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Dirty Harry says

Discussion in 'Freedom and Liberty' started by chelloveck, Sep 15, 2011.

  1. chelloveck

    chelloveck Diabolus Causidicus

    The full text can be found in the online edition of GQ magazine in an interview with Leonardo Di Caprio and Clint Eastwood (The Leo Tapes / Entertainment section) (slide 4 of 6 slides)

    Leonardo Dicaprio and Clint Eastwood GQ October 2011 Cover Story: Movies + TV: GQ

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  2. Minuteman

    Minuteman Chaplain Moderator Founding Member

    And we should give a @$#* what these Hollywierd elitists think?

    Dirty Harry is a fictional character. And I don't think he had anything kinky in mind when he said "go ahead punk, make my day!"

    Clint Eastwood, on the other hand, is a typical leftist, liberal, actor.
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  3. chelloveck

    chelloveck Diabolus Causidicus

    I know the difference between

    I know the difference between a fictional character and the actor who portrays him....though I would guess that some would be just as keen to grasp onto the anti gay marriage viewpoints of much the same kind of Hollyweird elitists....it's probably just a matter of allegiance and perspective I guess. He does make some valid points though from a libertarian perspective, which you have not deigned to comment upon. Poisoning the well by attacking Clint, doesn't invalidate his thesis.
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  4. Minuteman

    Minuteman Chaplain Moderator Founding Member

    I didn't read the article. Don't have any desire to. I don't really care what he thinks. Now if they do an interview with Tom Selleck, that I would read.
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  5. jasonl6

    jasonl6 Monkey+

    I like Clint as an actor. I don't need his opinions on who should get married and who shouldn't i can read that for myself in the B-I-BLE (Sunday school song for those that don't know).

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  6. Akaiken

    Akaiken Monkey+

    Why, of course! Lets take away other people's rights because my religion says so! </sarcasm>

    I'm just gonna leave this here:
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  7. Minuteman

    Minuteman Chaplain Moderator Founding Member

    The debate in America over same sex marriage is not about what religion does or doesn't say about it. And I am assuming you aren't from the US becuse your graphic has an Australian web address. So I assume you are a friend of Chelly's. The debate is whether a small minority can force their lifestyle, their choices upon the majority.

    Nobody cares if they want to live together and even if they find some liberal preacher to marry them. What the vast majority of Americans object to is the gay agenda to force people to accept their lifestyle as normal and to sanction it.

    I for one am not against it per se. I believe it is wrong and that it is condemned by God but if that's their choice then that's their risk. Love the sinner, hate the sin. And most Christians I know feel the same way. I might preach against it but I would be the first to minister to any person who asked for it or needed it.

    But I like most Americans do not want to be forced to accept something that we feel is an aberration for the sake of liberal PCism.
    I personally don't think government has any business in the marriage business. That is a matter for the church not the state.
  8. Akaiken

    Akaiken Monkey+

    Actually I'm a born and raised American Citizen, that website is "Au.org" Not ".Au" so it's not an australian url. It's "Americans United" Though I really haven't checked out the website, I just think that image conveyed what I would try to say better than I could.

    To be honest I've just been lurking about watching the twitter feed but when I saw this post I had to add something so I don't really know anyone here, I'm pretty new.

    Now, let me just get this out of the way so you know where I'm coming from. I'm a lesbian, I have no "agenda" I just want to be able to get married, that's "Get married to" not "form a civil union with" the girl I love. I just don't want to be told that I'm less than any other American because I love a woman not a man.

    Haha, being gay is not a choice. Oh man, if it were a choice I don't see why anybody would force themselves to go through this nonsense. It's ridiculous. If I could, I'd be straight in a heartbeat. But I can't. I tried before and it killed me, it was all just faking and lying to myself and everyone around me. You can't pretend to love someone, it doesn't work like that.

    I don't know about you, but would you rather let two gays marry or have one of them fake being straight and marry your daughter?

    I currently attend a christian church that, I suppose you would call it pretty "liberal". With them, being LGBT is fine and the pastor explained to me that they don't take the bible as "literal" I suppose.

    I mean, I don't know about you but, I eat shrimp, pork, wear shirts of two different cloths, and so forth. Nobody seems to make a big deal out of those.

    You don't need to 'accept' it, America just need to stop making it illegal. It's like, if you don't like or accept people who drink alcohol, you don't need to get into their business about it. You aren't being forced to drink alcohol just because it's legal so it shouldn't be affecting you at all.

    I would much prefer marriage just being a church issue, but really it's not much of a church issue at all. That typical "marriage" is just the ceremony.
    The marriage I'm fighting for is the right to be recognized as a marriage by the federal government. It's not really about the religious issues people have, although that's all anybody seems to focus on, it's about the fact that the federal government gives thousands of benefits to a married couple that a gay couple could not get even if they got a 'civil union'.

    I know there are a lot of reasons people are against Gay Marriage, if you're up for discussion I'll do my best to answer honestly and not give silly sarcastic internet answers.
  9. oth47

    oth47 Monkey+

    I don't have a problem with gay men and lesbians.My problem is with those who try to make me believe homosexual activity is "natural","normal" "loving" "stable" and "committed".
  10. Akaiken

    Akaiken Monkey+

    No more or less so than any other relationship. That's what it is after all, a relationship.

    Allow me to address your issues, I guess becoming one of the ones you have a problem with:

    "Natural" -- well, assuming by 'natural' you mean 'occurs in nature' well, yes, yes it does.

    "Normal" -- Normal is defined by the majority, so I'll give you that one. Realistically though, the only 'normal' people are the ones you don't know very well...

    "Loving" -- It's a relationship, of course it's loving. What else would it be if not loving? What reason would there be, to go through all of the **** that has to get waded through, if not for love?

    "Stable" -- defined as 'able or likely to continue or last.' Well, I've been with my girlfriend a little over a year now and we never fight. That's longer than some heterosexual marriages last. Stability, in my opinion, relies on the two people involved. The divorce rate of Heterosexual Marriage is pretty high on its own, let alone how many relationships people are in and out of before taking that big step. So I guess in that case I wouldn't call heterosexual relationships stable either.

    "Committed" -- So, basically you're saying because it's a homosexual relationship, I couldn't possibly be serious about my girlfriend?? Well, that's just plain insulting. I moved over 500 miles, changed colleges (again) and moved to a town I hadn't been in since before I knew how to ride a bicycle to be closer to the girl I love, and I'm not "committed"? Really?

    Now, if you're talking about ONLY the sex portion:

    Hetero Sex:
    Natural? Yes.
    Normal? Defined by majority.
    Loving? Not always, but it can be.
    Stable? Not always, but it can be.
    Committed? Not always, but it can be.

    Homo Sex:
    Natural? Yes.
    Normal? Defined by majority.
    Loving? Not always, but it can be.
    Stable? Not always, but it can be.
    Committed? Not always, but it can be.
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  11. chelloveck

    chelloveck Diabolus Causidicus

    Nobody can make you believe

    what you choose not to believe.....that's a process that is entirely within your own head. You can choose to believe that homosexual activities are unnatural, abnormal, unloving, unstable and uncommitted on the flimsiest of evidence....or no evidence at all...and the only person who can change that conviction is yourself. To change that conviction would depend to what extent you are open to the arguments that contradict your own default beliefs on the matter, and to what extent you find the opposing argument to be convincing.

    Edit: by homosexual activities, I understand you to mean monogomous same sex relationships in the context of being the opposite of monogomous heterosexual relationships (which may or may not include buggery as a sexual component).

    <!-- B-Z5 -->
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  12. Tikka

    Tikka Monkey+++

    How about I could care less until someone feels the need to tell me about it. Should I introduce myself as straight which sounds pretty dumb doesn't it.
    If I see a straight or Gay couple getting touchy feelie in public; my thought is get a room.

    I worked with a lesbian for 8-9 years; a great co-worker and person.
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  13. Sapper John

    Sapper John Analog Monkey in a Digital World

    I'm just trying to figure out how this is going to help us survive after TSHTF...just sayin'.
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  14. mysterymet

    mysterymet Monkey+++

    I don't give a crap who other people marry. They can marry farm animals if they want to. It doesn't bother me. Now, if they start hitting on me then we'd have a problem but all the homosexuals I have known have understood that I am straight and not hit on me.

    It is hard enoughh to find someone to love in this world and when you do and they love you and respect you back that is a very good and special thing. Who am I to tell someone who they love is wrong. Unless they are sicko pediphiles in which case they should spend the rest of thier miserable lives in a deep dark pit.
  15. radpug

    radpug Monkey+

    Maybe learn to build a better world thats inclussive instead of exclussive.

    All men are created equal, with the right of life, liberty and the persuit of happiness. What i find odd is that the concervatives have this issue
    All wrong. To be concervative one should support, that its none of their
    Business and certainly should not be the goverements job to be involved
    In the personal lifes and personal liberty of another persons.

    So most people want liberty but only when it pretains to their choice and their

    Liberty for every one means just that.
  16. Sapper John

    Sapper John Analog Monkey in a Digital World

    Thanks for the lesson radplug,as a man who has served his country to protect the rights of ALL citizens,I was just wondering how this will protect my family and the purpose of this post.Try not to be so sensitive and read what I wrote.I don't need a class on personal liberty,nor have I made any negative remarks about GLTG or whatever they choose to call themselves these days. Please save the civics lessons for those who need them, thanks.
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  17. Akaiken

    Akaiken Monkey+

    @ Tikka: Thank you!

    When I meet people I don't just randomly bring it up like "Hi! I'm a lesbian! < insert introduction here >" If it comes up in conversation, it happens *shrug*

    The most pda I like to display is holding hands :T maybe an occasional peck or something but that's about it.

    @ Sapper John: In the end political issues will be worth squat, but people just gotta be able to leave eachother alone and be good to each other or when TSHTF I don't doubt things could end up like uganda with the "Kill the gays" and "Corrective rape" **** they've got going on :T

    @ mysterymet: Farm animals? Really? :T Animals and Children can't consent so making a connection doesn't really make sense. As for hitting on, yeah that's one reason to make things clear is so that those kinds of things won't happen.

    Thank you!
  18. radpug

    radpug Monkey+

    Its Radpug.
    I simple responded to an open ended comment,
    In a manner in which i beleave it should be seen in.
    That is personal liberty issue.
    I find in general and this is not directed at you personally,
    I find people moaning and groaning about the goverment and
    Freedom and liberty but when an issue that they dont support comes up,
    They have deaf ears, if that means a post i make sounds like a civics lesson
    So be it, but it was Not intended to offend you on any level.

    In general most of the post here dont have anything about SGTF.
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  19. Sapper John

    Sapper John Analog Monkey in a Digital World

    No problem Radpug,my oath was for ALL Americans...
  20. Minuteman

    Minuteman Chaplain Moderator Founding Member

    Very nice post Akaiken. My apologies for making an incorrect assumption. We all know what happens when we assume.

    My intent in posting here was not to debate or open up a conversation on same sex marriage. I am actually very liberal on this issue, ala Ron Paul libertarian type philosophy. I don't think the government has any business saying one way or the other when it comes to marriage. What two consenting adults want to do is their business. I am also opposed to anti polygamy laws. Nobody's business.

    My intent in posting was to jerk Chellys chain a little, which is always fun, and to point out the absurdity of lending any credence to what some Hollywood celebrity has to say about anything. They live in a fantasy world far removed from mainstream Americana and why their views on politics or religion or any social issue should matter is beyond me.

    As for the gay rights issue. First I am not homophobic in any way. My wife and I both have counseled, ministered to, and befriended people in that community over the years. My views on "rights" lean more towards the libertarian view, that being that all Americans are endowed by our creator with certain inalienable rights. I don't support or approve of creating special rights for any group. Gays should be allowed to marry if they wish, it should not be outlawed, but it need not be state sanctioned either. I don't feel like the Government has any right to sanction a marriage between any two, or more, people. Not their business.

    The only thing I personally, and I think most Americans have a problem with is being confronted with it. When I feel the time is right I will be the one to teach my children about homosexuality. I don't want the school to usurp that. I don't want to see it promoted on television and in movies either, but I would not infringe upon the right of people to produce those kinds of shows/movies. I have the right to not watch them or attend them.

    The so called "Gay Rights" agenda is out there and there are national groups pushing for it to be accepted and promoted as natural and normal in society, and federally protected as a "right", and I think that is what most Americans are pushing back against.
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