1. The Topic of the Month for October is "Make this the Perfect Bugout Location". Please join the discussion in the TOTM forum.

Looting vs. Salvaging

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Motomom34, Nov 14, 2015.

  1. Motomom34

    Motomom34 Moderator Moderator Site Supporter++

    Southern Prepper 1 is a youtuber that has a series of scenario videos. He presented a video last week titled:
    Looting vs salvaging...We go into the city for needed parts

    Please watch the video and I have put some of the questions he asks at the bottom.


    Moral Issues: What is the difference between looting and Salvaging?

    What if they were shooting at the rightful owner?

    Tactical proficiency as a team.

    Point: Know your area and resources in it.
    Seepalaces likes this.
  2. Altoidfishfins

    Altoidfishfins Monkey++

    OK Moto. I'll attempt it. I may catch flak but that's ok.

    1. Looting - taking property which is still under the control of its owner. Salvaging - taking that property which has been abandoned or discarded by its owner.

    2. If I heard the video correctly, the owner died in a house fire two nights previous. However, that does not necessarily mean the property in question had been abandoned or discarded. Others may own it or have rights to it. Our two heroes may very well have been incorrect to do what they did.
    chimo, Seepalaces, Legion489 and 3 others like this.
  3. VisuTrac

    VisuTrac Ваша мать носит военные ботинки Site Supporter+++

    ^^ This
    Seepalaces and 3M-TA3 like this.
  4. kellory

    kellory An unemployed Jester, is nobody's fool. Banned

    Some very obvious mistakes.
    1) it is unlocked, and the lights are on. This does NOT MEAN "no one has been here" . especially when they KNOW folks have been going over the fence.
    2) they make no attempt to check the perimeter of the building for any other activity. They walked blindly and loudly into what could have been a killing ground. That was flat out stupid.
    3) I agree with everything said above.
  5. chelloveck

    chelloveck Diabolus Causidicus

    The distinction between looting and salvaging is pretty much, with some differences, the same as with ships. Taking a ship and stealing its contents whilst the ship is crewed and under command is called piracy / theft....recovering a ship that has been abandoned...whether found still floating or sunken, or foundered(without crew) on a shoal is generally considered salvage. On land, as has been pointed out earlier, that in the case of real property (and its contents) that is unoccupied: others may own or have legal rights to the property even if the premises / vehicle appears to be abandoned. Removing said property most usually is construed as stealing / theft / larceny, and is usually dealt with accordingly as a criminal matter. A lot will depend upon the particular circumstances and degree to which the law enforcement and the criminal justice systems are functioning during and/or after the period of emergency in question.

    A defence of dire necessity might possibly be argued in the case where the alternative is to die of starvation. However that defence may be substantially weakened if found removing jewellery, Large LCD televisions, stereo systems and first edition Marvel comics.

    Y(legal)MMV considerably....and my comments should in no way be construed as competent legal advice.

    What is moral, may not necessarily be legal, and what is legal, may not necessarily be moral. The question is whether the risk of being shot or prosecuted is outweighed by necessity, driven by the need to survive, rather than just mere desire and avarice.
    Seepalaces likes this.
  6. Gator 45/70

    Gator 45/70 Monkey+++

    I'll eat your dog!

    You abandon your dog I'll eat it while it's still fat and healthy.

    Any Questions?
    Ganado and Seepalaces like this.
  7. Tobit

    Tobit Ham Extra Class

    Are you Asian?
    Homer Simpson and Seepalaces like this.
  8. Gator 45/70

    Gator 45/70 Monkey+++

    Coonass, I can use the term since I'm Bona Fide and I know the true meaning.

    What breed of dog you have?
    Ganado and Seepalaces like this.
  9. Motomom34

    Motomom34 Moderator Moderator Site Supporter++

    In my opinion those two in the video crossed the line to looters when they got in the warehouse and decided to bring the truck back and clear the place out. Their original intent was to get one thing they needed which I had no issue with but they crossed the line when they wanted to take everything before someone else got it. Did they need all the stuff? Don't know, but they were going to take it.

    As for the owner being dead. They heard, they didn't confirm themselves. And they never mentioned family of the supposed deceased.
    3cyl, Mountainman, Ganado and 2 others like this.
  10. VisuTrac

    VisuTrac Ваша мать носит военные ботинки Site Supporter+++

    the video rubs me the wrong way.
    "Look at all the stuff"
    "we can't use it, we can trade it"
    "Come back tomorrow and get everything you can"

    They shoot looters don't they?
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2015
    Gator 45/70, 3cyl, pearlselby and 5 others like this.
  11. Motomom34

    Motomom34 Moderator Moderator Site Supporter++

    Exactly @VisuTrac I agree they were looters. I started the video thinking they were good guys but in the end, they were not people I would want to be with.
  12. duane

    duane Monkey++

    I don't think that there is such a thing as salvage under normal conditions on land. An argument can be made for salvage on the water as there is a long history of recovering things when a ship is either about to sink or has been driven ashore and will be destroyed. Even that has limitations, as some of the treasure divers are finding out. If things fall totally apart, then the concept of individuals using something before it is destroyed for the good of society, may be extended to the land. The bigger problem is society "salvaging" your stuff for the general good. Eminent domain, ex post facto laws, hoarding laws, zoning laws, convents on deeds, licenses, environmental rules, I could continue for pages all limit your property rights and the sheep and their leaders are very good at using them to their benefit and against you.
  13. Seepalaces

    Seepalaces Monkey Site Supporter+

    Interesting because I was just thinking about this. Good topic.
    chelloveck, Ganado and Motomom34 like this.
  14. TailorMadeHell

    TailorMadeHell Lurking Shadow Creature

    Avoid the argument... Be well stocked so yours can last so you won't be looters. If you take anything off of dead looters, you are salvaging.
    Motomom34, 3cyl, Seepalaces and 2 others like this.
  15. BTPost

    BTPost Old Fart Snow Monkey Moderator

    How many Big Screen Tvs, does one need to "Salvage" from WallMart "Liberators"....
  16. Yard Dart

    Yard Dart Vigilant Monkey..... Moderator Site Supporter++

    I think this is the Grey area that most ponder. If MZB's are walking the street.....fine do what you have to do to survive as long as you do respect the property rights of the living.

    If we go into grid down for 6 months and then you start venturing out looking for 're-supply.....the same as above.

    If we are talking a short term issue....what is not yours and the taking of, makes you a thief.
  17. kellory

    kellory An unemployed Jester, is nobody's fool. Banned

    No one will ever tell you if it will be long term or short term. .Gov will always say "we are almost ready to" or "just give us anlittle more time" or "a little more power".
    At no time will authority say " this will last forever, and you are on your own."
    Sooner or later, you will have to make that decision yourself.
  18. Yard Dart

    Yard Dart Vigilant Monkey..... Moderator Site Supporter++

    If one is waiting for the government to tell them how and when to survive for their families sake......they are in trouble....doom on them.
  19. kellory

    kellory An unemployed Jester, is nobody's fool. Banned

    "If we are talking a short term issue....what is not yours and the taking of, makes you a thief."
    My point is, you will never know if this is short term or not, until it isn't.
    Seepalaces likes this.
  20. Yard Dart

    Yard Dart Vigilant Monkey..... Moderator Site Supporter++

    Should I allow you the last word.....no. You are doing it again Kell.... Best to not always have the better response than another....but sometimes you should just listen to what is said. Nobody likes someone that has to counter ever post another makes....ehh?!

    Most preppers know the difference between a short term issue and a long term issue. If you have two weeks of grub and minimal means to protect your family....you are in deep shit. FEMA says you should have three days of supplies....if you fall into that group of short term thinkers....you are a [sheep]
  1. TI.Proof
  2. TI.Proof
  3. azrancher
  4. melbo
  5. CATO
  6. Yard Dart
  7. Yard Dart
  8. Yard Dart
  9. sec_monkey
  10. melbo
  11. CATO
  12. melbo
  13. melbo
  14. melbo
  15. BTPost
  16. Yard Dart
  17. stg58
  18. melbo
survivalmonkey SSL seal        survivalmonkey.com warrant canary