Dynamic Duo to Speed Dollar Demise

Discussion in 'Financial Cents' started by Clyde, Nov 20, 2007.


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  1. Clyde

    Clyde Jet Set Tourer Administrator Founding Member

    <!-- headline start --> <table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="100%"> <tbody><tr> <td colspan="2">[​IMG]</td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2">[​IMG]</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="font-size: 20px; font-weight: bold;" valign="top" width="99%">Chavez, Ahmadinejad to Work Against US</td> <td rowspan="3" align="right" valign="top">[​IMG]</td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2">[​IMG]</td> </tr> <tr> <td valign="top" width="99%">Nov 19 05:41 PM US/Eastern
    By NASSER KARIMI
    Associated Press Writer
    </td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2">[​IMG]</td> </tr> </tbody></table> <!-- date/author end --><!-- article start --> TEHRAN, Iran (AP) - The presidents of Venezuela and Iran boasted Monday that they will defeat U.S. imperialism together, saying the fall of the dollar is a prelude to the end of Washington's global dominance. Hugo Chavez's visit to Mahmoud Ahmadinejad in Tehran followed a failed weekend attempt by the firebrand duo to push the Organization of Petroleum Exporting States away from trading in the slumping greenback.
    Their proposal at an OPEC summit was overruled by other cartel members led by Saudi Arabia, a strong U.S. ally. But the cartel agreed to have OPEC finance ministers discuss the idea, and the two allies' move showed their potential for stirring up problems for the U.S.
    The alliance between Chavez and Ahmadinejad has blossomed with several exchanged visits—Monday's was Chavez's fourth time in Tehran in two years—a string of technical agreements and a torrent of rhetoric presenting their two countries as an example of how smaller nations can stand up to the superpower.
    "Here are two brother countries, united like a single fist," Chavez said upon his arrival in Tehran, according to Venezuela's state-run Bolivarian News Agency.
    "God willing, with the fall of the dollar, the deviant U.S. imperialism will fall as soon as possible, too," Chavez said after a two-hour closed meeting with Ahmadinejad, the Iranian state news agency IRNA reported.
    As the dollar weakens, oil prices have soared toward $100 a barrel. Chavez said over the weekend at the OPEC meeting in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, that prices would more than double to $200 if the U.S. attacked Iran or Venezuela.
    "The U.S. empire is coming down," Chavez told Venezuelan TV, calling the European Union's euro a better option and saying Latin American nations were also considering a common currency.
    The leftist Venezuelan is a fierce critic of President Bush, and Iran's Islamic government is in a bitter standoff with Washington over Tehran's nuclear program. The U.S. accuses Iran of seeking to develop nuclear weapons, a claim Tehran denies, and Iran has been hit with two rounds of U.N. sanctions for refusing to suspend uranium enrichment.
    Ahmadinejad backed his "dear brother" Chavez in their joint fight with the Bush administration.
    "We have common viewpoints and we will stand by each other until we capture the high peaks. God is with us and victory is awaiting us," Ahmadinejad was quoted as saying by IRNA. He said he and Chavez would stick together to defend their "nations and ideals to the end."
    During the OPEC meeting, Iran and Venezuela proposed that the cartel begins pricing its oil in a basket of currencies, rather than just the dollar, and wanted the summit to specifically express concern over the dollar's slide in its final statement.
    Saudi Arabia blocked those moves. Saudi Arabia's foreign minister cautioned that even talking publicly about the currency's decline could further hurt its value.
    Chavez repeated his warnings that attacking Iran would further increase oil prices. "It's very important that they leave us in peace, the major oil-producing countries," he said.
    "If it occurs to Bush to invade Iran, I'm sure the Iranians will resist, and they aren't going to allow them to take away their oil, just as we Venezuelans wouldn't allow it," he said.
    In Tehran, the two presidents signed four memorandums of understanding Monday to create a joint bank, a fund, an oil industry technical training program and an industrial agreement, Iranian state television said. It said Chavez then left after an official farewell ceremony.
    On Chavez's previous visit in July, the two leaders broke ground for construction of a jointly owned petrochemical complex in Iran, with 51 percent of it in Iranian ownership and 49 percent to be owned by Venezuela. The two nations also began construction of a second petrochemical complex in Venezuela, at a total combined cost of $1.4 billion.
    Chavez and Ahmadinejad believe their petrochemical partnership will help Iran win markets in Latin America and Venezuela to gain access to Asia's energy market, especially India.
    Since 2001, the two countries have signed more than 180 trade agreements, worth more than $20 billion in potential investment, according to official reports.
    Iran has partnered with Venezuela on several industrial projects in the South American nation, including the production of cars, tractors and plastic goods.
     
  2. AlterEgo

    AlterEgo Monkey+++

    For me the neocons do not represent the united States Of America.

    I have no fault with other country's trying to save their a$$es from the banksters.

    SA is a neocon puppet, without their support they would be dethroned in a month. Did anyone expect them to reject the proposals?

    Sooner or late they will become insignificant in OPEC and the radicals will rule.

    Our only hope at this time is Ron Paul, and even if elected, it will take a lot of sacrifice from the american people to gain back the respect of the rest of the world. The neocons are not going away nicely I'm afraid.

    AE
     
  3. hartage

    hartage Monkey+++

    Oh c'mon, those two are bit players. Who has done more damage to this country than anybody else ? 1.9 trillion in spending ? Increasing national debt almost three times ? Taking our small budget surplus and turning it into a 500 billion deficit ? Manuvering us into a hated country even by our allies. I won't even mention erosion of our cherished civil rights. But I will mention our troop killed count aproaching 4000.

    No, the dynamic duo are bit players. Give credit where credit is due.


    Our country would be better off had either of the dynamic duo been our president. At least they do what is in the best interest of their own country.
     
  4. Clyde

    Clyde Jet Set Tourer Administrator Founding Member

    1. There never was a surplus...just a projected surplus which never materialized
    2. If oil is no longer traded in $ which it used to be 100% traded but is now traded as a market basket of currencies will diminish the dollar value and then they will change to the Euro which will further devalue the dollar. What they are proposing strikes at the heart of what has propped up the debt funded over spending congress/presidency since 1913 when the federal reserve was created;
    3. Death of the Dollar = Collapse of the Dollar = Collapse of the US economy and these so called "puppets" would love to see that happen as they throw their support to Red China and work against the US everywhere
    4. Troop count near 4,000....not bad for 5 years of war. On D-Day alone in Normandy we lost over 6,000...in one day. Since 2002 more people have been killed on the Michigan highway system by car accident than have died in this war. 4,000 is bad & sad; in the scope of war it is almost insignificant based upon the battles that have been fought.
    5. Pull you head out of your ass and think for yourself. Don't come into a thread and not provide facts beyond simply spewing talking points from either party.
    6. You can end all this by voting for Ron Paul.
    7. I am done now that I got pissed off. [gone]
     
  5. hartage

    hartage Monkey+++


    You want proof ? Lol... as if you even need it, all around you but I will indulge.

    National debt 9.1 TRILLION

    source http://brillig.com/debt_clock/ from " This debt clock is maintained by Ed Hall (edhall@brillig.com). It was last calibrated using information obtained from the U.S. Department of the Treasury dated 19 November 2007.

    4000 deaths not a big deal ? Try telling that to the families and loved ones of the dead.

    Our National debt went from around 5.8 Trillion in 2000 to currently 9.1 2007

    source http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/faq.html "This data was gathered from the U.S. Treasury department's web site."


    Losses of civil rights on bush's watch.... read this

    Reexamining Civil Liberties Since September 11 here http://www.humanrightsfirst.org/us_law/loss/loss_main.htm

    Hey, be pissed all you want but open your eyes. If you voted for bush or support bush you are part of the problem. We are where we are at because of people like you. No single person has done more damage to our country and people than that SOB.
     
  6. ghrit

    ghrit Ambulatory anachronism Administrator Founding Member

    EZ duz it troopers, we have bigger fish to fry than those two pantywaists from the third world. There is very well no loss in the bushter leaving Casa Blanca, but we need to get the right alternative to any of the front runners in. The bushbaby rode into the White House in reaction to Clinton, based on good feelings that have turned out to be serious blunders on our part. Look forward to what we can do, not what we should have done. [ghrit]
     
  7. Bear

    Bear Monkey+++ Site Supporter+++ Founding Member Iron Monkey

    Yup... $99.29 was the high for oil today ...
    Dollar sinking...
    Subprime....
    Home Equity Credit lines...
    Consumer Credit cards....
    Auto Loans...

    I kinda think we "did ourselves in"... too much excess and instant gratification... not enough reality and old fashioned planning, saving,hard work and moderation....

    Just my humble opinion[beer]
     
  8. hartage

    hartage Monkey+++

    I agree with you but one thing puzzles me. Why is it people point out the symptoms.... subprime fallout, but not the root cause ? The simple root cause of the subprime meltdown is our weak economy due to job/manufacturing loss. Thus people are not able to keep up payments on their loans.

    Cast light and attention to the root cause so we can begin to address the real issue, our weak economy.

    Many people tried to point out years ago our weak economy. But too many people bought into the bush lies of "job growth". As if by loosing a $70 per hr job and gaining 1.5 $7 per hr jobs is a good thing. We could have been years ahead in the repair process. But too many of us are too brain dead to see through bush.

    Cheers to those grounded in reality enough to see they voted for a con man.

    Eh, I'd better just keep my trap shut. Too few people are willing to see their mistakes. Some will always be in denial. Sheeple.....
     
  9. BAT1

    BAT1 Cowboys know no fear

    It has been an economic war all along. Chavez and I'm a Jihad are taking advantage with their oil deals. This govt kept printing money like it was going out of style. Now they both are. I've heard the debt is over 50 trillion. A quick question. Where's this nations gold? Fort Knox? Puerto Rico? The Bush Cheney vault? Where's the money?
     
  10. Tango3

    Tango3 Aimless wanderer

    Show me da money!! :)
    Isupose bush ordered in hurricane katrina too????Blame all you want it doesn't fix anything.Sounds like the "hildebeast"

    "Mrsclinton I understand you'vebeen diagnosed with a crippling yeast infection?"
    "Yes jim and it is directly attributal to the FAILURE of this administration to Secure yeast spores across theglobe, but I have the experience to deal with simple organisms":[lolol]

    Its getting boring and doesn't play outside earth first meetings; Sheeple yourself, keep reading those democratic party talking points.:
     
  11. ozarkgoatman

    ozarkgoatman Resident goat herder

    [banplz] :rolleyes:

    OGM
     
  12. hartage

    hartage Monkey+++

    Wow, even on other threads you just can't let it go ? Well, you are welcome in any discussions or debates I have. [winkthumb]
     
  13. Evenglischatiest

    Evenglischatiest Monkey+++

    Bush, Clinton, and anyone else in power today, had no hand in the root of this problem. I think we all know the root is the bloodless revolution fought against the people of this country in 1913. In a few short months, the banking industry managed to put the entire monetary system under their control, while giving themselves the means to directly confiscate our money, at the point of the government's gun. And just for an extra slap in the face, they removed from the states their only representation in the federal government. (amendment XVII) If the sheeple had been paying attention at the time, they would have burned Washington to the ground.

    Though I never expected it to happen, we currently have a glimmer of hope that these problems can be solved politically. If Dr. Paul loses, I can't imagine we'll get another chance to do it without major bloodshed.
     
  14. hacon1

    hacon1 Monkey+++



    Please tell me that you don't truely believe, half of the jibberish that you stated!?!?!

    Why do we continue to loose these high paying jobs? Because we have become a nation that thinks that "they are owed it", in some way shape or form. Unions continue to bleed this country dry by demanding high wages and want to do little in the way of increasing their work output, quality, or maintain a good standard of living. Instead, do nothing more but continue to demand more.

    This caters right into the next point. When these same people who think that they are "owed" everything, borrow, well beyond their means, and spend like it's growing on a tree in their back yard, suddenly loose their job because it can be down cheaper, more efficiently, and in most cases, the same standard (with the exception of Chineese made goods), suddenly find themselves loosing everything.

    In the end, old fashioned greed and arogance led to the whole demise. And now, people like yourself, sit around pointing the finger at someone else or a group, and say "it's their fault". That my friend is just plain ignorance. The blame needs to be turned back on the people, who put themselves into the situation. This is more that just something that Bush's dumb ass has done, this has been going on for longer than any of us have been alive.

    Things aren't going to get better for a long time! As long as sheeple continue to buy into jibberish like you have just showered us with, they will never take the blame and responsibility for their own actions and the communist media will continue to feed into the whole thing until it finally melts down.

    I truely hope that your emotions are the cause of the lack of thought that went into your statement. It happens to the best of us from time to time but for those of us that truely understand what is going on, we need to stick together, continue to help educate one another, and preapre for the worst, while hoping for the best!

    Just my [2c]
     
  15. hartage

    hartage Monkey+++

    Aw shut your yap hole since you don't know squat about me. I don't have ANY OUTSTANDING LOANS. I PAID FOR MY CAR CASH. (31k) So don't talk to me about overuse of credit.

    I have seen in one small town alone 9 factories turn to 2 the rest gone overseas. I have seen dozens of friends go from well paying factory jobs to working for places like subway. I have seen our food imports skyrocket.

    The equation is simple if you buy more than you sell you loose. If you consume more than you produce you loose. Blame it on whatever else you want to but don't talk to me about credit abuse. Your barking up the wrong tree.
     
  16. Clyde

    Clyde Jet Set Tourer Administrator Founding Member

    <object width="425" height="355"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/zS7vCd8KQIA&rel=1"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/zS7vCd8KQIA&rel=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="355"></embed></object>

    Yeah, I just save a lot of money...
     
  17. hacon1

    hacon1 Monkey+++

    Nice rebut[banghead].....very mature (yap hole-did your 6 year old teach you that one?)

    I appologize for aiming any of it directly at you. Let me try again. I don't feel that it is any one person's or groups fault that we are in the situation we are currently in. The type of abuse that I am talking about has been going on for over 90 years. This caused a problem once before known as the Great Depression. Too many people are spending and borrowing beyond their means. This hasn't been caused by ANY president, bank, or congress. Yes, they all took part and they all did some kind of damage but if the sheeple wouldn't put their necks on the block, it wouldn't get chopped.

    I'm from a town of 1,500. We employed over 2,200 people here in 1997 and now we employ 400. I don't need a lecture from you on how bad it is and how bad your "friends" have it.

    Instead of flaming on the rest of us at this board, try to understand that people's greed and arogance for many decades has got us to where we are now. We have become a lazy, ungreatful nation that thinks we are owed something. This is why we are loosing our jobs!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It is not due To dumb @ss Bush or any other president, like you have suggested. We have done this to ourselves.

    Now, I will rest my "yap hole" so you can flame on!
     
  18. hartage

    hartage Monkey+++

    The yap-hole comment was to someone that is insinuating that somehow I support credit abuse or that I do that myself.

    Secondly, my "friends" that lost their jobs are not part of the credit issue either. One of them has been saving since she was 13yo (54now). The only public assistance ANY of them have accepted is job training. I doubt if more than a couple even have a credit card. A couple have been working at a factory from such an early age they can't really read. It is insulting to even hear that somehow they are self indulgent or even credit crazy and that is what brought them misfortune. That is hardly the case. Most of them are in their 40's and 50's and are simple very hard working people. They are very much just victims when a company decides to just pack up and go overseas. Go blame the busineses that just want more profits. Don't blame the hard working simple people that helped build this country though hard work.

    No my 6 yo did not teach me yap-hole. My (not mine biologicly) 7yo did.
     
  19. hacon1

    hacon1 Monkey+++

    I did not mean your friends in a literal sense.

    In order for the greed of Wall Street to be fed, companies must also become greedy. But, the companies are not alone......unions have also become greedy. Everyone thinks they are owed something! In the end, people like your friends, pay the price for it all. The unfortunate problem is that "we", as a country, have let it get this far. Notice I say "WE", not any president, congress, or bank. These people just simply fed off of what we have allowed them......and all for the almighty $$$$$.
     
  20. Tango3

    Tango3 Aimless wanderer

    deleted...Yap-hole???
     
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