For The Children

Discussion in 'Freedom and Liberty' started by Minuteman, Apr 14, 2008.


  1. Seacowboys

    Seacowboys Senior Member Founding Member

    That's a damned good point, Brad.
     
  2. monkeyman

    monkeyman Monkey+++ Moderator Emeritus Founding Member

    Thanks. I know sems to me the biggest differences would be that in the projects theres a lot more drug and alcohol abuse (if it was present at the ranch they would be hypeing it), the racial make up is different, and most of the folks are on the government doll, while in the sect there is little or no government aid (one of the things they have gone on about is the kids dont have birth certificates or social security numbers and you do NOT get gov aid without provideing those) and they have religious beliefs in common and arent killing each other off in turf wars. So far as the big complaints of the state as far as why they are takeing all the kids though all of the symptoms are worse in the inner cities.
     
  3. Minuteman

    Minuteman Chaplain Moderator Founding Member

    Funny how these type of stories lead the news when they are showing the dramatic scenes of hordes of leo descending on a compound and "saving" these poor little children, but when the story turns the news outlets largely ignore it. How many of you have seen this latest news flash?





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    SAN ANTONIO - The custody case that swept 439 children from a polygamist sect's western Texas ranch into foster care has largely evaporated, with state authorities dropping all but a few dozen cases against parents.
    All but 37 children from the Yearning For Zion Ranch in Eldorado have been released from court oversight after Child Protective Services found they had not been abused or that their parents could protect them from the risk of future abuse. Only one girl has been returned to foster care.

    CPS spokesman Patrick Crimmins said the agency is pleased with the case dismissals, because they mean the children can safely remain with their parents and that questions about their safety have been resolved.

    "CPS has taken a lot of criticism for this operation since April, but we've been doing everything we can to work with these families to ensure positive outcomes," he said. "If they're safe to the point where court oversight is no longer necessary, that's great news."

    Authorities raided the ranch run by the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints in April after someone claiming to be an abused underage mother called a domestic abuse hot line. Those calls are now being investigated as a possible hoax.

    Following the raid, CPS took all the children at the ranch into state custody _ one of the largest custody cases in U.S. history _ claiming underage girls were being forced into marriages and sex and that the other children were at risk of abuse. They treated the ranch, which has more than a dozen sprawling homes, as a single household where the alleged abuse of some children justified the removal of the others.

    The Texas Supreme Court later ruled CPS had overreached by putting all the children into foster care when it could show that no more than a handful of girls may have been abused.

    The ruling did not, however, end court oversight of the children, even as they were returned to their parents. The parents were ordered to take parenting classes and to cooperate with CPS investigators, and they could not leave the state.

    One by one, the state has been dropping the children from court oversight.

    Separately, CPS is investigating whether each child was abused or neglected. The findings from that investigation are expected to be released next month. Even if abuse is found to have occurred previously, parents who can assure that the child will remain safe can be released from court oversight.

    FLDS spokesman Willie Jessop said the dismissal of the cases proves what the church has said all along: that the children were not abused. The cases that remain in court do so because of varying qualities of legal representation, not because of actual abuse, he said.

    "It has nothing to do with the facts of the case," Jessop said.

    Crimmins said the reasons some children remain under court oversight vary but may be as simple as a parent refusing to sign a safety plan that specifies where the family will live and who the child will be allowed to have contact with.

    While the parents and children may legally return to the ranch, few have, Jessop said. With almost no one working over the spring and summer in the sprawling garden and dairy used to feed the community, the ranch doesn't have the supply of food and resources it once did.

    FLDS communities hold much of their goods in common, and members have work duties within the community. That lifestyle was disrupted by the state when parents moved to individual homes around Texas in an effort to get their children back, Jessop said.

    "They disrupted the community and its ability to function as it was," he said, noting community members may have to seek public assistance they never needed when the garden and dairy were fully operational.

    Eight FLDS members, including jailed sect leader Warren Jeffs, have been indicted on charges of sexual assault of a child, allegations stemming from marriages to underage girls. Several face additional charges of bigamy.

    Under Texas law, someone younger than 17 cannot generally consent to sex with an adult.

    The FLDS is a breakaway sect of the Mormon church, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, which renounced polygamy more than a century ago. The FLDS believes polygamy brings glorification in heaven.

    Jeffs, the sect's prophet, was convicted in Utah last year as an accomplice to rape for arranging the marriage of an underage girl to her older cousin. He faces trial on similar charges in Arizona before Texas prosecutors can pursue their case against him.

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  4. Clyde

    Clyde Jet Set Tourer Administrator Founding Member

    on never hears about the follow up
     
  5. ghrit

    ghrit Bad company Administrator Founding Member

    At least it was published, even if not a headline. Some reporter ought to be promoted to editor. To bad there's no by-line, we could offer congratulations for good reporting.
     
  6. Tango3

    Tango3 Aimless wanderer

    My aluminum averse wife would say"See the system still works."They were illegally removed by swat teams, it worked its way through the courts and in the end no foul..."Where asI tend to focus on the swat team and the warrants..
     
  7. Minuteman

    Minuteman Chaplain Moderator Founding Member

    Michelle Roberts - Associated Press Writer - 10/31/2008 7:20:00 AM

    Buried at the bottom of the last page of AP news releases.
     
  8. Quigley_Sharps

    Quigley_Sharps The Badministrator Administrator Founding Member

    Tracy likes this.
  9. Alpha Dog

    Alpha Dog survival of the breed

    I don't know alot about this case and I'm not defending any wrong doing by LEO. With that being said it is possible that the officer's are not releasing alot of the case details so when it goes to court the defense can't claim that their clients didn't get a fair trial because of the large amount of attention and case details released by the media. A nother possibility is with the age of the juvenile's alot of things can't be releasedto the public because they are so young. So these children can have a chanse at atleast a simi-normal life when it's over with out every where they go to be ask you're that girl. Please don't get me wrong I know that any time Big Brother gets a chanse to work on taking more and more of our right's they will and do. Also I believe in God and the right's of the churches but there are alot of sick and twisted people who try and use the safe haven of the church and twist the Bible to play out their own sick desires. So becarful how you judge we have all seen how the news can screw up and give false details because the Investigator's are keeping them out of the loop and the easiest way to force their hand is to get the public upset and start putting presure on them to release info.
     
  10. BTPost

    BTPost Stumpy Old Fart,Deadman Walking, Snow Monkey Moderator

    I am with QS... Jeffs should be locked up for the rest of his life... and so should anyone, who deals with young girls, in like manner. Just MY opinion.... YMMV....
     
    Cephus likes this.
  11. ghrit

    ghrit Bad company Administrator Founding Member

    Well, we now know about Jeffs. Do we know anything about the kids, the women, or the rest of the ranch inhabitants?
     
  12. BTPost

    BTPost Stumpy Old Fart,Deadman Walking, Snow Monkey Moderator

    We know that many of his followers were, and are, tied to him financially, and he controlled them with that, as well as with his brand of religion, which he inherited from his Father and Grandfather. We also know, from outcasts of the group, that he dealt with any decent, very harshly. Most of the women are God Fearing Ladies that just want the best for their children, but the "Perverts" running the outfit, used those fears against them, to keep them in line. It is not just the Ranch, either, these guys have many compounds scatter across the western USA, with their HQ at Colorado City, AZ/Hildale, Utah. My Opinion... from what I have witnessed, and read.... YMMV....
     
  13. radpug

    radpug Monkey+

    Some people went to jail, you know someone had to be sacrified to
    The PC god er government.

    A whole community was destroyed because they think differently.
    Mission accomplished.

    You could use the same thinking on any section 8 area
    But you would be declared a racist.

    it was over reaching and at least the courts ruled it that way.
     
  1. BTPost
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