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constitutional convention a possibility???

Discussion in 'Freedom and Liberty' started by Tango3, Dec 11, 2008.

  1. Tango3

    Tango3 Aimless wanderer

    This could be really bad ,(.66%) 34 states are needed to request a constitutional convention( in which the entire constitution is open for editing) 32 have already registered, ohio is voting a referendum to call for one,meaning we'd be one state away from wholesale constitutional revision..
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 26, 2015
  2. enough

    enough Monkey++

    WHOA! Is that for real?

    Have any other info on it? Has Michigan approved?
  3. Tango3

    Tango3 Aimless wanderer

    Campaign for Liberty - Reclaim the Republic. Restore the Constitution.

    Constitution and Libertarian Parties of Ohio among those working to defeat a bill calling for US Constitutional Convention | Independent Political Report

    Constitution and Libertarian Parties of Ohio among those working to defeat a bill calling for US Constitutional Convention

    December 11th, 2008<!-- by paulie cannoli --> · 3 Comments

    Found at PeaceChicken.com:
    Good news: we were all able to testify against the bill today, and we gave them a response they weren’t expecting. There were 10 of us who spoke out against it, ZERO who spoke in support.
    Members from Campaign for Liberty, Ohio Freedom Alliance, We Are Change Ohio, John Birch Society, Institute for Principled Policy, Constitution Party of Ohio, and the Libertarian Party of Ohio showed up in support, most of them testified.
    After seeing how many of us came, Committee Chairman Blessing changed his mind and decided not to vote on it today. In fact, he acted like it was a mistake that the paper said “possible vote.” Teri (OFA, JBS, CPO) thinks it’ll probably be voted on at the next committee meeting (which will also probably not include further testimony) so we’ll need to keep watching. The Senate version was introduced yesterday as well, but last I heard it hasn’t yet been assigned to a committee. Still another thing to keep an eye on.
    The committee had some questions and a couple repeatedly voiced concerns, enough so that I definitely think we have a good shot at getting this defeated.
    Anthony from We Are Change Ohio recorded all of our testimonies and hopes to have a video put together by Friday, I’ll post it here as soon as I get it.
    Everybody’s testimonies were GREAT, here are three of them:
    Ohio House Judiciary Committee - HJR 8 Opposition Testimony
    Frank Koch
    Chairman Blessing and members of the House Judiciary Committee, thank you for the opportunity to testify today in opposition to House Joint Resolution 8.
    As fiscal conservative, I’m in complete agreement that something must be done to limit federal spending and reverse our growing $10 trillion dollar debt currently enslaving our country and our children.
    I stand before you not against fiscal responsibility, but against the method in which you plan to implement to limit the federal government. A Constitutional Convention is a very deadly tool to use because the states have little power to control which sections of the Constitution will be opened for manipulation. Article V of the Constitution says that only Congress, not the States, can appoint delegates to the Constitutional Convention. The fate of our liberties, freedoms, and rights will be in the hands of these few select delegates who could be ignorant of the law or in the pocket of special interests.
    An unbalanced federal budget is caused from irresponsible leadership within Congress and not a flaw within the Constitution. In fact, an unbalanced federal budget is caused directly from not following the Constitution. We’ll be on the right track to fix our $10 trillion dollar debt if we started to cut the wasteful and unconstitutional federal programs such as Department of Education, Department of Energy, and Homeland Security.
    Lastly, I would like to point out a potential Trojan horse within the proposed resolution that could render the resolution powerless. Within the resolution it states, “First, the amendment shall require the President to submit and the Congress to adopt only balanced budgets for all federal programs and agencies, except in times of war.” The statement “except times of war” may encourage the President and Congress to start and prolong wars as long as possible to escape the peacetime fiscal restraints. I ask you to please reconsider the wording of this resolution if you choose not to oppose the Constitutional Convention.
    In conclusion, I find it quite disturbing how fast this resolution is being pushed through the House. One must proceed slowly and with extreme caution before even considering a radical action such as a Constitutional Convention. America, with a few strokes of the pen, can be transformed from a Constitutional Republic into a Socialist Dictatorship and we’ll be at the complete mercy of the delegates that will change the Constitution as to how they see fit. I, as a liberty loving American, am not willing to take that chance.
    Ohio House Judiciary Committee - HJR 8 Opposition Testimony
    Robert Owens
    I want thank Chairman Blessing and the members of the committee for allowing me to speak today. My name is Robert Owens, I am a lawyer from Delaware, Ohio and I am an active member and leader in a number of Christian conservative organizations that embrace the time tested and proven concepts of limited constitutional government, free enterprise and individual liberty bestowed upon us by our creator. I urge you to vote no on HJR 8.
    Here are some of the possible results of a “run away” article 5 convention as described of by U.S. Supreme Court Chief Justice Warren Burger:
    1. Total civilian disarmament.
    2. Socialization of industry.
    3. Confiscation of private property.
    4. Torture of citizens.
    5. Suppression of the Press and of Religion
    If you started this day unaware of the reasons and legal arguments of a Chief Justice of the Supreme Court that talks of a “run away” convention and,
    If you started this day unaware that a totally different ratification process than what you might expect is perfectly lawful and consistent with legal precedent, and
    If you started this day unaware that if a article 5 convention is called in the next two years, Nancy Pelosi and her team would get to choose how delegates are selected, how they are paid, where the convention would be held and if the convention were to be held in public or in secret. And,
    If you started today unaware that Ohio would be the 33rd state in the history of the republic to call for the convention and that 34 is the magic number to forcibly trigger Congress to call the convention. Then caution is urged.
    If any or all of these facts were unknown to you, please do not risk giving Congress a blank check without doing all the research. We are talking about possible political suicide to the conservative movement. This move must be carefully examined, not hurried through a December session without scrutiny.
    One point of irony should not be missed in this process. If Congress actually followed the Constitution, we would have a balanced budget and there would be no need for this committee to consider this resolution. What makes anyone think Congress would be limited by new rules if it does not follow the existing ones?
    The proposed convention could have devastating effects upon our American tradition of being a free people. This tradition has made us the most prosperous nation and the most charitable nation in the history of the world.
    Ohio House Judiciary Committee - HJR 8 Opposition Testimony
    Laura Robeson
    Chairman Blessing, members of the Committee, I’m here today to speak out in opposition to this bill because of its potentially massive and irreversible ramifications.
    While I am certainly in favor of a balanced federal budget, this is not the right way to bring it about. It’s not an error in our Constitution that is resulting in our massive debt, it’s much more complicated than that, and holding a Constitutional Convention will not solve the problem. You would do better to support Ron Paul’s HR 2755 legislation which would abolish the Federal Reserve System and return the monetary power to Congress and the Treasury.
    Not only the lack of necessity, but also the speed with which this is being shuffled through is very worrisome. Both the recent banking industry bailouts and the Patriot Act have shown us what can happen when legislation is rushed through before doing proper research and planning. How educated is everybody here on what a Convention really entails? Not since 1787 has there been one, and this was when the Articles of Confederation were completely thrown out. Who’s to say the same won’t be done with our Constitution?
    30 states have passed bills similar to HJR 8 and 7 have since realized the danger and rescinded them.
    In Alabama’s HJR 347 (2000), it says:
    “There is great danger … in opening the Constitution to sweeping changes, the adoption of which would only create legal chaos in this nation and only begin the process of another two centuries of litigation over its meaning and interpretation.”
    Idaho’s SCR 129 (1999) states:
    “…the Constitution of the United States of America has been amended many times in the history of this nation and may be amended many more times, without the need to resort to a constitutional convention.”
    And in New Hampshire’s HCR 12 (2003), it says:
    “…the New Hampshire legislature urges all other states that have applied to Congress to call either a general or a limited constitutional convention to repeal and withdraw their applications.”
    I strongly urge this committee to heed the advice of our fellow states and vote against this bill.
    THANKS to everybody who came out today to testify, esp. those who drove quite a while to make it. I think we made a huge difference, much to their dismay — this isn’t turning out to be a walk in the park as they had hoped.

    1 skizex // Dec 11, 2008 at 2:25 am
    Like anybody’s gonna know when it isn’t ALL OVER national tv <- and that’s where their minds have been warped by talking heads, if they even watch ‘the news’ or maybe especially if they do…- with video games dvds movies mp3s- hypnotic saturation who has time…and so many Obamacized - sorry if I’m so cynical…must be the chemtrails…
    Yet, some seem to care -like the kid who showed the new history book of his middle school to the world- Yes, chapter 33 ‘America in The New World Order’ » New World Order Being Taught In Schools Alex Jones' Infowars: There's a war on for your mind!
    Looks like it’s here/history.
    Cudos to the folks on the front lines, red alert all!
    Going to be an interesting 2009, eh?
    oming to w/ his appts to his team…what about the news that Harper suspended Parliament in Canada? Shouldnt that be on the front page too?

    2 Clayton Jones // Dec 11, 2008 at 8:49 am
    The NWO has pulled out all of the stops! They are not playing around! They have declared a “WAR ON LIBERTY!” I can just hear them in their smoking fellow cloisters jovially patting each other on the back as they sit before a Gothic fireplace sipping on Napoleon wine, “The God Damned Republic is finally dead Amen…” The Republic is not dead, it will not die, and those who have perpetrated these so many acts of treason will pay when the people stand up and Americans will stand up and fight. No national guard, no contrived food shortage, no engineered plague, no false flags, and no congress will abolish our LIBERITES. It’s time men! It is your moment in destiny how shall the men of this age be remembered. I for one, wish to have written on my head stone. “A Patriot Tried and True. Died for Liberty and God” What say you? Are you going to allow a Constitutional Convention by a bunch of Socialist/Fascist, the likes of Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid re-write the Constitution? NOT I, NOT I!!!

    3 Steven R Linnabary // Dec 11, 2008 at 3:10 pm
    I’ve been asking around, but NOBODY I have talked to in the OH LP has heard anything about this.
    There MAY be some Ohio Libertarians involved. Nobody knows who they are, though.
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  4. ghrit

    ghrit Ambulatory anachronism Administrator Founding Member

    By the last post (per Laura Robeson testimony) 30 states considered, passed, and then 7 rescinded their resolutions to convene. Looks to me like there are then only 23 (so far) states in favor. That being apparently so, how is it that Ohio is next to last in favor? Or did I miss something? Is there a place we can see the actual count by state?

    Either way, we can hope OH does NOT pass the resolution.

  5. Tango3

    Tango3 Aimless wanderer

    I was shocked by the whole darn thing first I've heard of any of it...
  6. hacon1

    hacon1 Monkey+++


    New Hampshire
    New Mexico
    North Carolina
    North Dakota
    South Carolina
    South Dakota

    You can rescind your vote but it will probably be challenged in the court system.
  7. monkeyman

    monkeyman Monkey+++ Moderator Emeritus Founding Member

    Im not real optimistic that it would go well for liberty if it happened but the Con Con COULD in fact be a good thingIF we had good people in office to attend it. Basicly I have been hearing rumors quite a bit over thelast few years of states considering secession if the Feds dont follow the spirit of the Constitution and protesting the invasion of the federal into the local. IF we had good men to attend and run it then just as easily as all of the horible things mentioned happening, they could close the created loopholes that the feds use to walk over the Constitution and flesh out some of it perhapse to make sure that its spirit is stated in such a way as to make sure its harder to walk on.

    Either way, Im sory to say, I dont see that it could do any real harm anymore. We already have leaders who thumb their noses at the Constitution with impunity and a government that blatantly ignores its tenants and citizens as well as the rest of the leaders andother supposed guardians of the Constitution who do nothing to enforce it. So in short it hasalready died. At worst it gets recognized and burried, at best it gets revived and maybe given new found teeth.

    .....just a differentpossible prospective on it.....
  8. Conagher

    Conagher Dark Custom Rider Moderator Emeritus Founding Member

    That is where the problem lies, having the right people at the Con Con. With Pelosi, Hildabeast, Schumer, etc, having some control over who gets to be on the Committee, then we might as well just give up all of our freedoms, because they do not have the "peoples" best interest at heart. The problem with government today is, it's all about them and the politicians' paychecks.

    They could give a rat's arse about the freedoms or rights of the people. It's all about socialistic medicine, gun control, taxes, giving taxpayer's money to the people that are too lazy to get off of welfare, etc.
  9. hacon1

    hacon1 Monkey+++

    Ohio defeated the measure and will not be on the list.
  10. QuietOne

    QuietOne Monkey++

    Thank goodness. Monkeyman, there will be NO good people at such a convention, only the power-hungry psychopaths who are now trying to destroy what is left of liberty in the USA.
  11. monkeyman

    monkeyman Monkey+++ Moderator Emeritus Founding Member

    What liberty would that be? I kind of figure for it to be liberties it must be rights and I have a hard time thinking of ANYTHING that our government dosent already figure is a PRIVLAGE that can be taken from us if them deem it best. Free speech? How sure are you you wouldnt have men in suits show up if you made strong enouph statments against the gov and folks in power and were heard enouph? Freedom of religion? Didnt seem to work real well for the folks in Texaswith unpopular religions that got their kids yanked and only returned after many months and concessions. RKBA (2A)? Try buying a gun from a shop while on vacation in another state, gov wont give you permission.

    Like I say, as sad as it is, I dont know how much they could hurt now since the people have become so willing to allow it that the Constitution is no longer honored anyway and as such the gov considers rights to simply be privliges that they can regulate. For a prime example look at DCS handgun ban. It clearly contradicts the Constitution and Heller took it to the SCOTUS and they agreed and said it was unconstitutional and that it was a RIGHT for law abideing citizens to own handguns. DC then scrambles and makes an obsticaal coarse of red tape so people 'can' get PERMISSION to own a handgun in DC and still deny Heller even after the SCOTUS said specificly in his case he had a right to own one. He still hasnt been allowed to get a permit last I heard.

    So worst case, they make the paper match the reality we allow. Then realisticly we continue to live with it, alternatly it wakes folks up and the people take us back to the original constitution. Best case, we actualy by some mirical wind up with the folks there makeing good calls and simply strengthening whats there already.
  12. ozarkgoatman

    ozarkgoatman Resident goat herder

    If people want to see freedom in country again they will have to stand up and take it. No one is going to give it back to us. [gun2][freedom]

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