For some Muslim women, religious equality is being able to marry outside of one's faith...

Discussion in 'Faith and Religion' started by chelloveck, Aug 21, 2017.

  1. chelloveck

    chelloveck Diabolus Causidicus

    For some Muslim women, religious equality is being able to marry outside of one's faith...and enjoying the same inheritance rights as their brothers. Fortunately for Muslim women in Tunisia, some progress is being made in that direction, which could serve as an inspiration to the women of other Muslim nations.

    Tunisian women gather to celebrate Women's Day on Aug. 13 in Tunis. On the same day, the country's president announced the review of a law requiring that a man receive twice the share of an inheritance as a woman. Anadolu Agency/Getty Images

    Tunisia Will Review Sexist Laws Regarding Interfaith Marriages and Inheritance

    Tunisia's president wants Muslim women to be able to marry non-Muslim men

    Tunisia: Landmark Step to Shield Women from Violence

    Tunisian president calls for full gender equality

    unsurprisingly there are some conservative religious women opposed to changes to existing inheritance laws favouring men over women, and laws permitting interfaith marriage.

    As Tunisia Weighs Women's Rights Proposal, Some Of The Staunchest Opponents Are Women
    Dunerunner and Tully Mars like this.
  2. tacmotusn

    tacmotusn RIP 1/13/21

    Wonders never cease. 1st off, according to Mohammad's interpretation of the Koran (the only interpretation since it is accepted he is the only true prophet) that would be a sin requiring death! Not at their God's hand but by those zealous Islamic believers aware of the sin. (preferably openly, harshly, and publicly to set an example for others who might be tempted to stray from the one true path.) Oh well some mooselimbs smoke and drink and fornicate with anything that makes their 7th century illiterate backwards assed little penises twitch. I have no respect for anything to do with or about the mooselimb faith. In my opinion Mo ham mad was truly freaking Mad as a hatter, and any fool who believes as they do is as well. I wish those progressive women formerly of the mooselimb faith safety, true love, and freedom from religious persecution, happiness and long life.
    Dunerunner likes this.
  3. Bandit99

    Bandit99 Monkey+++ Site Supporter+

    Look at those shameless hussies, with lipstick and uncovered hair! Where are the Hai'a, the religious police?!?!
  4. chelloveck

    chelloveck Diabolus Causidicus

    Religious liberty has to start somewhere, and fortunately a government with a more secular inclination is making those baby steps possible in Tunisia, as a model to other Muslim majority States, in the same way that a secular Constitution in some remote former British Colony, became a model for other nations to unshackle themselves from theocratic government. It should be noted that there is support from men in this project, and there is support from some Muslim clerics also, who see inheritance issues as a civil matter, rather than a religious matter.

    It should also be noted that the liberty to pursue interfaith marriage extends only as far as 'people of the book', aka Christians and Jews. Atheists are still haram, and are just as likely still to get the Muslim woman stoned, or executed.....maybe in a few hundred years...agnostics may have a chance. :(
    Dunerunner and tacmotusn like this.
  5. chelloveck

    chelloveck Diabolus Causidicus

    The Qu'ran doesn't universally forbid lipstick....and head covering is not a universal Islamic practice. That said, there are more conservative interpretations of the Qu'ran that disapprove of lack of modesty....

    The women in Tunisia are probably not at as much risk as say in wahabist / salafist Saudi Arabia.
    Dunerunner likes this.
  6. tacmotusn

    tacmotusn RIP 1/13/21

    Chello, just for the record, I am a sinner, I have a real problem with turning the other cheek, and forgiving those who trespass against me. As for China, Russia, and NK; I do not hate their peoples across the board, however those who are the powers that be and control what their people are expected to do, to include nefarious actions against the USA, then the government and people in power in those countries I do hate. Their people for the most part are ignorant and innocent in the actions of their government. Religious theocracies such as exists in many Islamic countries is a real problem. We have a combination of problems. Ignorance, a heavily flawed religion with violence and intolerance and nation state brainwashing of the populace starting with the youngest. There is a reason we in the USA drafted men 18 to 26 years of age and even allowed 17 year olds to join with parental consent. They are immature, their brains are still in formative stages, and they can be trained and molded to do things that an older person would question and object to. Freedom from religious persecution and unfettered open education with input from any source should be available for free thinkers to evolve and develop the ability to make intelligent decisions on their own. Once upon a time Christianity acted in evil ways and had too much power and acted as a theocracy in many cases. Absolute power corrupts (think Pope). Christianity underwent a few reformation periods starting with Martin Luther. Islam needs a reformation by Moderate Islamists to wash their hands of the Mad man Mohammad, and to revise their religion to one of tolerance and peace.
    BTW @chelloveck .... thanks for not attacking what I said earlier. I prefer a discussion over an argument.
    3M-TA3, Dunerunner and chelloveck like this.
  7. chelloveck

    chelloveck Diabolus Causidicus

    I heartily agree. Reason, and free rational thinking, independent of clerics and received revelation are a danger to fundamentalists of every faith and creed....but we do what we can to be agents for positive change. Sometimes the rear guard fights back ferociously, and progress is slow and sometimes faltering, but progress has in the main ultimately prevailed. In Tunisia, that such projects are being championed, and championed by men is encouraging.
    Dunerunner and tacmotusn like this.
  8. 3M-TA3

    3M-TA3 Cold Wet Monkey Site Supporter++

    Next thing you know they will be wanting to drive cars and even making some decisions. I remember there was quite the discussion of women being allowed to drive cars on arab news. Naturally, it was not allowed.
    Bandit99 likes this.
  9. chelloveck

    chelloveck Diabolus Causidicus

    I think women, (regardless of culture) often make more decisions than may be acknowledged...they just play the game, and give the credit to the menfolk....some matriarchs are more to be feared than some patriarchs. :eek:
  10. 3M-TA3

    3M-TA3 Cold Wet Monkey Site Supporter++

    Right up to the point where they get buried up to their necks and then have stones hurled at them until they stop breathing...

    Likely in many households the women are allowed to make many decisions regarding household affairs, but they are still held accountable to their husbands and to the Hai'a. Women still only have status as possessions. Secularism can't happen fast enough in the world of Islam. It's going to take a long time, but at least there are areas where it is much better than others. Unfortunately in others such as Turkey, secular Islam is endangered.
  11. chelloveck

    chelloveck Diabolus Causidicus

    You are quite right....sectarianism tends to surrender its prerogatives very reluctantly, and slowly, and in some cases, such as Turkey are able to, on occasion, stage a successful counter attack: Unlike the USA, where secularism is being slowed by a series of short lived rear guard actions....The battle for Marriage Equality being all but lost...bathroom legislation, and legislation limiting women's bodily autonomy are the latest fall back delaying positions for religious / social conservatives. Muslim women, atheists, apostates and transgender folk of Muslim majority countries can only dream that being excluded from certain bathrooms, is the worst that they will have to endure.
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2017
  12. Meat

    Meat Monkey+++

    Just think what a god's influence might be if he wasn't invisible and mute. [afro]
    chelloveck likes this.
  13. OldDude49

    OldDude49 Just n old guy

    Here is an interesting item on the issue... seems many things this guy did were unheard of back then...

    like talking to women (the woman at the well) and treating them as equal... Mary and Martha... etc...

    said... man, woman, freeman, slave... no difference... all are equal...

    Today radical feminists, many of whom express a strong hatred for Christianity, seem not to recognize that had it not been for Jesus Christ’s influence on his followers, women would likely have no more freedom in the West than the Islamic women have today in the Middle East. Freedom indeed has its ironies. It allows its beneficiaries to deny and despise the source of their freedom, in this instance, Jesus Christ’s salutary influence in the life of women.

    Schmidt, Alvin J.. How Christianity Changed the World (pp. 115-116). Zondervan. Kindle Edition.
    BTPost likes this.
  14. chelloveck

    chelloveck Diabolus Causidicus

  15. ghrit

    ghrit Bad company Administrator Founding Member

    So has the daesh made its feelings known yet?
  16. chelloveck

    chelloveck Diabolus Causidicus

    The move hasn't met with universal Muslim acclamation, if the accompanying linked article is anything to go by. However, it's a good start for the Tunisians, and the de-fanging of Islam more generally, when countries' secular laws become preeminent over sectarian dogma. It is a trend that should be heartily encouraged.
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