Federal Reserve: We've had no gold since 1934

Discussion in 'Freedom and Liberty' started by UGRev, Jul 5, 2011.

  1. UGRev

    UGRev Get on with it!

  2. Byte

    Byte Monkey+++

    The US Treasury is supposed to hold the gold. The fact that the Fed has none means nothing. However, I don't believe for a second that they have zero gold. Though I guess that whatever international currency the Fed and their IMF buddies come up with might just be swapped with their worthless FRN's when the time comes.

    Hispeedal2 likes this.
  3. Falcon15

    Falcon15 Falco Peregrinus

    The point is the Fed, the ISSUER of the FRN, has nothing solid, no real wealth to back the money they issue. The Treasury may have gold or silver (I do say may here for various reasons). This does not preclude the fact that the Fed is a: Illegal, b: un-Constitutional, and C: needs to be removed from power. The Fed and their puppet masters have succeeded where powers and principalities had failed for hundreds of years: they have destroyed the United States of America.
    Mountainman, UGRev and Cephus like this.
  4. Seawolf1090

    Seawolf1090 Retired Curmudgeonly IT Monkey Founding Member

    The gold question is moot.
    1) All 'money' is based on debt, not valuables.
    2) The vast majority of gold is held by the same government banksters using fiat money.
    3) There isn't enough PM in the world to back all the 'money' in circulation.....
    4) If the worst does come, will you really be able to use gold and silver to buy things? Will the guy with the food you need have accurate scales, and trade for metals? How will you break your metals down - 'pieces of eight'......? Just askin'..... [dunno]
  5. Falcon15

    Falcon15 Falco Peregrinus

    To address your points, one at a time:

    1: Money is what the Constitution allows only the Congress the power to coin and affix value to. Debt as money is a Keynesian Economic precept and went into effect when the Federal Reserve act was illegally passed in 1913. We went to full debt as money when Tricky Dick pulled the US off of the Gold standard, which was a: stupid and b: without regard of the fundamentals of having a precious metal as a backing for your currency. The certificates were initially redeemable in the same face value of silver dollar coins (which, may I remind you, were 90% pure silver, and thus had real value) and later in raw silver bullion. This is called "representative money", where the bill you own represents actual physical wealth. So you see, until we were off the Gold standard, debt as money did not exist.

    The Constitution:
    Article 1, section 8 reads in part:
    and Section 10 reads in part:

    2: To get at some kind of estimate on how much actual gold there is in the world, let's figure that the world has been producing gold at 50 million ounces a year for 200 years. That number is probably a little high, but when you figure that the Aztecs and the Egyptians produced a fair amount of gold for a long time, it's probably not too far off. Fifty million ounces * 200 years = 10 billion ounces. Ten billion ounces of gold would fit into a cube roughly 25 meters (about 82 feet) on a side. Consider that the Washington Monument measures 55 feet by 55 feet at its base and is 555 feet tall (17 x 17 x 170 m). That means that if you could somehow gather every scrap of gold that man has ever mined into one place, you could only build about one-third of the Washington Monument. A vast majority of what banksters "own" is paper wealth and not solid, in your hands gold.

    3: There is enough precious metals in the world to fund the world's economies. The paper printed and in circulation is the problem. It is paper backed by nothing more than a promise. If governments were to switch back to any PM as a backing for their currency, the value of the precious metals would adjust appropriately - because governments would be stockpiling it, making it more rare, and thereby, more precious.

    4: Anyone thinking that a gold and/or silver economy would emerge quickly after a TEOTWAWKI scenario is fooling themselves. Gold and silver bullion are ways to transport your wealth to the other side of such an event with minimal or no loss. Many astute men in the late 1920's did this (my great grandfather, for one. He transferred a majority of his wealth into silver and gold out of the stock market, rode out the depression, and when the economy recovered in the 40's, he sold off his metals as needed). The most realistic things that would retain value are those that will feed you, clothe you, protect you, shelter you, or in any way help you survive.

    IMO A Barter economy would crop up long before a silver/gold economy. If a silver/gold economy become extant it would be because there was a need for that gold or silver, and very little supply. In lieu of a silver/gold economy, I see livestock, finished goods, raw materials etc. being the foundation of a post-economic collapse economy.

    Just my [2c].
    Kingfish, Sapper John, BTPost and 2 others like this.
  6. Byte

    Byte Monkey+++


    Uh my point was that UGRev's pointing out that the Fed has no physical backing is moot because it doesn't matter that the issuer has no backing and that our supposed $ (FRN) is, in fact, supposed to back up by gold owned by the US Treasury. Recognizing that they may have none. I failed to express that particular point though, thanks for pointing that out. So to say that the point IS that the Fed has no backing is moot. You obviously understand all this too well, as evinced by your second post! ;)

    If you see my meaning by all the pointing going on...I've already lost myself.

  7. UGRev

    UGRev Get on with it!

    you completely missed the point of the VIDEO.. forget the title of the post on the surface.. read between the lines. Listen to the part where he asks why the Treasury wouldn't sell the gold... at 42.00/oz.. maybe you should watch the video?
  8. Byte

    Byte Monkey+++

    Hmmm OK after watching the video a second time I see where you're asking why they are holding onto gold certs rated at $42/oz and claiming they hold no gold. No physical gold yet they still hold the original certs from when they turned all gold over to the treasury....that is curious. Maybe there is no gold to back those certs? I like how they continually brush off any mention of them. Slight of hand. When Ron Paul is gone nobody will even rem that the certs exist and nobody will ask about them anymore.

    I didn't really get into accounting back in college but I wonder what the effect of having all that cheap gold on their books has? It must change things in their favor considerably or they'd have ditched them a long time ago.

  9. UGRev

    UGRev Get on with it!

    And now we start to see clearly. So, what happens if the dollar dumps and there is no gold to carry the countries wealth to a new system?
  10. Byte

    Byte Monkey+++

    Gotcha. My hope is that any kind of currency crash would completely unseat the Fed but I know better than that. Powerful interests put the Fed in place. It would appear that this whole currency/economic crisis was engineered from the get go so I'm fairly certain the Fed's place at the trough is well secured.

    The gold has all long since been used to acquire physical property assets anyway. Every mortgage out there is ultimately held by the Fed as their creation of 'money' is the debt hanging around most of the population's necks. When the money goes sour they'll just call in all of the debt and when it can't be paid they'll cease the assets.

  11. BTPost

    BTPost Stumpy Old Fart,Deadman Walking, Snow Monkey Moderator

    They (Feds) may do that on Paper, but they will be Hard Pressed to actually go out and start kicking folks off their Land, and out of their Houses, in any Big Way. The issue for the Banks even NOW is that they have more houses in foreclosure than they can possibly move back into the Marketplace in the next ten years. So just who are they going to get to BUY these Toxic Assets? The chinese don't want our houses, they want our Natural Resources, the same as the Arabs, and nobody wants our houses, for any amount. Who are they going to get to do their Dirty Work for them? Certainly not the locals, who also are losing their homes. .... YMMV....
    Hispeedal2 likes this.
  12. Byte

    Byte Monkey+++

    I agree, BT. I don't see them physically seizing assets on a massive scale.

    But there are certainly plenty of locals willing to do whatever it takes to be on the side that seems to hold all the power. They'll get paid in any new currency and thus will be able to keep their homes and feed their families. It's happened countless times throughout history and if it comes right down to it we won't be an exception. Power structures always requires foot soldiers to maintain them. And there's never any shortage of willing bodies. Times aren't even as bad as they're going to get and there are thousands of examples of abuses of the citizenry all over the web. It seems to be more prevalent every day too. [dunno]

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