Ft. Lauderdale shooting

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by GhostX, Jan 10, 2017.

  1. GhostX

    GhostX Monkey

    I've been following the shooting that happened last Friday as closely as I can and there are a few things that don't make much sense to me.

    Apparently, this Hispanic man who was previously involved in the war in iraq was living in Alaska. It was reported that a month ago he went to the FBI and claimed that he was being forced to watch Isis training videos by the CIA. But the claims were dismissed. Then he got on a plane to Florida and checked his bag with TSA; his only luggage being the bag containing his pistol and three magazines. Once he got to the Florida airport, he claimed his bag, went to the bathroom, loaded a magazine, came out and proceeded to kill five random people and wound 8 others. As soon as he was out of ammo, he layed down and spread eagles on the ground.

    Some think that this might have something to do with a recent bill that would get rid of gun free zones. What do you guys think about this?
  2. ghrit

    ghrit Bad company Administrator Founding Member

    I think you are killing yourself worrying about things you have no way to influence.
    stg58 likes this.
  3. techsar

    techsar Monkey+++

    ...yeah, a Hispanic man who's family speaks with an Arabic accent...
    Gator 45/70 and Ura-Ki like this.
  4. GhostX

    GhostX Monkey

    Are these topics not appropriate for this site? As always, I don't mean to step on any toes by posting here. You guys were here first and I don't want to make it seem like I'm trying to turn this site into something it's not. If you all would prefer, I can post these things elsewhere. I just find it important to keep informed in this day and age because it is such a sensitive time in history. It's so easy to get misinformed or lead in a wrong direction.

    I can handle the stress so far but I would be lying if I said I don't feel it. It's not my intention to bring that stress on any of you. I just think it will be even more stressful to try to explain how everything links together as they so often do if more things happen related to these events. I post for the sake of informing others but if my messages are not well received, I'll stop. I just worry about the kind of world I will be raising my children in and I feel that I owe it to them to care now.
    Gator 45/70, Mountainman and SB21 like this.
  5. chelloveck

    chelloveck Diabolus Causidicus

    GhostX, If killing oneself with things one has no way of influencing, was the gold standard for unacceptable posts....then this site would have far fewer threads, posts, contributors and members than it presently has. However, individuals who have very little influence to affect issues, collectively can make a difference, but if one is uninformed or misinformed upon the issues in question, then one's agency is limited.

    Having said that, linking the Fort Lauderdale shooting to the dismantling of gun free zones might makes the Tinfoil Hat Lounge a better fit for this thread.,
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2017
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  6. Capt. Tyree

    Capt. Tyree Hawkeye

    A lot of the released story narrative on the Ft. Lauderdale shooter doesn't go in a predictable way. So far, we are not told he's a moozie, or that he did this heinous deed for political or religious reasons. It seems all the "facts" (we need to hear) haven't solidified yet. From what we've been told thus far, the perpetrator is an Hispanic American citizen by birth who was raised in Puerto Rico since age 2. He served on active duty in the US Army in Iraq, but later signed up with an Alaskan NG unit from which he was recently released from due to "problems".

    Among these problems are his claims to be a victim of some kind of mind control because he hears voices that tell him to listen to videos on radical moozie websites. The feebies in Alaska even have a record of him making such claims to them, possibly asking for help. They cleared him once he was verified to be under anti-depressant treatment. (first red flag?)

    He also had some domestic problems with his girlfriend or wife (now his baby's mother) where he allegedly slapped and/or choked her. Not sure which came first, the anti-depressant treatment or the domestic violence, but it appears the Alaskan feebies thought it was OK that he have a firearms carry license. (second red flag?)

    The CHL part of the released narrative may not be factual because it was only part of the first day's news feed, and doesn't seem to be repeated lately by the news talking heads. Also, I'm not sure what the carry laws in Alaska require when it comes to suitability of a prospective gun owner to carry. It could be that open carry without a license is fine.

    There's a lot of fuzziness about how his booking such a long flight on a one-way ticket with his only baggage being a firearm, its spare mags, and ammo, all in an authorized locked container that he legally had inspected and checked as baggage according to TSA procedures, went unquestioned.(third red flag?)

    It appears that the perpetrator (or his voices) carefully planned his trip details in order to ensure that where he arrived would be in a "gun free" zone filled with unarmed travelers focused only on retrieving their baggage, and not on suspicious loners.

    The actions (if any) by the Trump Administration are not expected to be onerous toward legal gun owners, or CHL holders. Still, it's difficult to predict how this incident will influence politics. As the old saying goes, "When you have a brand new hammer, everything looks like a nail."

    I agree there is a reluctance to air any wild suspicions when these events occur. This Monkey site has a Tin Foil Hat section for some of that, so I usually just stick to what narrative the MSM has released for "our consumption," and draw my conclusions from that, sometimes reading between the lines......I think we'll have more participation on this thread as more "facts" become solidified.
  7. duane

    duane Monkey+++

    Lessons to be learned from Fort Lauderdale shooting. Watching it develop on TV was a very enlightening experience for me. Things observed during the 1 st hour. Hiding behind a shopping cart 10 feet from an active shooter is probably not a good idea, neither cover or concealment. If running for your life, it is permissible to drop your luggage. laying on the floor in front of an active shooter and cowering in fear just gives him a better target. Very few seemed to try to use the baggage conveyor for cover or as an escape route. Many were injured in the other terminals by the rush to get to open areas even though there were no shooters in their areas. Hiding under an airplane wing with a couple thousand gallons of fuel over your head might not be a good idea. After about 1 hour, the airport had a higher proportion of heavily armed men than most areas in a war zone. Are you sure that the man in full battle rattle and all in black armor carrying a M 4 with 10 extra 30 round mags and wearing a jacket that has Police and BATF is really that or the terrorist second wave. I did observe that the SWAT teams were very amped up and given the conditions, extremely well trained. As far as I could see, and I am sure the media would of pointed out any lapses, they did a much better job and showed a level of training, restraint, and common sense that impressed me. Most people fleeing the area were trying to take their luggage, went a few hundred feet, clustered around baggage carts and stood there. A shooter with a 308, 762 by 54, etc, and in one of the garages would of had a very target rich area. He literally couldn't miss in his first few dozen aimed shots. The SWAT teams were very aware of that and concentrated much of their efforts on clearing those areas. Point to self, do not retreat to parking garage as safe area, danger from shooter and after Dallas, etc, danger from heavily armed, very nervous, personal, who no matter how well trained they are, are very very early in their learning curve in real life, or if a Vet has experiences that encourage his survival instincts and who may see you as a threat. Do not get into your car and try to leave, stay far away from any vehicles, could be an IED or be perceived by the Swat teams to be one, and your presence in the area puts their spider senses on full alert. Standing and texting when everyone else is running in panic makes you an excellent target to a shooter, worries the SWAT as you could be setting off a remote IED, and destroys your situational awareness. Not really survival tactics to use your phone to record the shooter, who may have more than a couple magazines or other shooters with him, and them call CNN, Fox, etc, and stream it nationwide. Probably better to leave the area. Not a good idea to evacuate alongside a railroad track with tank cars, that most likely had either jet fuel or God knows what else in them and might be very large IEDs.

    Lessons that stuck in my mind. Try not to go to those target rich targets, if you do be as gray and sheeple as possible. Danger from well trained, well armed, amped up, very understandably paranoid, police is probably greater than that of the shooter and probably not a good time to try to enforce you concealed carry rights or to attempt to "help". As soon as possible get in area "controlled" by some SWAT team and in their "safe" zone, that protects you from both the shooter and from over reaction by the police. No information was supplied by the airport, they didn't know what was going on, mass media was clueless, and possible threats with different outcomes would have made it impossible to try to figure out what to do. Poison gas, per Tokyo, London, would make exiting terminals highest priority, same with mass shooter as with the gay night club shooter and Paris shooters. IED patterns of 2 nd explosion would also encourage you to evacuate. Problem with that is second shooter could be waiting for you to be flushed out into the open and create a target rich area, or a large truck with a driver could be used as a weapon of mass destruction as at Nice, or a larger second IED might be situated outside the terminal and thus a safe area in terminal would be better. There are no safe areas in public any more and I have even more comfort from being in a semi rural area, with a long driveway, a good dog, a driveway alarm that the deer use to torment me with, and good locks. No longer limited to mass shooters, now use trucks, airplanes, gas, fire, bombs, etc and the real result, either planned or accidental, is to destroy our freedoms in the name of safety, cost us billions of dollars to fight real and perceived threats, destroy our feeling of security, and divide us into different groups all of which fear and distrust other groups.
    That said, it is time to snow blow the paths, refill the wood box, plow the driveway, get some fresh food, check the greenhouse, fill the wood stove, and thank the Lord that I am almost over the worst flu I have had in 15 years, lemon juice, lots of liquids, etc I managed to keep the temp below 101 and didn't go to the Dr. I do get the pneumonia shot and I slept in the recliner for a couple nights. At 78 I don't fight it as well as I used to. Didn't use elderberry this year, so it might be my own fault.

    Would be real interested in hearing what others that interact with the public in these areas like airports, concerts, conventions, mass transit, etc more than I do, think of this as a personnel wake up call to reconsider our OPSEC. Going full survival would get you killed as a perceived threat, but being a sheeple will get you killed as a target.
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2017
  8. chelloveck

    chelloveck Diabolus Causidicus

    A well considered and expressed analysis, duane.

    Going full survival doesn't necessarily mean that one will be killed. Going full survival may mean using all the arts of concealment, deception, escape and evasion that one possesses to avoid becoming a victim...being a passive, highly visible defenceless target isn't much of a survival option.....nor does panicking mindlessly either, if there are other actors in play, or if there are booby-traps or other devices prepositioned to harm the unwary who are funneled into kill zones.

    In high risk areas where I have a bad feeling, I'm constantly scanning for potential hazards, and unusual behavior, until I'm clear of the area. I at least have a basic plan should the situation go pear shaped.
  9. duane

    duane Monkey+++

    Agreed Chellveck, but being alert and aware in a weird situation like an airport, makes you makes you stand out like the watch goose at the pond. 39 are eating, sleeping, doing their goose thing, one is standing there with its head on a swivel and watching ever thing and will alert the flock at the least perceived danger and geese at least have the sense to listen to a watchman. It only takes me a second to be aware of that goose, and if hunting geese, I only move when he is looking the other way. Situational awareness to me means no longer going a lot of places I used to. I am not going to Ferguson, large parts of Boston or its subways etc after dark, or large parts of Philadelphia and most of the older eastern or southern cities. They have in my view won and that is now "their" turf. Don't expect me to feel guilty and pay them to live there though. I guess the only way I know of to be in full survival mode is to just avoid doing a lot of things and try to have at least a few "sacrificial" sheep from the flock between me and the wolf. To old and fat to run or fight any more, so best hope is to not stand out and hope the wolf picks another target.
  10. Tempstar

    Tempstar Old and crochety Site Supporter+

    At this point I still think these attacks are random and un-organized, carried out by individuals of questionable mental states. This one follows along with the nightclub shooting in Florida, where no connections were made to the perp being aligned with any group. GhostX has a right to be concerned as these random attacks cannot be predicted and requires us to be vigilant at all times. Personally I stay away from large crowds and don't fly commercial anymore. No way I use public transportation anymore either. The key to these times is to remain vigilant and prepared but not let the stress of it all consume you. You have a way better chance of being hit by lightning than being in a terrorist attack according to statistics.
    If I were a terrorist I would seek out areas such as "gun free zones" to ply my trade, but I doubt this particular individual possessed the required number of brain cells to fathom such a thing. Just another whacked out wannabe trying to make his mark.
    sec_monkey likes this.
  11. oil pan 4

    oil pan 4 Monkey+++

    Maybe instead of prescribing mind altering anti depression drugs that cause people to start having suicidal and mass murdering tendencies they maybe try some reefer.
    Since we now know it doesn't make you ax murder your family now (that's Salvia).
    Since I'm pretty sure the only thing you will slaughter is a bag of flavored corn crisps.

    All tho the VA would just rather prescribe you something to make you more likely to eat a bullet just so they won't have to deal with you anymore.
    Homer Simpson and Pax Mentis like this.
  12. Seacowboys

    Seacowboys Senior Member Founding Member

    techsar likes this.
  13. chelloveck

    chelloveck Diabolus Causidicus

    I have to wonder about the wisdom of prescribing a mind altering substance (such as cannabis) to individuals who have demonstrated mental health issues...such as hallucinations, paranoia etc. Cannabis has its own contraindications which if over-laid onto pre-existing mental conditions may actually be harmful, rather than just the benign munchies which some seem to emphasise over other negative affects.

    Emphasis mine (chelloveck)
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