Global warming ~ NOT!!

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by ghrit, Jan 22, 2008.

  1. ghrit

    ghrit Bad company Administrator Founding Member

    This paper tends to debunk the international gorisms that so quivers the livers of the greens. Yep, green house gasses exist, but they are not the primary cause of warming. Warming, say the authors, is normal and cyclic. We just happen to be on a rise in the cycle. What's more, it is benign.

    Folks, this is loaded with citations and graphs. Not an easy read, but well worth the time.
  2. Tracy

    Tracy Insatiably Curious Moderator Founding Member

    :shock: What?!?!
    The planet is cyclic in nature?!?!:eek:

    Who'da thought?! :rolleyes:

    heh heh heh :)
  3. hartage

    hartage Monkey+++

    Ok, I just have to ask a few questions....

    Sea surface temp chart..... goes back to 1000 bc. Supposedly taken at the sargasso sea. Funny I didn't know we took sea surface readings before tempreature was even understood. In an undiscovered place (sargaso sea). And before the ships big enough to get there was invented. Or was this done through satelites that didn't exist ? Remember this chart claims we have accurate sargaso sea temp readings from 3000 years ago ?

    The thermometer was invented by Galileo Galilei in 1593 that is 415 years ago. Far short of 3,000. The first mercury thermometer (accurate readings) was invented in 1794. That was only 214 years ago. So how can we get accurate temp readings as far as 2794 years BEFORE the method to do so was invented ?

    I'm just curious if the creator of this paper somehow has access to a time machine to be able to get accurate readings from so long ago.
  4. ColtCarbine

    ColtCarbine Monkey+++ Founding Member

    IMO, global warming is just another way for .gov to spend more of our $$$. Since when does the government really do something for the benefit of the people unless there is money in it for somebody's back pocket somewhere. Don't get me wrong I'm not trying to say our planet might not be warming up. I'm just not convinced that .gov has the right intentions when it comes to this, like most other things.
  5. hartage

    hartage Monkey+++

    It's not the government that is doing this. This adminstration has been fighting this tooth and nail. The people saying global warming, we are doing it and it is harmful are the people studying this. The scientists taking ocean surface temps (real not fake) studying and learning. The same people that brought you the atom bomb, cars, the light bulb. Using the same methods that got us where we are in our civilization.

    The scientific method is our best tool to filter out human bias. We believed them when they used the same methods to discover nuclear reactions and create atomic bombs. Why doubt them on global warming ?
  6. ghrit

    ghrit Bad company Administrator Founding Member

    I understand the questions you have. The best answer I can come up with is to check the bibliography at the end of the article and see what their methodology was to obtain that data. The accuracy is obviously in question as it should be. But (guessing here) the geologic (and maritime) record holds enough info to establish trends, thus a least squares analysis should narrow things down a bit. I'll leave it to you to do the research, concentrating on Phonecian seafaring. I think you'll find records (as the Portugese did much later) relating all sorts of details on the seas they sailed on. I'm not so sure the Phonecians reached the Sargasso sea, but if they did the records will show it. While the sea temp record may well not match the standard thermometer of today, there were means of measuring temperature to one level or another.

    "The time has come" the Walrus said, "to speak of many things. Of shoes, of ships, of sealing wax, and cabbages and Kings, and why the sea is boiling hot, and whether pigs have wings" [beer]
  7. ColtCarbine

    ColtCarbine Monkey+++ Founding Member

    Research is big business with government hand-outs is what I was hinting at.
  8. pgrass101

    pgrass101 Monkey+++

    It does matter if the Earth is warming or cooling, because the comets going to hit any day now.........
  9. Minuteman

    Minuteman Chaplain Moderator Founding Member

    The ambient temparature of any place on earth at any point of time can be scientifically determined from geologic samples taken from that area in that particular time frame. It does not require that a person actually be there with a thermometer at that time. The process is fairly accurate, much more so than popular dating methods to determine the age of the samples that those readings are taken from.
  10. Brokor

    Brokor Live Free or Cry Moderator Site Supporter+++ Founding Member

    Gore is making BOOKU $$ with his global warming campaign. This is his personal justification, albeit less than public knowledge. The media hype and general perception has been created to promote awareness for the "NEED" of programs, research, and funding. You will see government opposition toward eco-legislation because corporate cartels run the stage and look out for their own interest. Added to this we see Euro eco trends that are sensible and well placed, and this places pressure on the big dogs of Slavery, Inc. The overall goal of "global warming" is to allow foreign policy to set the standard, and in an adverse way "force" the United States into a corner, where they will miraculously suggest a wonderful remedy, which will undoubtedly become both sinister and expand the elite power base. Try looking into international weather programs and global systems. NOAA has recently undergone bumpy changes, starting with its leadership. Satellites are degrading at a rapid pace. There is a push for change, and change we will have.

    A New World Weather Warning System. Not this term exactly, mind you. ;) The same rule applies to the space program. Then comes the economy and policing, legislating, and the adoption of world courts. Incremental adaptations to a worlwide social policy.

    It's not brain surgery. It's Neo-Fascism disguised as humanitarian relief and Democracy Now!
  11. slots

    slots Monkey+++

    Hi Brokor

    You've confused me. I understand the first half of your statement, but I don't understand the following:

    I thought global warming is a "global" problem not confined to the USA. Any remedy would have to be global. Which "elite power base" do you mean? Are you talking Government or Business?

    Change will happen, I am sure of that. It really depends who changes first, mankind or mother nature. Lets hope WE make the first move, othewise I can see my vegetable garden turning into a dustbowl...
  12. Brokor

    Brokor Live Free or Cry Moderator Site Supporter+++ Founding Member

    Hey Slots, how are ya?

    I meant Global Warming with quotes "", to symbolize the movement itself, both those who support it as a legitimate excuse for implementing global policy, and those who believe it is only a ploy of some kind for various reasons. Obviously, the remedy for global warming is global response, but remember that many nations, especially the US are strongly nationalistic and will not easily accept global policy. This is why the media coverage is so steady, and why mind control is not only an MK Ultra CIA project any more.

    Let's see. Oh, "elite powerbase". Yeah, I use some strange rhetoric. I apologize. What I mean is, the CIA and their P2OG terror outlets including AlQaeda, Corporate Media, Carlysle Group types, Bilderberg associates, Trilateral Commission, CFR members, Corporate cartels and their minions within politics, and of course the greatest of all elitists: the banking families who control the currencies of the world.

    The elite have a powerbase: it functions primarily upon the money and the protection of this money. The numerous policies, programs, laws, and secret or clandestine groups operate exclusively for the purpose of perpetuating this system of control.
  13. Tango3

    Tango3 Aimless wanderer

    well they figure historic temperatures from ice cores by the thickness of the layers like tree ring growth
    ,perhaps ( and this is a completely wildass guess) the sea floor corings show sedimentary layers from seaweed/algae growth that correspond to years??Heretics can be so cunning...[coffee2]
  14. SeptemberMage

    SeptemberMage LaMOE Monkey

    Maybe because we also believed well intentioned scientists when they said red meat was killing us, so we should use the much healthier Hydrogenated Oils. One obesity and diabetes crisis later...

    Anyway, I don't hear anyone question the use of ice cores to "prove" what the temperature was 265 million years ago, why should I doubt that this study didn't use the same scientific process to determine the temperature of that sea 3000 years ago? I mean come on.
  15. hartage

    hartage Monkey+++

    Ice cores have direct exposure to the atmosphere. The only place you can get cores in the sargasso sea is on the ocean bottom. The conditions the ocean bottom is exposed to will be different temp than the ocean surface.

    I challenge you to get accurate temp readings at 29,000 feet taking measurements from sea level. You won't. That is why we bother to send weather balloons and fly high altitude planes to get readings at altitude. The weather systems are different at different altitudes. The same with the ocean.

    This is the same reason why we take different temp readings in each town/city. Just because we take temp readings at one town does not mean we can extrapolate the temps in other towns from that single reading and be accurate on any level.
  16. SeptemberMage

    SeptemberMage LaMOE Monkey

    OK, Obviously you don't understand what I am talking about.
    A. To begin with the Sargasso Sea study was only one part of the whole thesis.
    B. The Sargasso Sea study was based on the presence of particular isotopes in the fossilzed record of little sea animals, if you don't accept the results of radio isotope experiments then there isn't much I can say to you, since it's efficacy is the backbone of every argument for and against Global Warming.
    C. The 3,000 year average temperature was calculated by the scientists at NOAA, not by the authors of this study.
    D. I am not going to get into a war over this, and I'm not going to teach you how to read a peer reviewed article, well ok, here is one hint, RTFM (i.e. The references)
    E. I don't really care one way or another about the dangers of the inert gas CO2, and the Red Herring of Gl0obal Warming, when right now the oceans and lakes are so poisoned that I have to worry about Neurological damage to my kids just from eating fish!
  17. Tango3

    Tango3 Aimless wanderer

    Seems to me we've thoroughly documented ice ages,andthen glacial withdrawal well before the industrial age and that's enough to convince me.The world is fine,"we" may have to adapt:I.E. manhattan island may take on water ( no big tradgedy in my eyes people can withdraw from the coasts; kommifornia and the eastern seaboard).and it may warm up up here( longer growing season).There is a debate alive on this topic the "debate Is not "over" as the enviro's and movie stars are wont to shout..
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