has only recieved 6 2009 silver eagles so far, and he does not know when he can get anymore.
  8. enough

    enough Monkey++

    I bought some silver eagles yesterday. I won't know the year, until they arrive. It was secondary market. Still a good deal, with just a fraction of the "premium".

    Half will likely stay home, and half will go to ebay.


    I wish I coulda bought a truckload of GOLD back when it was $200-$300 a ounce a few years ago.
  10. Panhead

    Panhead On the Loose Founding Member

    No but the lead bullet can convert into gold
  11. Cephus

    Cephus Monkey+++ Founding Member

  12. Brokor

    Brokor Live Free or Cry Moderator Site Supporter+++ Founding Member

    It is irrelevant at this point in time. With the numbers of convicted citizens on the rise continually, and the merging of the classes into the "rich" and "poor", effectively canceling out the middle class, the work is done for the bankers. The income tax, excise tax, property tax, sales tax, hell -name your tax, all have a contributing factor. The government does not need to go around "secretly" confiscating your gold -as was proven in 1933 - I say again, 1933!!!! Now, we are even more enslaved, more conditioned, less informed, and ill prepared to unite and resist tyranny than 80 years ago...I am sorry, but without clear proof, this recent "gold confiscation" is just another theory. Many of us know that the price of gold and other precious metals is rising, but we can still purchase them. The decline of the dollar is no surprise, and the future is paved with change -all current governments and their policies are subject to change, and the goal is a global monetary system, a global court system, a global police and military...a New World Order.

    We can not afford to distract ourselves with petty theories which have nothing substantial, no proof to back up the claims.
  13. fortunateson

    fortunateson I hate Illinois Nazis!

    There is definitely market manipulation when you see large brokers like KITCO out of stock while the market price does not move. When supply is low, price is supposed to move.

    Who and why? Dunno, but I can speculate that they want to protect their little fiat money ponzi scheme from the shiny yellow competition.
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