Mall Ninjas and Video-game Warriors

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Seacowboys, Dec 11, 2007.


  1. Seacowboys

    Seacowboys Senior Member Founding Member

    I can't help but note the common thread between most of these mass-killings that seem to ravage our schools, churches, and shopping centers seems to be video games. I believe there is a conditioned response to playing games of simulated destruction on a massive scale that desensitizes these children to death.If they die, they reboot and try again.
    I have noticed a skepticism towards video training for combat and I have to contend that a video warrior is much more of a threat than a trained warrior; why? Because the video warrior is playing a game and becomes totally immersed in an alternate reality, while a trained combat vet truly knows how fragile life really is. We have given Walter Mitty new weapons and played them in 3-D. This makes fr a very frightening scenerio when these gamers finally loose their grip on their own mundane life and decide to take as many out with them as they can.
     
  2. hartage

    hartage Monkey+++

    Bingo.... video games today teach (inappropriately) too many tools on how to kill but not the concequences. You can always just start a new game.



    Although that is also changing. Now you have the opportunity to have "bots" help you as part of your group you command. You get to know them too about their families, backgrounds their emotions. You see them get hurt but they keep on fighting with you. You do form an attatchment to them that you can feel loss when they do die. You just chatted with him a little while ago and he told you about his family and g/f back home. Now after fighting by your side and saving your a$$ more than once he lies there dead.

    The tools are given to the kids (how to kill efficiently) but not the reasons NOT to do so. To them it is just fun and games. When they take the same practice into the real world the body count goes up.
     
  3. Seacowboys

    Seacowboys Senior Member Founding Member

    You-tube is full of FLIR images being chain-gunned to wild-ass sound-tracks. I fly a remote operated vehicle at work rather than expending divers to do certain missions. Robots and Drones are fighting battles now and it is the Mall-ninja that's flying them.
    When we were children, we played Army and fought battles with toy guns and sticks; when someone got hurt, we all payed the price by getting our butts spanked or grounded. Kids now can play Hit-man or fight any major battle without the risk of injury and with so much realism that they might believe combat is like that.[patr]
     
  4. Blackjack

    Blackjack Monkey+++

    No. I don't believe there is any meaningful connection to the violence and videogames. Most certainly no causality.

    You could make the same statement about 16 to 22 year old males and anything, because they all play the games. The majority of mass-murderers throughout history have cited the bible as their influence, yet we haven't condemned the bible for that. We are talking about crazy people here, they can read Dr. Seuss and decide that their neighbor needs to be burned at the stake.

    I've been heartlessly killing billions of people at a time ever since 1980 when "Missile Command" was released, millions more with countless other games including the latest first person shooters.... and I have not, nor has any sane person gone on an actual killing spree because of it.

    We could come up with a hundred "common threads" with the mass shootings..... soda pop & sweets, caffeine, public school, Tommy Hilfiger, too much Barney the dinosaur as a child, trans fats, on and on.

    Before video games it was Judas Priest and Ozzy Osbourne, before them it was probably Elvis Presley.

    There is no link. We try to logically find a cause where there is no logic to be had, because they're nuts.
     
  5. Quigley_Sharps

    Quigley_Sharps The Badministrator Administrator Founding Member

    BlackJack
    I’m taken back by your statement, I totally agree with you.
    I also played those games
     
  6. Seacowboys

    Seacowboys Senior Member Founding Member

    Just because you didn't turn out to be a mass murderer, you think this extends to everyone? What if only one in a thousand looses it? or in a million? I am pointing out a common thread between a bunch of loosers and if you want to ignore it because you didn't climb the tower, go ahead.
     
  7. RightHand

    RightHand Pioneer in a New World Moderator Founding Member

    Sorry Blackjack, but I have to disagree with you there. Elvis turned us into hormone ridden, sex-crazed, boy and girls who were going to burn in hell because we learned to shake our hips. [lolol] Who knows, maybe I will yet!
     
  8. Minuteman

    Minuteman Chaplain Moderator Founding Member

    I have to agree with Sea and Hartage here. I was a big Dungeons and Dragons player and there was all the hype about that causing kids to go crazy.But it was only the ones who were off to start with. These ultra-violent games don't cause these nut jobs to go off but you cannot ignore the connection. They may desinsitize those already predisposed to violence. They incite those to live out their fantasy.

    I don't hold the game itself to blame. But I do support restricting them to at least 18 year olds. I don't think any 14 year old should be playing "killing" games. And while they cannot "train" you to effectively shoot a real world firearm they do show you tactics that will get you killed. I play a lot of the WWll games and especially sniper type ones. I have learned not to do certain things that got my character killed and later find the exact same warnings in John Plasters "Ultimate Sniper".

    When all of these killers are found to have been playing hours and hours of these games I say that there is something there not to be ignored. I think it all boils down to parenting. This latest guy in Co. spent 5 hours a day on the computer? Where the hell was his parents? They played these ultra-violent video games? Where the hell are the parents?

    No simple answers here. But I don't think you can dismiss the video gaming connection.
     
  9. Tango3

    Tango3 Aimless wanderer


    I would agree save 1 idea,video ninjas whooping 38(138?) levels of doom all have one thing in common hours isolated in front of a screen , no positively reinforcing social contact hence we have the borderline sociopathic mall idiots in the black ankle length dusters and agressive stares who think they're "neo". and just don't give a f about any other person.
     
  10. Blackjack

    Blackjack Monkey+++


    That's the thing.... I'm not ignoring it, I'm saying that games is no more a common thread than what kind of shoes they like to wear. The only substantive common thread is that they are frickin NUTS.

    It's human nature for us to look for reasons so that we can prevent these horrible events in the future, I understand this, I feel it too, but the truth is there is no answer other than they're crazy.

    What drives them crazy? Maybe parents, maybe pharmaceuticals, maybe fear of coming "out of the closet" in a society hostile to their disposition....... could be a million different things, there's not a single answer. But I can promise you (my opinion, of course).. it's not videogames or rock'n'roll, rap music, Harry Potter, or any of that. Sometimes people are just born "bad", and it never gets any better.

    Although I will admit to rap music almost pushing me over the edge a few times. ;)
     
  11. Blackjack

    Blackjack Monkey+++


    Now that I can agree with..... the videogame isn't the common thread, it's lack of social interaction and parenting (MM). The videogame is just what takes up their isolation time as it does with most young folks nowadays.

    If your a kid with no social life and no parents, and you tend to isolate yourself, what do you spend your time with? Answer, videogames. The games are only a symptom of the underlying problem.
     
  12. hartage

    hartage Monkey+++

    I think what I and others are trying to say about causality is this.....

    Are you a gambling man ? Vegas, atlantic city they are all built on 1-5 percent. The 00 on the roulette wheel is enough tip however slightly to the house's favor to make money hand over fist. As is reality with every gambling game except blackjack and poker. Play enough and the house will always win. That ever slight tip in favor makes all the difference in the world.

    The same with "off kilter people" how many of them would not have gone off the deep end with guns ? How many would have just crashed the car ? Trashed the house ? Instead of taking guns, lots of ammo going to a public place and looking for a body count ? Fantasy killing gorifies and gives idea to real killing. Made worse is the constant practice in game of taking cover, leading a moving target, shooting in controlled bursts, etc.

    There is no connection between Elvis's rotating hips and the devil. But there is a connection between killing people in a game with guns then killing people in the mall with guns.
     
  13. RightHand

    RightHand Pioneer in a New World Moderator Founding Member

    Although I hate to call it addiction, I do think there is a modicum of addiction involved in computer games. I even find myself spending too much time here when I could/should be doing something else. That in itself is isolating. I think that young people in particular get so involved in their games, they shut out everything else.
     
  14. ghrit

    ghrit Ambulatory anachronism Administrator Founding Member

    I can't help but wonder if the proportion of nuzoids is greater now than it was say 50 years ago. Loose cannons per 1,000,000 bodies, perchance? For sure, the loose nuts get more media attention now with the incredibly fast dissemination of "news." For sure, they have more targets to pick from. For sure, the number of destructive devices has increased, but again, is that in proportion to population? Does the current crop of nutzies get the same upbringing that the nutzies of 50 years ago have whupped into them, again proportionally?

    Some psychology major is going to do a thesis on this, or should.
     
  15. Seacowboys

    Seacowboys Senior Member Founding Member

    My step-son is without a doubt, one of the smoothest crane operators I have ever trained. He had a natural ability to judge the angles and motions and a touch on the controls that was amazing. It was at this point that I began to rethink my position that all the time and money he spent at video arcades while growing up was a waste. He still spends most of his income on computer games and when I watch him play, I realize that this is a major part of his development. He had no interest in hunting, or fishing, riding horses, playing sports; he is a gamer.
    I do not worry about him going postal but maybe I should. He is 27 and never had a real relationship. He is constantly in trouble for drinking or drugs. His only valuable possessions are an automobile, his computer, and a gold Rolex watch. I remember when he was a child, I took his BB gun away when I saw him back one of his little playmates up against the fence with it. I had to fire him from our company over his drinking and drug use. I can see no good ending here.
     
  16. Minuteman

    Minuteman Chaplain Moderator Founding Member

    Another factor that cannot be ignored is the "Rock Star" factor. The media has made these killers into sub culture icons that troubled kids are idolising. They know that if they kill enough people they will be famous and everyone will be talking about them.

    I was watching Fox news this morning and the hosts of the morning show were refusing to use the name of this guy in Colorado. They just referred to him as "the killer". I applaud that and think it should be SOP for all news media. Don't give these phsycopaths a platform. Refuse them the fame they are seeking and it may deter some in the future.
     
  17. Evenglischatiest

    Evenglischatiest Monkey+++

    Actually, blackjack is rigged in favor of the house too. The dealer always goes last. If everyone busts, he doesn't draw, regardless of his hole card.


    I didn't initially agree with this one. But Hartage makes a good point. I think the people who lose it were just born to lose it. But the manner in which they do so could easily depend on things like video games. [ghrit]

    That said, I still think Minuteman's "rock star" idea has more to do with it. That's why I go out of my way to never repeat the names of these sociopaths.


    And once again, you're all ignoring that poor little joystick smiley. [ghrit] [ghrit] [ghrit]
    This should be his chance to shine. :D
     
  18. hartage

    hartage Monkey+++


    I think you just hit on one of our points. Maybe the number of nutzoids are the same as have been in the past. Perhaps in the past the same population chose differnt ways to go ape. Some picked taking the farm tractor and mow down the fence/shed/whatever. Some decided to set fire to the barn. While others yet decided to beat the crap out of little johnny down the street. I'm sure others picked guns but vastly fewer and those that did even fewer still picked killing people.

    Fast forward to today. Think of violent first person shooters as both a training tool AND advertisement. Not only are we going to put in your head HOW to go ape we will train you also. Now the same number the same population of nutzoids are being united in HOW they choose to go nuts, how to be effective at it, and are even being invited to go nuts through fantasy of omnipotence.

    Just a bunch of maybes but it sure does not take very many nutzoids to ruin the whole country's day eh ?
     
  19. hartage

    hartage Monkey+++

    Wow, sorry to hear about your stepson. Has he volunteered anywhere before ? Maybe volunteering somewhere might give him a sense of purpose and of being needed. It might also ground him a bit more and appreciate what he already has when he works with those that don't.
     
  20. hartage

    hartage Monkey+++

    An excelent point. I didn't think of it from that angle before. Maybe we are as a community complicit unknowingly in this current trend. I mean they are just kids, the part of us most vulnerable to our blunders.
     
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