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Discussion in 'Back to Basics' started by Detentus, Jun 6, 2010.

  1. Detentus

    Detentus Monkey+

    We live in a small town, surrounded by woods on a country road with either neighbor living about 300 ft. and 400 ft. away respectively(through the woods.) If the worst were to happen, we are prepared in terms of water, food(now up to a year's worth for 4 people), and other basics as well. One set of neighbors is an older couple who've been here all their lives, hard-working, self-sufficient and with plenty of country know- how. Salt of the earth, religiious, farmer/carpenter...We enjoy their company and I hang out with the wife(shopping, talking tips, etc.). We would not hesitate to take them in if need be and share resources.

    The other neighbors are a couple in their forties who have 4 children under 6 y.o.a., live quite beyond their means, laid off, just found a job paying far less than the job he voluntarily left last year. She's a SAHM. Nice enough, but always asking for something. Hurting for money and I fear that they may lose the house if they don't get their act together and learn to live more frugally. They won't be able to sustain their standard of living at the rate they're going: AC on all the time, no clothesline, high utility bills, you know the drill. She just had a baby and I suspect that this time next year she'll be with child again. Not my business, but it is what it is. I doubt they've thought in terms of being prepared for a worst cast scenario and currently they're receiving food stamps and MA health, although probably not too much longer.

    My husband told me to wait and see and said, "We'll cross that bridge when we come to it." when I asked him what our moral obligation would be and what would we do if there were an interruption in services of any kind, necessitating initiation of our survival plan.

    Has this issue ever been discussed here? What are your thoughts? I'm not a cold-hearted person, but I do believe in being as self-sustaining and sufficient as possible and have given up alot of luxuries in order to achieve that goal.
    I really cold use some advice. If this thread is not appropriate for this forum, please let me know.
  2. UGRev

    UGRev Get on with it!

    I'll make my comment short and sweet.
    Everyone deserves a second chance, but they're going to have to work for it and pull their weight. Failure to do so will result in them being forced to leave.

    How you inform them that they must participate is up to you.
  3. Detentus

    Detentus Monkey+

    UGRev, thanks. I think that, in and of itself would be a dilemma. Hopfully, I'll never have to find out. I've read Rawles' book and he said charitable giving is our moral imperative, but it should be done at arm's length. How do you do that with neighbors? Is anyone else in the same position and have you given this some thought?
  4. UGRev

    UGRev Get on with it!

    My neighbors are 40 feet away on either side. I know for a fact that they are not preppers. I would be living in a hot zone and lost my primary bug out place because of what I assume was some sort of directive by the LDS church in which my friend is a member of. He had land that i was helping him out with when I could. I have a backup spot should things get riotous and "Mad Max", but other than that, there is no convincing my wife.. So I'm stuck here.

    My alternate, "Wife Resistant", plan is to basically gather and rally those neighbors and seek to organize the entire segment of the neighborhood. I'm good friends with my immediate neighbors so that will make things easier for me and for the rest of us. Add to that the fact that I've been prepping more than they have and I might have some leverage in getting people to listen. Trying to position myself as the "leader" would not be my goal. But I would at the very least, be able to get people to work together to help maintain themselves and the immediate area. It's not the best plan in the world and it's full of holes, but it's the only one I have at the moment.
  5. Detentus

    Detentus Monkey+

    UGRev, as a wife I found the "wife resistant" comment hilarious. I think yours is a good plan and I often wonder how this would play out in my neck of the woods. There are several neighbors down the street who hunt and are very country savvy. Including the older couple we like so much. They are a wealth of information and we trade back and forth.
  6. tacmotusn

    tacmotusn Mosquito Sailor

    Hmmmm. You live in a small town .... if you actually live in town, you may have far larger problems than just one slacker close neighbor family. How large of a small town? Does it have a police department? How covert have you been about your food supply? What are you prepared to do to keep it? From what you have been able to assess what is the general concensus among the people of your small town about these issues. You have to carefully pick and choose who you talk to about these issues. You can't just go around with a sign saying, "Well prepared survivalist! How about you?"
    Bottom line, Unless you are willing to give up all you have worked for to anyone who asks or demands what you have, you are going to have to harden your heart, and be prepared to fight.
    I would suggest you go to the reading section here a read a bit. Go to the library or book store and obtain "Patriots" by Rawles .... also get "One Second After" (unsure of author)
    Good luck, God Bless!
  7. Detentus

    Detentus Monkey+

    Tac, I'm in the process of reading "Patriots" right now, having just finished "One Second After." I have Rawles' other book on hand "How to Survive End of World..."

    Small town:less than 4,000 people, have PD and Fire..

    We keep our preparations very close to the vest and talk to no one about it, except my two sons who would need to get out here(about 60 miles from where they are.) I do speak to my siblings, who are also a distance away, and let them know they should be prepared, too.

    I suppose it's because I've read these books, or am reading now, that this is such a concern of mine. Not to mention the dire economic straigts this country and others are in right now.

    Thanks for the blessing, BTW.
  8. fortunateson

    fortunateson I hate Illinois Nazis!

    Let me tell you about friends of ours.

    He's a good guy and we've been friends for about 15 years. Our personalities "click".
    She and my wife are best buddies and meet and talk more than once a week.
    They have a 21 yo. daughter who is like a big sister to my kids. They have a ball together.

    That's where the similarity ends.
    He's never able to keep 2 nickels to rub together. I mean dead broke. Phone being shut off, problems with the IRS, repos. You name it.
    At times, he's made over 150k / year. I know this for a fact. I think he's got a habbit that he's spending his money on, but he's never come clean.
    He recently started asking me for money.

    She works for about $10/ hour. Never cooks or eats in. Always eats out, and Starbucks at least twice / week. Doesn't even want to try for a promotion or more hours (she works 35/week)

    The daughter (21) has never had a job. Not in school. doesn't drive. Basically just sits at home, eats and asks for money. Since she's an only child, they both cave in and give her what she wants.

    My wife is on board with the preps but does not participate. I keep telling her that these friendships are going to come to an end and soon! As things get worse, their situation will become more dire. Eventually, they are going to look to us - already started actually.
    Wife agrees, but as usual, I lead, and she follows (not complaining - just the way it is).

    We keep freezer bags on hand. They will get a bag or two of rice. That's it.
    It's going to be a difficult thing to do, and we're going to make enemies. That's just the way it is. And it's not because of anything we do. It's just the nature of people like that. In their very hearts, they are cheats. They want to do "2" and "2" and have it add up to "6". They keep trying to cheat life but it doesn't work. They seem nice, but they have the heart of a thief. I'll bet it is the same with your neighbors. I think it's really true of anyone who lives like that.

    Try this test: Put yourself in their shoes. If you were down and out and asked for a hand, you would be eternally grateful for that bag of rice. Even if you knew there was a lot more where that came from. Why? Because you're honest. You don't have the gut reaction that someone owes you something just because they have abundance. But you know you won't get gratitude with your neighbors right?
    I know it is the same situation with these folks.

    I'm sounding like Ayn Rand. If you haven't already, read Atlas Shrugged. She explains it way better than I do.
  9. Detentus

    Detentus Monkey+

    Fortunateson, aren't the actions of people like these a major problem in this country right now? You can't spend more than you take in without having to pay the piper sooner or later(or getting fellow taxpayers to foot the bill.)

    That said, I'm halfway through Patriots and if we apply his code of "giving until it hurts", yet ensuring our own needs are first met, we'll be alright.

    I'm actually the driving force behind this preparatiion, food storage et all. At first I thought I was being a bit paranoid, but the economic scenario globally does not look good. I don't know why people think this country is immune to something happening, but they do. I live in MA and we have our share of inclement weather, so I've always made sure we had enough in the way of emergency supplies. Yet, two years ago, our region had an ice storm that knocked out power to some communties for weeks. There was a rush on generators and they were hard to find. We had one(we now have two, one of which is hard wired to the house and can run all with the flip of a switch). A local business placed a rush order on these for people, only to have those same people return them and get their money back after things returned to normal. As if this could never happen again. I just don't understand it. One fellow sued the utility company for the cost of a very expensive generator. :rolleyes:

    This just reinforces my belief that most people rely on others, or the government, to bail them out all the time and I think it's disturbing that society has lost it's ability to think for itself and assume responsibility for its own actions. Okay, rant over.

    Reading Rawles' book, The End of the World as We know it...., and one by Peggy Layton about food storage and survival really opened my eyes. We even had all our dental and medical needs taken care of in the past few months:now it's just maintenance.

    I hope and pray that nothing happens, but being somewhat ready gives me a sense of balance.
    jack_froste likes this.
  10. Tango3

    Tango3 Aimless wanderer

    I was gonna hand it to you for the one bag idea( i thought that was the "the answer"). You made a very good point; (highlighted above) they( those "kind" of folks) aren't gonna be real thankful with one bag :rolleyes:(i.e. food you have to cook? What am I supposed to do with this?)...Scary stuff...
  11. fortunateson

    fortunateson I hate Illinois Nazis!

    I have this theory that there are some people who wouldn't know what to eat without McDonald's. I think (not proven yet) that there are some people who couldn't boil up Ramen noodles if their life depended on it.
    I'll bet there are some that couldn't even handle a microwave pizza.
    The four food groups are Big Mac, Fries, Coke and McNuggets.
    Every time I go into a fast food joint I see nothing but grazing cows.

    May be a good idea for a documentary...
  12. UGRev

    UGRev Get on with it!

    I freaken love Ramen noodles... :)
  13. fortunateson

    fortunateson I hate Illinois Nazis!

    I was on a Ramen noodle palooza until about 6 months ago when doc said I have to give up all wheat products.
    They're great for adding into stuff. Throw them into homemade chicken soup :)
    Still jonesing for the stuff.
  14. Tracy

    Tracy Insatiably Curious Moderator Founding Member

    It's not easy to say No, though sometimes necessary (for you or the friend).
    It is it that moment - and not a second before - that you discover whether you have it in you or not.
  15. Detentus

    Detentus Monkey+

    Tracy, thank you. I think this is what my husband was referring to when he said that we'd cross that bridge when we come to it. Maybe I should listen to him more?
  16. UGRev

    UGRev Get on with it!

    tell my wife that, pleeeaasssee!!!! I would love it if she listened to me more. Right now, she just tolerates my preparednoidness. ;)
  17. Tracy

    Tracy Insatiably Curious Moderator Founding Member

    Now, let's not go and do anything drastic ;).

  18. Detentus

    Detentus Monkey+

    Okay, I'll just pretend then and say, "Yes, Dear."
  19. Tracy

    Tracy Insatiably Curious Moderator Founding Member

    Atta girl!

    [peep]I feel repercussions a comin'. :lol:
  20. Suerto

    Suerto Monkey+

    In situations like what you describe, when TSHTF, families will turn against each other.. I have family members who feel that you owe them if you have more, and thats now.. Imagine when they become desperate, in a real life threatening situation.

    I would keep people like that at guns length, for, if they have no honor or forethought now, I wouldnt imagine them developing any in the future. But, I'm a cynic. Work first, then food, see if they have the fortitude to carry out a task before the reward, I wouldnt do it the otherway around.
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