1. The Topic of the Month for October is "Make this the Perfect Bugout Location". Please join the discussion in the TOTM forum.

Book Burnings and Religion

Discussion in 'Faith and Religion' started by tacmotusn, Sep 9, 2010.

  1. tacmotusn

    tacmotusn Mosquito Sailor

    Religions of Peace, Christian and Muslim, a historical perspective.

    I recently had a friend say they were ashamed of the Crusades. Well I can agree that atrocities by Christians occurred during the Spanish Inquisition, life at that time, and before and after wasn't all love and harmony. People were even more illiterate and easily swayed than they are today. The biggest strongest liar often had quite a following. I don't quite remember if it was this person I was talking with or another, but regardless recently someone also stated that, ... Who did the Muslims ever attack, persecute, or subjugate? That question shocked me, as I was always taught that in the early days the Islamic faith was personally spread by Mohammad himself by the sword, one house or one village at a time. Submit, convert, believe or die. In response to my friends question I would suggest the reading of the first 2 links.
    There was also the question of who destroyed the Great learning Library in Alexandria, Egypt. It seems that question has multiple answers, and no answers. The last 2 links are about the Great Library in Alexandria. History is in no way clear on this, however, the library was founded by Alexander the Great in 283bc. In 48bc Julius Caesar is credited with destruction of the library by accident when fire spread after he had his own ships torched. In 391ad it is a confused toss up whether Christians, Jews or Pagans destroyed the library. There is also talk of much of the library's contents being transported to Constantinople in the 4th century. Circa 640/642ad Muslim Caliph Omar is credited with the final destruction of the library. It should be noted however that after 642ad no further mention of the library seems to be mentioned except as in a past tense. Before that time there was constant references to the library. Hmmmmm what does that make come to mind. Draw your own conclusions.




  2. bnmb

    bnmb On Hiatus Banned

    LOL...Well...maybe everybody should attack Macedonia, Mongolia, Germany and France...after all, we were the greatest conquerors in the world!
    What you're talking about is ancient history, but if Muslims were then that bad, we were worse! Should we expect attacks soon too? Should Muslims be attacked now for something in the past? Even though the entire world then was at war constantly?
    Anyways, it doesn't matter anymore...the wheels are turning since 1948 and there's no stopping now...Too bad that nukes didn't exist then...world would be much better place now..
  3. tacmotusn

    tacmotusn Mosquito Sailor

    I guess my points are: book burnings are nothing new. Neither is the strife between Christians and Muslims. And just for the record Muslims started the bloodbath. Whether Romans, Christians, Jews, Pagans, or Muslims burned the greatest learning center library of it's time, is anyones guess, but it was never anything but a memory after the Muslims had their crack at it. Religion of peace my butt. I could give a rats azz what you want to believe or not believe in! That's totally on you, and you have to live and or die with the results if any. What I don't want, is anyone trying to ram their beliefs down my throat. To each his own. I also believe in the golden rule, "do unto others as you would have them do unto you." Violent radical Christians pretty much died with the Crusaders. Christians are not persecuting and killing Muslims who want to live in peace with their neighbors. Christians immediately condemn rare radical so called Christians who stray from the path and take the lives of what they consider to be non-believers. Muslims who the world would have us believe are peaceful, relish and celibrate any radical Muslim attack on Christians. Many of the backwards azzed countries that have a majority islamic population, have terribly low literacy rates. This makes it real easy to lie to and sway the population. Peace Understanding and Education needs to be spread far and world wide in a non biased non religious manner. Then and only then is there any hope to see peace in this world. What's my problem with predomitately Muslim populations? Illiteracy, censorship, lack of freedom, lack of womans rights, female genital mutilation, different laws for women vs men, ignorance of the world, if my fingers were not now sore I could continue this list nearly indefinately.
  4. tacmotusn

    tacmotusn Mosquito Sailor

    Muslims need not be attacked for the ancient past at all. But, when did they ever quit attacking Christians and the west? Want examples? I can list for you plenty over the last 30 years or so and continuing now. Nukes did exist in 1948! If you doubt that, ask Japan.
  5. UGRev

    UGRev Get on with it!

    None of this is new. But there comes a point when you have to look at civilization in segments of time. There was a time when brutality was the norm and people lived in general fear. Some segments later, there birthed a new nation where men were free. To me, this marked a truly new beginning.

    I'd like to think that the barbarism inherent in many religions was washed away with the advent of science and reasoning. There is no reason for Islam to continue stoning people for crimes. Better systems have been developed; and as imperfect as they are, they are still light years more civilized than stoning or honor killings etc.
  6. bnmb

    bnmb On Hiatus Banned

    When I said about nukes then, I meant middle ages, not 1948... :)
    I think that these discussions about Muslims are becoming repetitive and non-productive...What will happen, will happen and there's nothing we can do about it...and I have a very bad feeling...
  7. Seawolf1090

    Seawolf1090 Adventure Riding Monkey Founding Member

    The Taliban (a particularly odious bunch of Islamofascists) have been burning books and destroying religious and historical art and monuments for decades - but nobody seems too flustered except the archaeologists.....

    Other Islamic elements have burned books too. So why the "H" should THEY not expect repercussions and similar treatment. People tend to do unto others as they have had done to them. Sorry, Muhamed - what goes around comes around! [beat]
  8. ghrit

    ghrit Ambulatory anachronism Administrator Founding Member

    Another viewpoint

    An Arab speaks out on Islam's majority and militant control --

    Ajami: Rauf and Islam's Encounter with America - WSJ.com

    In case the link fails in a day or two, the gist is that polls taken by a respected muslim web paper shows that a majority of muslims think that radicals are running the show, and the others are afraid to speak up.
  9. UGRev

    UGRev Get on with it!

    So this is their period of "Inquisition"? not buying it.
  10. tacmotusn

    tacmotusn Mosquito Sailor

    They already had their period similiar to the inquisition! Check my link at the start of the post to see what they were up to for 900 or so years just prior to the crusades.
    The crusades happened because Christians got tired of their crap.
  11. Laurieewb

    Laurieewb Monkey+

    The first known intentional book burning was in Alexandria Egypt with the burning of it library by Christians. 391 AD.
  12. tacmotusn

    tacmotusn Mosquito Sailor

    UNPROVEN. There were many forces at work and great unrest in Alexandria circa 391 AD. Possible disgruntled forces responsibility include Christians, pagans, Jews and others. My links bear out the uncertainy of the whole history of the Great (librarys) in Alexandria. There was more than one. However, discussions of the librarys as an ongoing place of learning continued beyond 391 AD. After the Muslims had their shot at destroying them on or about 640 AD or so, all discussion stops. Any thinking person would conclude that one or more or the librarys were still there after 391 AD. After 640 AD probably not.
    check out this link
    of note with regard to the earliest. Chinese Emperor, Qin Shi Huang 213 BC
survivalmonkey SSL seal        survivalmonkey.com warrant canary