Discussion in 'Off Grid Living' started by frjaldomr, Apr 13, 2016.

  1. frjaldomr

    frjaldomr Monkey

    Thinking about getting the Yamaha ef2400ishc as a backup to the solar system. I've used one on the job, and I was really impressed with it.
    Anyone have any thoughts on propane conversion?
    Anyone have experience with this company?

    Yamaha EF2400iSHC Generator

    Seepalaces likes this.
  2. BTPost

    BTPost Stumpy Old Fart Snow Monkey Moderator

    US Carb has always been a reputable outfit for TriFuel Conversions...
  3. Witch Doctor 01

    Witch Doctor 01 Mojo Maker

    What he said...
    Seepalaces likes this.
  4. Asia-Off-Grid

    Asia-Off-Grid RIP 11-8-2018

    Burns much cleaner than gasoline.
    Tanks of LPG store longer, easier, and in my opinion safer than gasoline.
    You can store larger volumes of LPG, as well. A 100 gallon LPG tank would run that little guy for a long time.
    I have been putting off buying a Honda 2000 watts inverter generator, because I have been unable, thus far, to locate an LPG conversion. I imagine it is probably due to most generators here being diesel, and a lot larger than 2,400 watts.

    Looks like a pretty good deal, especially if you already have experience with that particular model.
    frjaldomr likes this.
  5. zombierspndr

    zombierspndr Monkey

  6. frjaldomr

    frjaldomr Monkey

    I'm going to paste another post of mine.

    Ok, so I'm putting together a small basic solar setup.
    I've logged kwh on everything we'll be using and if we run everything 24 hours a day, we're at 7.5 kwh per day.
    So, we'll probably be more in the 3 to 4 per day range.
    We'll also have genny backup.

    I'm thinking two T-105 Trojans in series.
    What's the difference in these batts,
    T-105 | Trojan Battery Company
    plus all the other T-105 on the site, and which would be best for our situation?

    Possibly this inverter

    Not sure which charger controller to get, or even if we should go with PWM or MPPT.

    Panels...maybe one of these?
    Kyocera 140 Watt 12 Volt Solar Panels Off Grid RV Boat PV Demand The Very Best | eBay

    Any advice would be much appreciated.
  7. zombierspndr

    zombierspndr Monkey

    Looks like the difference between the T105s is the fill caps and possibly the terminals.
    frjaldomr likes this.
  8. frjaldomr

    frjaldomr Monkey

    My thought was to, initially, use the genny to charge up the batteries and then start adding panels.
    I was also thinking I might need two sets of T105s in series, with the sets wired in parallel.
    I'm just trying to start out small and grow into a system.
    arleigh likes this.
  9. BTPost

    BTPost Stumpy Old Fart Snow Monkey Moderator

    Rather than Parallel, Two sets of T-105s, why not get a couple of L16HDs , and just put them in Series.... Parallel Batteries can become an issue, as the Bank ages...

    Basically you are just buying the Lead, when purchasing Lead/Acid Batteries....
    frjaldomr likes this.
  10. frjaldomr

    frjaldomr Monkey

    What's the difference? I see some slight differences in the specs.They're both 6v.
    If I wire two L16HDs in series I'll have 12 volts, same as the T-105s...I was thinking two sets in parallel to get more amp draw and amp hours.
    Please feel free to cram as much info and basic explanation into your reply as you care to.
    I am a complete noob.
  11. BTPost

    BTPost Stumpy Old Fart Snow Monkey Moderator

    Look at the Amp/Hour Specs for the two different types of batteries....
  12. frjaldomr

    frjaldomr Monkey

    Ok, I mixed the specs up in my head when I was clicking around earlier.
    So, basically it's twice the battery at twice the, one set of the L 16 in series gets me to the same place as my T105 plan, without having to use parallel...correct?
  13. ghrit

    ghrit Bad company Administrator Founding Member

    Yes, and it avoids entirely the potential problems from paralleled batteries that for some reason or another respond differently to charging.
    BTPost and frjaldomr like this.
  14. frjaldomr

    frjaldomr Monkey

    Obviously I'm not planning on running a system, long term, with one panel, and I am well aware of Northern Arizona Wind & Sun Solar Forum.
    If you had bothered to read my previous posts, you would be aware that my plan is to begin with a small system, use a generator to charge the bank at first, and then build the system over time.
    You would also realize that I'm a noob when it comes to solar.
    That could imply a lack of attitude on the part of more experienced members, but perhaps my expectations are too high.
  15. kellory

    kellory An unemployed Jester, is nobody's fool. Banned

    Sloth can be a little rough around the edges, but he is very good at what he does. You are also dealing with language and cultural differences due to where you both live. (He is not American). So don't let it get under your skin. What you are hearing in your mind, is not so much attitude, but how he speaks.
    If I recall correctly, he has also argued successfully that building it up slowly is a large waste of money due to changes in hardware, and can lead to problems with compatibility, and performance. As well as problems matching panels and such that do change with time.
    I would suggest an open mind, and taking notes, for this is something he excels at.
    Ganado, frjaldomr and MountainMariner like this.
  16. MountainMariner

    MountainMariner Clearly Ambiguous

    Sloth is helping me put a system together. He knows his stuff. Hard to understand what he's talking about sometimes but he sticks with it until even a novice hardhead like me starts to understand. It's very easy to put together a system that in the end, is nearly worthless or a huge waste of money. I still need to add a new inverter, generator, surge protector, breaker boxes, wiring etc.

    Figure out what your complete system requirements are going to be for your particular situation first. Then if your going to purchase a generator first before the solar system, get one that will be sufficient for you in the end.

    (I have to read, then re-read or have Sloth explain over and over sometimes before I understand what he's talking about. He's incredibly passionate about all things PV, generators and electrical. )
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2016
    Ganado and frjaldomr like this.
  17. arleigh

    arleigh Goophy monkey

    I started off small and worked up and still adding as I have the capitol
    I've got old ARCO panels along with several modern ones and all are contributing .
    One thing I've learned is that nothing is as it is advertised ,and usually every thing is over rated.
    So that best thing to do is start building, and learn what you have an buy better as you go .
    Plan big and grow into it slowly.
    I have been using 6 volt deep cycle batteries and series wired for 12 volts.
    every single load and contributor is on it's own 3 way switch , on line, off line, and testing. ( I have about 20 of these all in a row)
    volt and amp meters of different values give me the information necessary to know who is working an who is not.( I ket a chalk board with all components ,tracking their contributions and failures.
    Panels will change in time, and definitely batteries will too, as well as generators, and wind mills.
    Every thing will change, so don't get hung up on solid numbers, it's not worth it, and only frustrates your self.
    Some panels will work in indirect sunlight but not to capacity ( these do not necessarily put out better tan those made for direct sun light only). ,and many only work in direct sunlight but when they do it is significant .
    Buy one of a brand and test it with in your system and compare apples with apples, "truth in advertising "
    even panels of the same manufacture can have problems, and if you don't know how to measure them "working", your lost.
    Charging batteries does not require all the same panels , that's silly. ANY thing that puts out more than 12 volts can be a contributor. even if it is mil amps. I often watch the meter ramp up as I add panels on line, each according to it's own capacity.
    If I am not using much power I switch out most panels and keep it in maintenance mode ,no need to over work the voltage regulator.(charge controller)
    My system is built in my shop trailer, which I'm in every day any way. Panels on the roof, and the battery bank below deck.
    The wind mill is pretty much left on all the time since it is never over worked ,there's just not the wind here to do that.
    I only run the 6500 watt diesel generator on board occasionally to keep it ready to go. the same with the welder (gas engine driven) .
    Have fun
    frjaldomr likes this.
  18. frjaldomr

    frjaldomr Monkey

    I certainly appreciate the input, and understanding that there is a language barrier, etc, helps to change my perspective.
    kellory and Ganado like this.
  19. Asia-Off-Grid

    Asia-Off-Grid RIP 11-8-2018

    He's the grandmother we keep in the attic of the monkey tree. :D

    Seriously, ol' Sloth is all right in my book.
  20. Cruisin Sloth

    Cruisin Sloth Special & Slow

    What size of GEN support have you got & how is the generator going to charge a 12Vdc 232Ah battery ?
    If you use the Yam one (you posted )you don't have an outback type of inverter to charge the battery bank , you will need a Iota converter of 15-25 amp (is all that yam 2400 can handle) to give the bank a 7% charge ratio (bare minimum of a maxed out gen when you add 120Vac loads) . your battery will be fully charged in 6-8 hrs of running.
    Buy a cheap battery bank , because my math is good , but all else can change.

    I would RE-think this power , Gen support is great , but buy one so it can also work with a generator support inverter and have the best of both only bought once. Buy panels in high voltage type , NOT the low volt 12Vdc ones that barely make 20Vdc.
    Solar has changed since the early days of solar . High Voltage to use MPPT sweeping and higher voltage banks,
    12Vdc was the cars that ran on gas in the old days.
    power is watts
    Voltage is E
    Amperage is I
    Resistance is load R
    (toaster , oven is pure resistance & should be avoided unless you have HUGE RE collection)

    So if we have 12Vdc Battery bank and have a charger controller (every system needs one for the batterys) and that CC is limited to 30 amps (they come up to 90amps & can be twinned plus up to 800 amps) so 30amps times 12Vdc = 360 watts harvest max
    NEXT is 24Vdc , same 30 Amps but now 24X30 = 720 watts harvested
    48VdcX 30amps = 1440 Watts is the way I'd be looking , and build off of that . Use 48Vdc to 12Vdc converters if needed for the 12V stuff , but 120Vac stuff is now so efficient and cheap ..

    Remember HARVEST is what farmers work for.


    I'll add as I have time
    Last edited: Apr 23, 2016
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