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"caretaker" hopes,... dashed yet again....!

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by dragonfly, Oct 29, 2011.

  1. dragonfly

    dragonfly Monkey+++

    I had 2 emails of 2 different couples that were interested in going to my place, and helping provide security as I provide other amenities.( to be arranged!) Oh well....that's the way it goes! Emails traded, phone calls made, and they both were supposed to call me back this evening. NO one did. But they know the basic area, as they live from about 35-70 miles in either direction up north of the land. They live in northern Arizona, are in that altitude and higher, and they know all about the winters and road conditions. No "babes in the woods" type of experience. Both were ret. military and law enforcement. They have their supplies, equipment, vehicles, and travel or 5th wheel trailers. All set and ready to roll...But for some reason, they didn't contact me this evening. Maybe they read some of my posts here ? And figured they'd be better off in some foreign and distant land? Like a war zone?
    I May never know what happened.....
    I really got my hopes up too....With experienced people in military and law enforcement, I'd have the better of both worlds! Guess it's back to the drawing board!
  2. dragonfly

    dragonfly Monkey+++

    Perhaps I have discovered the error! (mine!!!)
    That word: "caretaker" has certain connotations attached to it....
    It refers to taking care of a place, "generally" speaking, one that is already in place. Meaning a home, a cabin, or whatever exists, as a domicile, and then the amenities to follow: food, electricity, phone, satellite tv hookup, internet hookup, maybe even a guest house and pay. Some asked earlier on about a 4 bedroom home, a nurse (24/7)for their 80+ year old mother, and a heated pool! (Then there was the $200 to $400 a week pay requests)
    That's where I went wrong!
    So, with that in mind, what "word" best describes the scenario?
    Land ( I am willing to share, even sign a contract as it were) allowing those that would move there, certain inalienable rights on that land. For either a specific period of time or "open" ...I'm easy (Not for sale and not being given away)
    There is land, there are rocks ( most are volcanic) and there are Juniper and Cedar trees, which are small in stature, nothing you can build with. (as we refer to them as landscaping BUSHES!)
    There is a major aquifer beneath the suface, some say 30 feet deep, some say less. I know it's there as there are 2 natural artesian wells to the north and south of the land ( 600-700 feet) that come to the surface.
    No streets ( paved) only dirt ones that are nomore thna trails. Isolated and desolate. At least 5milesfrom town asthe crow flies. It takes about 45 minutes to get into town on a dry day! The altitude is from 5,200 to 5,400 feet ( I have never measured the exact altitude) There are 4 seasons, not like in Phonix, (we have only 2 here, hot and worse!) It rains, it snows, it gets cold and the wind blows at times, up to 50 mph.
    I have had people that wanted to stay up there in a tent...some wanted to build a sandbag home, some wanted to cut down my trees to build a log cabin, some wanted to build earthen domes! All wanted me to support them.
    My last (before these as mentioned above) was from Illinois and there were 3 people, then there were to be 5, then 7 inclding friends, and they needed me to support and house and feed them for no less than 90 days, probably more....I had to supply everything even a vehicle,AND ( it gets better!) I had to see to it that 2 of their children were driven into town each day to school, then back again!Ok, well you can see where that went. I have had some strange requests, and even some that required I allow them to raise hundreds of Pygmy goats!
    I'll let you TELL me, what would you do IF you were in my position?
    I cannot move a thing up there, unless it is secured.
    I can't have a part time person, one that can "visit" on weekends, sometimes.
    A very good example is my so called former "caretaker", he took alright... He took me for almost $8,000. and a Ford Bronco.
    He went from being a good guy that traveled some 700 miles from california, on my word alone...
    He went from being a challenge, to a liability to a DRAMA QUEEN!
    That's where I managed to get after a lot of time, converstaions, money and hassles.
    It's not as easy as I first thought, and it's getting worse.
  3. Seawolf1090

    Seawolf1090 Adventure Riding Monkey Founding Member

    Seriously, IF I could afford the loss, I'd bail on this property. The locals see you as an 'outsider' to be fleeced, taken advantage of and stolen from - you are their 'golden goose' to be plucked at their pleasure. Anything you take and leve there, will be taken by them. The only real way to stop that is to shoot a few of them, like coyotes or any other useless damaging varmint.
    But.... the local Law Enforcement and judges seem to be on the take too, or at least unable/unwilling to help you. Probably have some family among the looters.....
    If you can't take the loss, then you do need a person/people to oversee the place - "Overseers", maybe? Someone who has the moxie and the grit to stand up to the abuse and anger that will be aimed towards them - afterall, they arre preventing the bubbas from looting you! How crass!

    Problem is, it's always hard to find good help, who won't also take advantage of you. Be better if you had some of your own family to install out there.....
    dragonfly likes this.
  4. larryinalabama

    larryinalabama Monkey++

    I have a rental house that I have trouble with IM thinking of moving into it but it would add 15 miles to my daily drive.

    Try advertising Free Rent in exchange for work, Ill bet you get a bunch of responses
    dragonfly likes this.
  5. Gray Wolf

    Gray Wolf Monkey+++

    I tried that with some rent houses, it never worked for me. All I got was a bunch of freeloaders and the work never got done.
    dragonfly and Cephus like this.
  6. TXKajun

    TXKajun Monkey++

    dragonfly, I've been following your saga to get someone to watch over your place in the mountains for quite a while now. Wowzers. Just wowzers!

    You've gone to a lot of work, expense and agony. I truly feel for you. After all this time, I'm wondering if there's going to be a good solution, i.e. finding someone willing to move up there and keep an eye on things for you as you prep up there and not rip you off more than you've already been ripped off or ask ridiculously for the sun, moon and stars. From the sounds of things and the history of your situation, I'm starting to think maybe not. Bummer!

    Now to get to the point of my post. :) I am thinking that you aren't alone in what you've gone through. That there's a whole bunch of folks who have found the "ideal" location, made the investment, done their due diligence, etc only to find themselves in a similar situation. "Got the place, got the $$ to start fixing up, but can't move stuff up there cuz it'll get ripped off, can't move there myself yet, can't trust the folks up there to watch over stuff like they're supposed to, like the sheriff or deputies, and, in general, feeling like I made a big mistake. Now, how do I salvage anything from this???" Anyone else got any stories that are similar or know of someone who was in a similar situation??? I'd love to hear about it and how/if it got solved.

    Nope, I don't have an answer, only sympathy. As far as what to call the person or persons, maybe "landsitter" or "unpaid guard"?

    Best of luck to you.

    Oh, one last thought. How bout you actually charge folks to come up there and have a more or less unsupervised "wilderness survival experience" where they help watch over things *get experience guarding a location in a true survival mode) as well as build a permanent shelter (construction experience from the ground up), dig a well, start chickens and pigs and rabbits, etc?? Course, they'd have to sign a release leaving you blameless for anything stupid they did up there! Heck, shop the idea around to some of the reality tv series! Who knows??

    dragonfly likes this.
  7. jungatheart

    jungatheart Beginner's Mind

    Sorry but I don't trust anyone anymore and would try to find a way to get your plan done without others. I know it's easy for me to sit here and offer advice but people suck and good ones are by far the exception. Few of my plans that relied on others have worked out but most of them where I relied on myself have succeeded.

    Also, I don't seem to trust what people say about themselves on the internet. Believe it or not I've corresponded with people claiming to be LEO or Military when they weren't.

    Joseph Campbell said: "Follow your bliss and doors will open for you that you didn't even know were there."
    dragonfly likes this.
  8. Big Kahuna

    Big Kahuna Monkey++

    Dragonfly, I enjoy your posts

    but I just can't see what you are trying to accomplish. You live in Phoenix. That area has a population of over 4 million people! If a grid-down event happens in the summer, they will all have to head north. There is no other direction they can go. 4 million people moving in one direction! They can reach your "retreat" easily in an afternoon by car, or 4 or 5 nights on foot. It's only 150 miles. They will spread out in the hills and mountains north of Phoenix. Most of them are people who would rob you blind in good times and even more so in bad times. They will overrun your "retreat" like locusts.

    If you had good neighbors, you could organize for mutual defense. But apparently you don't. With all due respect, I think your situation is hopeless.

    By the way, if you ever have to leave Phoenix as a refugee, I think you might stand a better chance of getting through if you travel north from Lake Pleasant on the road through the Bradshaw Mountains (Senator Highway).
    dragonfly likes this.
  9. beast

    beast backwoodsman

    if it wasnt so late in the year id seriously consider landsitting for you dragon
    its gettin too late to move into a place like that and hunker down for winter
    what id asy you need is a good perimeter fence, locust brush, barberries, something wicked to walk thru
    and a pair of eyes and ears on duty 24/7
    for the coming winter id let it all go, theyre gonna steal anything you have up there already, just take it somewhere else TIL spring
  10. dragonfly

    dragonfly Monkey+++

    Until spring, May or April, it's hopeless...
    Now there is snow on the ground and a storm heading thru that will dump 6-10/12 inches more of snow. No time to do anything now like collect and store firewood. When the snow gets deep, you are not gettng in or out. No water runs can even be made....Right after the snow melts, you have deep mud.
    So, I am (stuck) here until that time.

    As far as being "overrun", it's not really a major concern. You'd have to see the area and know there are few roads, all bad, and the last 2 motorcycles that came thru ( locals) got busted up pretty badly. There is NO water, NO women, No food, No trees usable ( as in shelter), No reason to even venture into that patch of desert, when there are better pickings (small towns) all over the area, along the major roads...There is a "network" of sorts...where one person that lives close to the road coming out, will call others and the word passes fast. There are easier to get to places, large homes, places with plenty of food, weapons, ect., that are in a line along 2 major roads, that we all realize are easy "targets" for any "intruders". Where most are, they can be easily seen and found in just a matter of minutes. They chose their land/sites based on ease of getting to and from town, and major highways.
    I chose my places based on: 1) isolation 2) water 3) concealment.
    I only know of one other person that has only the "concealment" factor in their favor, and they are still easily accessed, via a dirt road. Latest satellite photos show his tracks going in and out of the area, as plain as if it were a major paved highway. He's "toast". I can see where many would naturally assume that the area will be overrun by outsiders, seeking a place in the mountains. They will have to go further east by 35 miles or more, to get into the BLM/National Forest, where there are REAL trees and wildlife in abundance. BUT, they'll run into a LOT of people already out there, (squatters) and locals that have set up a "retreat" or fallback defensive position. Not many will ever penetrate that barrier. They are avid hunters and they view the forests as theirs......
    The biggest threat which has been taken into account, the locals....( count: 7-8) "We" know: who, what, where, their weapons, their capabilities, even their ammo count.
    They have been carefully watched and studied, and yes, they do pose a threat to a degree. But that threat has been pretty well nullified, as "we" have taken "steps" to align with certain individuals that are basically a "coalition" as it were. The bad guys are outnumbered and outgunned. The best part is, the bad guys are already bugging out, due to the increased Police presence in the town and the outlying areas. Since most ( not all) are felons, in posession of weapons ( some are still "wanted") and that scares the crap out of them. So they are looking to re-locating, as far away as the State of Washington!
    Yes, it could be better, but it could be worse too! I view the whole thing as a challenge, and even IF I don't get any help at all, I can still do what I intend to do. My biggest problem is MOTHER NATURE!
    I Can't do a lot about that!
  11. Clyde

    Clyde Jet Set Tourer Administrator Founding Member

  12. dragonfly

    dragonfly Monkey+++

    I tried to get "family" involved, but that did not go past earshot!
    Either I'm the craziest person in the world, or, I'm old and have gone senile...That's the consensus of the whole scenario!
    Be that as it may be, I will eventually ( somehow) get moved up north and then they can all enjoy the city!
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