Iran Says Warships Headed Close to U.S. Borders

CaboWabo5150 · Feb 9, 2014

You guys are laughing at Iran's navy, but who keeps getting their boats sunk every year thus losing all of their guns to the bottom of the lake ?

Gator 45/70 · Feb 9, 2014

CaboWabo5150 said: ↑

You guys are laughing at Iran's navy, but who keeps getting their boats sunk every year thus losing all of their guns to the bottom of the lake ?

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Guilty !, I have sunk 2 and no telling how many pirogue's I've flipped standing up and shooting a 12 gauge sideways.

techsar · Feb 9, 2014

Gator 45/70 said: ↑

Guilty !, I have sunk 2 and no telling how many pirogue's I've flipped standing up and shooting a 12 gauge sideways.
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Hehe...at least you didn't fire it downward to kill a snake that fell in the boat

Not me...a relative, and by marriage only!!!

Anyhow, Iran may not have a navy of any significance but it wouldn't take much to have a rocket launch platform concealed under the deck. Many radicals would likely jump at even a far-fetched, hair-brained scheme to deliver a blow to the great satan.

kellory · Feb 9, 2014

Ever take a leak, while standing in a canoe? Not the brightest thing I've ever seen....

kellory · Feb 9, 2014

VHestin said: ↑

That would make the fisherman really 'crabby', wouldn't it?
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I think it would ruin their whole day.

JLRhiner · Feb 9, 2014

Do you think they'll come within rifle range of the coast? Could be fun!

kellory · Feb 9, 2014

JLRhiner said: ↑

Do you think they'll come within rifle range of the coast? Could be fun!
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No. The three mile limit was a product of how far cannon could shoot to protect the coast. You got a three mile rifle?

BTPost · Feb 10, 2014

Not unless you can shoot 12+ miles.... That is the limit of Territorial Waters. It was increased by Pres. Truman from 3 miles, by the Truman Doctrine, after WWII. It is now codified by the UN Law of the Seas. If they violated that, they would spark a Massive International Incident. .....

JLRhiner · Feb 9, 2014

kellory said: ↑

No. The three mile limit was a product of how far cannon could shoot to protect the coast. You got a three mile rifle?
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Absolutely! (Don't you?)

Gator 45/70 · Feb 9, 2014

I believe the limit is 200 mile's.
Most state's have the 3 mile limit.

BTPost · Feb 10, 2014

Nope, the 200 Mile limit is a Economic Enterprise Zone, not a Territorial Limit... What that means is other nations can transit that Zone, but they can NOT Fish, or Extract, in those waters, without approval of the Nation claiming the Zone. This is what China is now trying to claim in the China Sea....

kellory · Feb 9, 2014

The original limit was enforced with shore mounted cannon in costal forts. Their maximum shooting range was three miles, and that is where the limit came from. I may not up to date on the current limit, perhaps.

ClovisMan · Feb 10, 2014

CaboWabo5150 said: ↑

They actually do have enough of a navy to warrant at least keeping an eye on. Specifically the 3 Russian made Kilo class subs.
With refueling capabilities in Cuba, they really could be a threat. No one really knows the depth of their relationship with North Korea, but I would bet Kin Jong Un would be willing to give one of his nukes to the Iranians if they had a plan to use one of their subs as a launch vehicle, or as the base for a covert op to deliver a backpack sized warhead. Once a swimmer gets to the beach with one of those, you can imagine where it could be used. Anywhere...

Iranian Naval Fleet
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Can you imagine what it must smell like on a sub loaded with Iranians! Febreeze would have no chance.

CaboWabo5150 · Feb 10, 2014

kellory said: ↑

No. The three mile limit was a product of how far cannon could shoot to protect the coast. You got a three mile rifle?
Click to expand...

Never tested that kind of range, but I'm betting with enough arc I can get the .50BMG to act like mini artillery.

Gator 45/70 · Feb 10, 2014

kellory said: ↑

The original limit was enforced with shore mounted cannon in costal forts. Their maximum shooting range was three miles, and that is where the limit came from. I may not up to date on the current limit, perhaps.
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Texas and Florida claim more than 3 mile's, I guess they have better cannons ?

Yard Dart · Feb 11, 2014

The two Iranian warships headed toward U.S. waters — one of which barely survived a 1988 run-in with an American fighter jet — are a pair of "rust buckets" Tehran is using to prove to its people it can project power around the globe, naval experts said.
The commander of Iran’s Northern Navy Fleet said the ships — the frigate Sabalan and Kharg, a supply ship capable of carrying helicopters — began their trip last month from the southern port city Bandar Abbas. Adm. Afshin Rezayee Haddad said the vessels had already entered the Atlantic Ocean near South Africa en route to U.S. maritime borders as part of a three-month mission. Haddad characterized the move as a response to the ongoing presence of the U.S. Navy’s 5th fleet, which is based in Bahrain, across the Persian Gulf.
But the British-built ships, which are reportedly carrying roughly 30 Iranian Navy academy cadets, are not militarily imposing, according to defense experts reached by FoxNews.com.
“From a tactical perspective, neither one of these ships are any good; they are an afterthought to the U.S, Navy from a warfare perspective,” said Christopher Harmer, senior naval analyst at the Institute for the Study of War. “From a strategic standpoint, they are very important.”
“From a tactical perspective, neither one of these ships are any good, they are an afterthought to the U.S, Navy from a warfare perspective."
- Christopher Harmer, senior naval analyst, Institute for the Study of War
In 1988, the 310-foot Sabalan was attacked by American forces after it fired upon an A-6 Intruder aboard the USS Enterprise following tensions in the Persian Gulf. The Iranian ship was completely decimated but did not sink, ultimately being restored and improved — something not lost on the Iranian powers, Harmer said.
“They are very aware that we nearly sunk the Sabalan, and there’s absolutely a psychological message being sent here by the Iranian Navy,” he said. “Up until five years ago, everything the Iranians were doing was focused on short-range defense with their navy, including small-missile ships that were optimized for shallow waters in the Persian Gulf.”
The larger of the two ships, the 679-foot Kharg, is also British-built and can support three helicopters, but poses no real threat. One analyst, Michael Eisenstadt of The Washington Institute, characterized the aging vessels as “rust buckets” with little heft on international waters. Another expert questioned how much of the naval war games really convinces the average Iranian.
“What happens day after day in the Iranian press is there’s a constant theme that Iran is capable of defending itself and that the United States cannot attack or invade it,” said Anthony Cordesman of the Center for Strategic and International Studies. “A lot of that deals with the ability to deal preventive strikes.”
While the Iranian admiral said the ships were already in the Atlantic, Harmer said there are no indications that that’s the case. He said the ships were most likely approaching South Africa, still toiling in the southwestern Indian Ocean.
“I’m skeptical,” said Harmer, adding that the Iranians have previously expressed similar global naval aspirations. “But we’ll respond in the sense that we’ll keep an eye on them.”
Above all, the move should be seen as a direct message to Iranians, not the U.S. Navy or the citizens it protects, according to U.S. Army (Ret.) Lt. Col. David Johnson, now serving as executive director at the Center for Advanced Defense Studies.
“This would be aspirational and demonstrate that they have the capability to reach out to us and hopefully threaten us the way we threaten them on a daily basis,” Johnson told FoxNews.com. “I believe the target audience is internal -- not us. They are demonstrating to [Iranians] and others in the region that they can stand up to the big boy.”
If the ships make it across the ocean to U.S. maritime waters, they wouldn't even be a match for Coast Guard cutters, Johnson said.
“The point would be that the world is a much smaller place,” Johnson said, perhaps leading to expanded political pressure stateside to increase American presence in the region. “It’s a message to their population that we’re a conventional power.”
But the ships — and their capabilities — paint a different picture, according to Cordesman, who said they’re conventionally armed with the equivalent of little more than “terror weapons,” or less operational than a 2,000-pound bomb.
“We would get concerned if there was any kind of air-sea capability or missile launch capacity, or if Iran had the kind of surface or submarine fleet that could reach across the Atlantic,” Cordesman said. “At this point in time, Iran cannot pose a single meaningful naval threat outside the Persian Gulf and the Gulf of Oman.”
It isn't the first time Iran tried to use its modest navy to threaten the U.S. In 2011, Iran warned it might deploy warships close to the U.S. coast. The official IRNA news agency then quoted Iranian naval chief Rear Adm. Habibollah Sayyari saying, “Like the arrogant powers that are present near our marine borders, we will also have a powerful presence close to American marine borders.”
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Sinking feeling: Iranian Navy sends message with US-bound 'rust buckets' | Fox News

DarkLight · Feb 11, 2014

Ok, so bear with me here...

A SCUD missile has a range of 110 miles. There are already concerns that Iran already has fissile material. Is it completely out of the realm of possibility that they have even just one of these things parked below deck, oriented lengthwise down the center of the ship and that the deck has been modified to open, even a small portion of it, to launch at the US?

Would that be possible at all? And if so, who better to send on the suicide mission than a bunch of untrained cadets that "won't be missed" in a rust bucket that has already seen both better days and the back of our hand?

Yes, yes, I know the official line is that these are conventionally armed, but that's what we know about.

Yard Dart · Feb 11, 2014

DarkLight said: ↑

Ok, so bear with me here...

A SCUD missile has a range of 110 miles. There are already concerns that Iran already has fissile material. Is it completely out of the realm of possibility that they have even just one of these things parked below deck, oriented lengthwise down the center of the ship and that the deck has been modified to open, even a small portion of it, to launch at the US?

Would that be possible at all? And if so, who better to send on the suicide mission than a bunch of untrained cadets that "won't be missed" in a rust bucket that has already seen both better days and the back of our hand?

Yes, yes, I know the official line is that these are conventionally armed, but that's what we know about.
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Is this a feasible option for a first strike platform, sure. I highly doubt even they are that stupid, unless they had more than a few to do some true damage at one time.

BTPost · Feb 11, 2014

and if so, and since they have never tested their Atomic Triggers, what happens if they launch, and it doesn't go off? They get turned into a Glass Parking Lot, with absolutely No Noise from ANY other Country, and the blessings of Most..... and We, then go on a Rampage thru all their client States and waste them, as well..... Just to make sure everyone understands, what it means, to mess with US......

kellory · Feb 11, 2014

"True damage".....like an electromagnetic pulse? You know what that would do to the grid. Iran would become a parking lot, but we would be hit hard as well.

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Iran Says Warships Headed Close to U.S. Borders

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