Dragon's Breath 12ga. ammo

Discussion in 'Firearms' started by Grandpa Patch, Dec 5, 2018.


Tags:
  1. Grandpa Patch

    Grandpa Patch Monkey+ Site Supporter+++

    Dragon's Breath 12ga. ammo and why you don't shoot it at an indoor range.


     
  2. apache235

    apache235 Monkey+

    I guess that's one way to get rid of all the loose powder.
     
  3. hot diggity

    hot diggity Monkey+++ Site Supporter+++

    I had a guy shoot one round of that stuff at my outdoor range. He thought it was a bean bag round. It lit up everything from 12 yards all the way up the slope behind the 25 yard impact area. Fortunately it didn't start any fires. BTDT with range fires, but never indoors! The stupid... it burns!
     
  4. Gator 45/70

    Gator 45/70 Monkey+++

    Outstanding!!!
     
  5. Seawolf1090

    Seawolf1090 Retired Curmudgeonly IT Monkey Founding Member

    "Hot time at the ol' range tonight!!" :D
     
    Gator 45/70 and Grandpa Patch like this.
  6. Bandit99

    Bandit99 Monkey+++ Site Supporter+

    Wow! First, I have never heard of it. Second, I am confused on what exactly happened? It appears that a round was fired but then something caught fire and there was an secondary explosion which I assume was more of these Dragon Breath rounds. These people look like LEO performing training.
     
    Gator 45/70 and Grandpa Patch like this.
  7. BTPost

    BTPost Old Fart Snow Monkey Moderator

    What a waste of Good Gun Powder.....
    Dragon's Breath is nothing more than a 12 Ga Shotgun Shell loaded with Dispensing Charge, at the Base and a Perforated Wad that allows the burning Powder of the Dispersing Charge to ignite the FlashBang Charge that sits on Top of the Wad. SO you get an nice Brilliant Flash at the Muzzle that extends out maybe 5 meters and a very Loud BANG... The issue is that, not all the Flash Powder burns before it falls to the ground, out in front of the Muzzle of the Weapon... and when that unburnt Powder builds up, and spark or burning Flash Powder that hits it will set off all the unburnt Powder laying on the ground in front of the Firing Line... as seen in the Video... The real Issue is the lack of Technical Engineering of the Shells, in the first place, and likely this could be mitigated with a change in the composition of the Flash Charge Powder, by using a Powder that burns completely and isn't overloaded.... The same thing happens if you Overload a Black Powder Weapon, with Black Powder... a good sum of the Powder is shoved out the Muzzle before it burns, and some of that powder falls to the ground, unburnt....
     
  8. Merkun

    Merkun furious dreamer

    I would argue that the real issue is lack of knowledge by the shooters about what the munitions they are using can do.
     
    oldman11 and Grandpa Patch like this.
  9. Grandpa Patch

    Grandpa Patch Monkey+ Site Supporter+++

    Gator 45/70 likes this.
  10. Bandit99

    Bandit99 Monkey+++ Site Supporter+

    @BTPost "The issue is that, not all the Flash Powder burns before it falls to the ground, out in front of the Muzzle of the Weapon..."
    Ah! I see. That is exactly what happened and fell into probably some more of these rounds or something obviously explosive.

    "SO you get an nice Brilliant Flash at the Muzzle that extends out maybe 5 meters and a very Loud BANG..."
    But, I don't understand BTPost, what is the purpose besides big flash and big bang? Are the LEOs training with these for a reason? Do they blow down doors better or ????

    EDIT: Reading Wiki it appears to me that they are good for nothing except if one wants to play with fire...I definitely am not interested.
    "Dragon's breath consists primarily of magnesium pellets/shards....often used as a distress signal, similar to a very short duration emergency flare gun, though some would argue a flare would be better suited for such."
     
    Gator 45/70 likes this.
  11. hot diggity

    hot diggity Monkey+++ Site Supporter+++

  12. ghrit

    ghrit Bad company Administrator Founding Member

    The fun factor has to be right up there with Tannerite.
     
  13. BTPost

    BTPost Old Fart Snow Monkey Moderator

    There are many different versions of “Dragon’ Breath” type munitions.. The one I am most familiar, is the FlashBang version that lights up the inside of a ROOM, and then an 110db BANG goes off... This blinds and individuals in the Room, and disorients them while the SWAT Team makes entry and takes down any individuals that are still figuring out what just happened... There are Hand Tossed versions of this munition as well... Some of the other types are shown above, that make the 15 to 30 meter Flames, and use Burning Magnesium strips or chunks as the lighting powder, and usually do NOT have an associated Bang... Magnesium is typically hard to light.. So a considerable amount would have to be on the floor, along with some other easily ignited stuff in order to get a Flash, as in the Video... The ones shown in the video, do not show the same, flame front as the pictures posted later, and are likely a different version of the item...

    What I am saying the Tecnical Engineering of these Flash Bang rounds could have been taylered to NOT leave excess unburnt Powder being pushed out of the muzzle out the Shotgun, and still function properly..
    It is a matter of using a very Fast Burning launching Powder, that supplies the required Muzzle Velocity but is completely burned by the time the load leaves the barrel, and yet still ingites the Magnesium and the Bang Charge...

    The rounds I am familiar with are used in a loadout used by Seals... The loadout is four Breaching Rounds used on a Door, one for each hinge, and two for the Door Knob/Latch... then three Dragon’s Breath rounds for Room Entries, and then they sling the Shotgun, and use their Rifles until the operation is concluded...
     
    Grandpa Patch and Gator 45/70 like this.
  14. DarkLight

    DarkLight I self identify as a Blackhawk Attack Helicopter! Site Supporter

    @BTPost - The thing is, these rounds are specifically engineered to do exactly what they do for the expressed purpose of displaying exactly what they display. Wasteful? Maybe, but they are doing exactly what they are designed to do exactly "correctly" for what they are intending. And in this case, "Dragon's Breath" isn't a flash bang which is generally (though not always) a satchel "device" and it isn't a breacher round, it is a specific round that uses magnesium pellets or shards, which is what is burning, and not just gunpowder (although I'm sure plenty is "wasted" in the process)...for display and show.

    This is an entertainment round, and I believe it is classified as an incendiary round which would prohibit its use as an anti-personnel round. It's similar to a firework (from a fun/uselessness standpoint...yes, I know it's not a firework. Just trying to kill the additional argument before it starts).

    Now I know you have a long and distinguished (and very well earned) history in energetics, and I'm not disputing that at all. I also know you have an FFL and are very well versed in firearms, ammunition and reloading...again, not disputing that. But this is a "for fun" round so I say let people blow their money (I know, you won't, that's fine) and light up the night. They make them because people want to buy them and they really are a freakin' hoot and a half in the all but pitch black. I don't own a shotgun and even if I did I probably wouldn't drop the coin on it, but I've seen them in person and they are kinda fun/cool to see.
     
  15. Illini Warrior

    Illini Warrior Monkey+++

    first off - wouldn't be shooting one of those in any shotgun I valued - definitely not in a shotgun that was one of my SHTF primaries ....
    usage? - only purposeful use I see is for a necessary ambush of a superior force - into an enclosed space like a vehicle interior or a room - explosive preferred ...
     
    Grandpa Patch and Gator 45/70 like this.
  16. Gator 45/70

    Gator 45/70 Monkey+++

    This you need in the first shot of your bear shotgun...But then again it will probably set the dad-gum woods on fire
     
    SB21, Grandpa Patch and oldman11 like this.
  17. BTPost

    BTPost Old Fart Snow Monkey Moderator

    Yea, not to smart for around here in the summertime, and the Bears are all asleep during the winters...
     
  18. Bishop

    Bishop Monkey+++

    I make my own with steel wool and bird shot.
     
  19. Seawolf1090

    Seawolf1090 Retired Curmudgeonly IT Monkey Founding Member

    Flashbang vs. Dragon's Breath - different ammo for different purposes. Using one as the other, not good results.
     
    Grandpa Patch and Gator 45/70 like this.
  20. DKR

    DKR Interesting ideas, interesting stories

    Or just use issue ammo in your Mosin....

    [​IMG]
    World's Best Flashlight
     
  1. Bishop
    Thread

    Socket mold

    Here is how I make my slingshot ammo with a socket. [MEDIA]
    Thread by: Bishop, Dec 2, 2018, 6 replies, in forum: Bushcraft
  2. Bishop
  3. Bishop
  4. Bandit99
  5. arleigh
  6. Oddcaliber
  7. hot diggity
  8. Oddcaliber
  9. Asia-Off-Grid
  10. Tackleberry
  11. oil pan 4
  12. Seacowboys
  13. stg58
  14. oil pan 4
  15. arleigh
  16. Seacowboys
  17. Seacowboys
  18. Oltymer
  19. stg58
  20. Bandit99
survivalmonkey SSL seal        survivalmonkey.com warrant canary
17282WuJHksJ9798f34razfKbPATqTq9E7