If the NSA doesn't spy on US Citizens ..

Discussion in 'Freedom and Liberty' started by VisuTrac, Aug 28, 2012.

  1. VisuTrac

    VisuTrac Ваша мать носит военные ботинки Site Supporter+++

  2. Yard Dart

    Yard Dart Vigilant Monkey Moderator

    Oh the web we weave....
    The NSA can do anything in regards to data capture and analyzing of all media sources, that is their primary mission. Regardless of the boundaries of some country, even the good ol USA. The specific grey area of where an email generated is blurred, with the digital age, giving them plausible deny-ability- oh we thought it originated in Africa and was suspicious, our bad.
  3. tulianr

    tulianr Don Quixote de la Monkey

    That's a good article; and Alexander didn't actually lie, in a general sense. He gave the general party line, which applies in a perfect world. It's a bit like asking, "Does the NYPD shoot innocent civilians on the streets?" In a general sense, the Mayor of New York can answer, "No, of course not." That wouldn't actually be the truth though, given recent occurrences; and if you could ask the right questions, you could force him into admitting the actual truth. Knowing the questions to ask though (and wanting the actual truth) is key.

    In general, the NSA was most definitely not established to spy upon the American public. In general, NSA does not direct its activities toward the American citizenry. In general, one of the worst things you can do within the NSA is to get caught spying on American citizens. Every six months, every employee of NSA and the CSS has to read and initial a copy of USSID 18 (United States Signals Intelligence Directive - 18). The USSIDs are the internal regulations of NSA. They cover everything from what you may and may not do, to how to spell foreign words. Everything is covered by a USSID. In brief, USSID 18 says that employees of NSA may not intercept, record, transcribe, or report the communications of a US person. It further goes on to define a US person as not only an individual, but a company or corporation based in the United States which employees primarily US persons, and US flagged vessels. It also further states that the identity of a US person cannot be included in a report, if intercepted in foreign communications, except in extreme cases, such as threat of death. The report would state something along the lines of, "speaker (A) referenced a phone conversation with named US citizen, in the Dallas/Ft Worth metropolitan area."

    All employees of NSA/CSS are familiar with this USSID, and longtime employees know it intimately. And, in general, its provisions are strictly adhered to.

    On other threads, we've discussed the problems introduced by the digital age, and by the internet vis a vis legal communications interception; and Alexander mentioned them in his interview. It gets more difficult by the day to follow the rules, because you often don't realize that you've broken them until after the fact. There is even a NSA form to fill out for those times in which NSA employees realize that they have in fact intercepted the communications of a US person.

    So, in general, Alexander wasn't being deceptive. To claim that NSA resources have never targeted the communications of US persons, would be an outright lie. To claim that NSA resources cannot be quickly realigned to intercept massive amounts of US communications, would be an outright lie. But those weren't the questions asked. I don't think most of those in positions of power want to ask those questions.

    I don't think that the NSA is any sort of evil empire, and I don't think that widespread abuse of their capabilities are currently occurring. I think the potential is there, just as is the potential of using US troops against American civilians. The potential for abuse exists, and must be guarded against, by continuing to ask questions, and by someone asking the right questions.
    BTPost and Yard Dart like this.
  4. Yard Dart

    Yard Dart Vigilant Monkey Moderator

    I don't think they are the evil empire either, but as we know, they are a powerfull tool to be exploited by the government if the watchful citizenry does not maintain vigilance. Everyone of us is responsible for the choice of our representatives. If we continue to lack in our duty to send qualified and honorable men and women to represent us, then we are culpable in the failure to prevent these tools being used against us.
    Sapper John, BTPost and tulianr like this.
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