Civics How things will go down if Ginsburg leaves the SCOTUS

Discussion in 'Freedom and Liberty' started by HK_User, Feb 3, 2019.

  1. HK_User

    HK_User A Productive Monkey is a Happy Monkey

    January 20, 2019
    How things will go down if Ginsburg leaves the SCOTUS
    By Steve Grammatico

    Mueller, the wall impasse, the shutdown, the "postponement" of the SOTU – all are skirmishes in the undeclared war on President Trump waged by Democrats, the Deep State, and the compliant media. A decisive battle will be enjoined if Ruth Bader Ginsburg dies or resigns this year.

    Nothing scares the left more than the prospect of Trump filling another seat on the SCOTUS with a young, fire-breathing constitutionalist who would join with Alito, Thomas, Gorsuch, and Kavanaugh to form a conservative bloc for the ages.

    Pelosi and Schumer are praying that Justice Ginsburg survives and remains on the bench until January 1, 2020, when their concern for her well-being ceases. They know that Senate majority leader McConnell could not persuade his entire caucus to abandon the principle he championed in 2016 that a nomination to the Supreme Court in a presidential election year is inappropriate.

    Here's how it may go if RBG vacates the bench or the Earth soon, as seems likely: Pelosi will immediately schedule a vote to launch a formal impeachment inquiry, pre-empting the president's announcement of his choice to fill Ginsburg's seat. It will pass along partisan lines, swamping other news. Next, the House Judiciary Committee (Jerrold Nadler, chair) will draw up charges against the president. Eventually, the committee will vote out articles of impeachment. At some point after this, the entire House votes on the articles. Trump is impeached.

    With President Clinton, it took about five months for the entire process to play out, ending with a vote of "not guilty." Depending on when the ball drops, Democrats have two ways to work the Trump hit job for an even more extended time and for maximum effect:

    • Slow-walk the process leading to the full House impeachment vote. The longer it takes to get there, the longer Trump remains under a cloud and, in some eyes, delegitimized. Pelosi will be in no hurry get the matter to the Senate, where McConnell would schedule the trial as soon as possible to end the nightmare.
    • Fast-track the full House vote on impeachment – and hope, as I said in an earlier post, the public conflates impeachment with conviction.
    Either way, Democrats and their media allies will flood the country with impeachment fare and string it out. Likely, four or five Republican senators turn jellyfish and inform McConnell they will not support Trump's nominee to the SCOTUS while the president is in legal limbo.

    Everyone knows that the Senate will not convict. And that's fine with the prescient among Trump's enemies. They want a weakened adversary in the Oval Office, not President Pence. If Schumer and Pelosi can keep the circus going into 2020, they believe that Trump's ability to govern will be curtailed and perhaps, if they're lucky, his spirit broken.

    As Carville – or "Serpenthead," as he is known to political herpetologists – might say, "when the hunt's done and the moon's come over the bayou, our dogs'll lie down by the fire where Trump's simmerin' in the stewpot with the mudbugs."

    You get the gist.
    BenP, Capt. Tyree, Motomom34 and 6 others like this.
  2. duane

    duane Monkey+++

    And at some point in the future the political war and it's take no prisoners goes mainstream, spreads to actual racial, economic, social, and other forms of conflict and all bets as to what may happen are off. While I hope it never happens, perhaps our minorities will fare as well as the minorities have in Iraq, Union of South Africa, Rhodesia, Kenya, Brazil, etc. Funny how there is little problem with certain political and ethnic groups when the minority destroyed is white, Jewish, middle class, etc, and how vocal it is when it is natives, poor, non white, gender indeterminate, etc. YMMV
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2019
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  3. DKR

    DKR Raconteur of the first stripe

    Nobody has seen or heard from RBG for over 50 days.

    Time to demand Proof of Life.

    I'm starting to think this has become a Weekend at Bernie's (or Ruthie's) moment....

    ---- ---- ----
    On Thursday, former White House adviser Sebastian Gorka suggested on Twitter that the Ginsburg, 85, who has cancelled public appearances since undergoing surgery to remove cancerous lung growths in late December, might be hiding a medical condition. But, Gorka tweeted, all would have to be revealed if Ginsburg appeared at the State of the Union address on Feb. 5.

    “Still no sign,” Gorka wrote. “6 days left until Ruth Bader Ginsberg has to make her official appearance at @realDonaldTrump’s State of the Union.”
    Ura-Ki, Bandit99, UncleMorgan and 2 others like this.
  4. tacmotusn

    tacmotusn Mosquito Sailor Site Supporter+

    What if prior to an impeachment, at the beginning Trump and Pence have figured this same scenerio and have decided on a new VP and Trump steps down. Pence immediately declares the new (Trump/Pence) selection for SCOTUS and then officially Picks his VP
    Ura-Ki, UncleMorgan and HK_User like this.
  5. Merkun

    Merkun furious dreamer

    It's worth remembering that Nasty Nancy is no spring chicken. Certain of the "deplorables" might wish for age to hasten in her case, even more so than for RBG.
    Ura-Ki, UncleMorgan and HK_User like this.
  6. Ganado

    Ganado Monkey+++

    I'm not following your logic @HK_User Ginsberg is a liberal If your scenario were try why wouldn't the left just let her die and do as you are speculating? it would be to their advantage. Why keep her around let her die and continue to call it cancer.

    Sorry just not following the logic sequence
    Ura-Ki, UncleMorgan and HK_User like this.
  7. BlueDuck

    BlueDuck Monkey++

    Ruth could well be on ice right now. No one would know until the liberal strategy was in place.
    Motomom34, Tully Mars, Ura-Ki and 3 others like this.
  8. Ganado

    Ganado Monkey+++

    lol @BlueDuck that's just paranoid speculation... still not sure about this scenario, I am assuming I am missing something which was why I asked the question of HK
  9. Lancer

    Lancer TANSTAFL! Site Supporter+++

    Semi-facetiously: Disney is in possession of RBGs corpus, while they build an animatron to drape her moldy hide over.
    I do think HKs scenario is entirely feasible from a political perspective, but the devil will be in the details.
  10. HK_User

    HK_User A Productive Monkey is a Happy Monkey

    Not my work.
    But just one of many "thoughts" out there and interesting that it was sent January 20, 2019.
    Ura-Ki, UncleMorgan and Ganado like this.
  11. Thunder5Ranch

    Thunder5Ranch Monkey+++

    Ginsburg could be lookin like the Crypt keeper and propped up with stick and animated with strings before the left will let Trump have another SCOTUS pick willingly. Course she has been lookin kind of Crypt Keeperish for a while now.

  12. UncleMorgan

    UncleMorgan I eat vegetables. My friends are not vegetables.

    Impeachment is not the same are expulsion from office. Impeachment is a legal statement of charges (somewhat like an indictment) which requires a simple majority vote in the House of Representatives.

    If impeached by the House, the impeachment charges would be tried in the Senate. A two-thirds vote would then be necessary to achieve a conviction.

    If convicted, the only penalty would be removal from office. A second vote of the Senate could, however, make the former President ineligible to hold any future political office.

    Accordingly, during the lengthy period of time between the first accusations and start of the impeachment process, and a final conviction (if any), the President would remain in power.

    That means he could still appoint a Supreme Court Justice, among other things.

    The question as to whether a sitting President can be indicted and tried for crimes in the same manner as an ordinary citizen is very much open to debate.

    Some say that "no one is above the Law".

    Others say that a criminal conviction would be an unConstitutional shortcut to impeachment (removal from office) of a sitting President.

    That logic is clearly spurious, since no ordinary criminal charge can remove a President from office: it's not a legal penalty like the ever-popular five years and/or $50,000.00 fine.

    Trump, if convicted (for example) of bank robbery, would remain the President even if he was sitting in a jail cell. A death sentence would not remove the President from office, though death, itself, clearly would.

    It is clear that an ex-President can be indicted and tried just like any ordinary citizen.

    It is also clear that a sitting President can be the defendant in a civil suit.

    As for a President being subject to ordinary criminal indictment and trial while in office, we'll all just have to wait for that to happen and see how it works out.
    Ganado, oldman11, Ura-Ki and 4 others like this.
  13. Bandit99

    Bandit99 Monkey+++ Site Supporter+

    I get it but exactly what are these impeachment charges? WHAT? They can't just make up crap...……..can they? LOL!

    @Ganado "... why wouldn't the left just let her die and do as you are speculating?..."
    I can answer that one. Because it's a crap shoot. At the best of times, it would be a crap shoot if they went this route so they don't want to go down this path unless forced to do so. Now, if the held the Senate also then that would change the variables and perhaps that's exactly what they would do. As it stands, given the 24/7 anti-Trump media and they now control the House, they have a good possibility to gain the Presidency in 2020 which would allow them to appoint Ginsberg's replacement.

    So, the question is 'How do they block a USSC justice conservative appointment if Ginny dies under Trump?' Should that happen, the Democratic party possibility of achieving their agenda via legal arbitration in the USSC is pretty low, probably null. They would have to do it via real laws, real legislation, which is long, difficult and with lots of pitfalls...especially given the House could change every 2 years. A hell'va lot is riding on who replaces Justice Ginsberg for a hell'va long's a defining moment for the next 10 maybe 20 years. A true watershed...
    Ganado, Ura-Ki and HK_User like this.
  14. Ura-Ki

    Ura-Ki Grudge Monkey

    This is why the Demos have been pushing so hard to find any thing in the Russian collusion deal, its the only thing they could possably use to impeach Trump! Its also why the dems keep blocking trumps wall deal, simply to block jim amd get him pissed off enough to do something dramatic like declare a national security emergency, legal, but certainly a challenge tje dems will sue to block and use against him!
    I cannot say what i really think needs to happen, bit im pretty sure many of you have the same ideas!
    Gator 45/70, oldawg, HK_User and 4 others like this.
  15. duane

    duane Monkey+++

    It indeed indicates how far politics has fallen if one political party is willing to risk the economic future of the USA and block any effective government actions for 2 years in order in their perceptions to increase their chances of controlling the government in 2020. It may well be the only effective actions to come out of the Trump administration is to appoint conservative judges.
    STGThndr, Ganado, Gator 45/70 and 4 others like this.
  16. Lancer

    Lancer TANSTAFL! Site Supporter+++

    "appoint conservative judges" = the primary reason I was happy to vote for him, and will do so again should it come to pass.
  17. Bandit99

    Bandit99 Monkey+++ Site Supporter+

    @Ura-Ki Yes, the game they're playing now is one for time. They must survive ~2 more years then they have a very good chance of replacing President Trump. Let's face it every media source available does nothing but degrade and debase him 24/7 without facts or proof. Hollywood is on their side because it is ran and owned by the media moguls and now they have the House so chances have indeed improved...but Justice Ginsberg is the wild card which they have little or no control. And, if Trump gets to appoint Ginsberg's replacement - well - it carries much more weight than even a 4 year Presidency so they will do anything and everything to stall for time in the hope Ginsberg can hold on for 2 more years but if she can''s a game changer, a political watershed and all rules go out the windows and they will indeed do anything to slow roll the appointment of a new Justice by him.

    It's really that simple and that sick. Honestly, I don't think they could accuse him of anything that would shock me anymore, cannibalism, child molestation, even shooting JFK...and they will.
  18. Bandit99

    Bandit99 Monkey+++ Site Supporter+

    They don't care spit about risking our economic future but in fairness neither do the Republicans. We have a National Debt of 108% as of the end of 2017 and 2018 is going to be much, much worse. How can they care about our economic future if they give huge amounts of money to foreign powers - money we don't even have! They must BORROW the money to give to foreign powers or PRINT it so we lose either way. We lose not foreigners. We lose on each and every dollar that leaves this country.

    You are correct, "may well be the only effective actions to come out of the Trump administration is to appoint conservative judges" because even though he has kept most of his campaign promises all those promises can and will be changed, bet on it, but they cannot change those judges - well - they could and it would not surprise me if they tried but it's pretty difficult.
  19. apache235

    apache235 Monkey+++

    If they think that they can impeach the President, why wouldn't they think that they could impeach a Supreme Court Justice? Then again, if they do try that, the backlash might be a little more than expected.
    Gator 45/70 and HK_User like this.
  20. ghrit

    ghrit Bad company Administrator Founding Member

    Yes. Any "high crime or misdemeanor" is cause for articles of impeachment. If you can find the law, or even approximate it, the articles can be written up. Now, how far they get is always a question.
    Gator 45/70 and Ura-Ki like this.
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