Browning A5 / Remington 11

Discussion in 'Firearms' started by BTPost, Jan 1, 2016.


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  1. BTPost

    BTPost Old Fart Snow Monkey Moderator

    Original Post was by @runswithdogs

    Bonnie (above one also) & Clyde
    Bonnie_and_Clyde_Clean_and_jerk.

    That looks like a Browning Auto5 with a short Barrel, and a Chopped Stock...
     
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  2. JLRhiner

    JLRhiner Stranger in the Modern World

    Actually a Remington 20 ga Model 11.
     
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  3. BTPost

    BTPost Old Fart Snow Monkey Moderator

    Actually there is little difference between the two, as John Browning licensed the design, to Remington during WWII, while the Belgien FN Factory was under Nazi Control... I owned both versions, an FN, A5 and a Remington 11. I keep the Remington 11, as it was my GodFathers, who taught me to Hunt, and I gave the FN A5 to my Son, to be passed down thru my Male posterity... And since the picture was taken BEFORE 1939, Remington had not yet been Licensed to produce this design, so it is a FN Browning A5....
     
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  4. JLRhiner

    JLRhiner Stranger in the Modern World

  5. BTPost

    BTPost Old Fart Snow Monkey Moderator

    Best to go read the WikiPedia on the Browning Auto5/Remington11 Design and History....
     
  6. JLRhiner

    JLRhiner Stranger in the Modern World

    I lurk in and out.
    Why? Do they say something different than the sources I gave you?
     
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  7. BTPost

    BTPost Old Fart Snow Monkey Moderator

    Yes, they Document, that Remington only had a license to manufacture the Design, from 1941 to 1947... During WWII, while the Nazi's controlled the Belgein FN Factory... This is also backed by Browning Company History, as well.... I suspect you interpreted your Source, wrong... Your source showed that OEM manufacturing started in 1905, and that is a TRUE Fact, however where the mistake comes, is you thinking that Remington had a License to manufacture the Design, from the Brginning, which THEY never did... Browning has ALWAYS kept the Design Licenses of FireArms in-House, and only sold Manufacturing Rights to those designs, to OEMs, which kept him, and the Family in business, to this Day....

    Therefor, any Weapon built before 1941, must have been a Belgein FN Browning... and since the Picture of Bonny Barrow holding a weapon of this design, must have been taken before 1941, it must be a Belgein FN Brownibg Product...
     
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  8. Legion489

    Legion489 Shining the Light of Truth

    OK, I knew I had just read this not long ago, so I went and checked. According to Frank Hamer (he did not spell it "Hammer" as sometimes listed) it was a Remington M-11 20 ga. He was there at the shoot out and should know what he picked up.
     
  9. JLRhiner

    JLRhiner Stranger in the Modern World

    I went to the Wiki article that Bruce was using and it is very poorly written. Remington Model 11 production began in 1905, and continued until 1947. When the Nazis over ran the FN plant in Belgium in 1940, Browning licensed Remington to continue production of the Browning Auto-5 along side their already produced Model 11. From 1940 through 1947 Remington produced both models in the same production facility, the Model 11 without the magazine cutoff, and the A-5 with the magazine cutoff. Savage also produced an A-5 copy, the Model 720, starting in 1930.

    The shotgun in the photo is well documented, a 20 gauge Model 11 made to look like Clyde's "Whippet" BAR. I actually saw it somewhere, I don't remember if it was the Texas Ranger Museum or the Cody Museum (or somewhere else, I get around) and have always wanted to make one. But I just can't bear to cut up my Mdl 11.

    So Bruce was using the resources he had, and they were definitely mis-leading. That particular Wiki article needs to be edited bad, but I don't know how.
     
  10. Tikka

    Tikka Monkey+++

     
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  11. BTPost

    BTPost Old Fart Snow Monkey Moderator

    Looks like your source is better than mine... I defer to yours...
     
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  12. Tikka

    Tikka Monkey+++

    Bruce,
    The internet is filled with mistakes.

    But rare that a disagreement is settled with this much class
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 4, 2016
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  13. Tikka

    Tikka Monkey+++

    @3cyl
    That is why at 95% of the online forums; as it always yields a flame war folks don't waste their time. It is also why I and others are here.
     
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  14. VisuTrac

    VisuTrac Ваша мать носит военные ботинки Site Supporter+++

    You mean there are other forums out there?
     
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  15. Tikka

    Tikka Monkey+++

    Yup and I've lurked them. As a gardener, I wish I could get a few PU loads of that fine manure to till into my garden. I'd have every gardener here green with envy at the size of my yields.
     
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  16. Tikka

    Tikka Monkey+++

    I'm curious
    Why was my post edited by a moderator? As I said nothing offensive; I'd appreciate an explanation as I said nothing wrong.
     
  17. BTPost

    BTPost Old Fart Snow Monkey Moderator

    It was a Merge error, on my part... Just trying to keep multiple posts, in a row from a single Monkey to a minimum... Sorry about that.... It would be better to edit your posts to ADD content, than do multiple posts in a row... Makes the Site Database Cleaner... If you repost, what is missing I can add it back in...
     
  18. D2wing

    D2wing Monkey

    It seems many of the gun articles on Wikipedia are way out of whack. Yeah actually US rights were bought by Remington and most of the early US versions were made by Remington. I looked it up before I bought a new version A5 a few weeks ago. The new ones have a Benelli type recoil action.
     
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  19. 3cyl

    3cyl Monkey

    Why was my post deleted? Merged with Tikkas?
     
  20. BTPost

    BTPost Old Fart Snow Monkey Moderator

    See post #17. My mistake, Sorry... If you repost the content I will fix it...
     
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