New member from EU

Hi, I'm glad there is a place to talk about prepping and the future that is not entirely controlled by big social media companies.

I'm a young adult woman from EU.

I'm interested in prepping with a doomsday orientation.

I expect life to be unrecognizable in about 10-15 years due to the climate (and the agriculture instability it brings), AI developments, geopolitics and war, wealth inequalities and technofeudal dreams, plastics and other pollutants, pandemics, and biosphere impoverishment.

I'm here because I want to get fit and disciplined again and it would be great to do it with a fellow prepper. I will share more details in the fitness area.

 

Welcome from Dixie (aka The South). I'm sure that you can give us some insight into prepping in Europe, as opposed to here.

 

@Wildbilly Prepping in EU isn't a structured subculture and it's a relatively new (and seemingly fast-growing since about 2019) thing, so for example a lot of gear isn't easy to find (a Sawyer water filter costed me 3 times its price in USA a few years ago for example, and I can't find a pressure canner unless I'm willing to pay more than its price just to import it. Don't make me talk about freeze-dried food...).

There is no commonly known stereotype of prepper here (in USA from what I've gathered that seems to be "solitary conservative overweight white man from a rural area that enjoys larping of being a navy seal"), no marketing towards it... Most people haven't heard the word once.

I think part of it is the fact that we don't share the American firearms culture nor your taste for the new, and that while we are still capitalistic and individualistic cultures there is more of a social safety net (for the time being) so people don't feel they need to be as self-reliant and capable of defending themselves as Americans.

My area is a bit too traditional and religious to imagine the future as something fundamentally different from the past. People are also (weirdly) more openly status-conscious than Americans, and if you are worried about having the best car and nailpolish you can't learn to grow potatoes in a container properly. Maybe we don't miss the off-grid life as much because our cities' spaces are less aggressive so to speak in their pursuit of modernity.

The biggest obstacle for a prepper here in my opinion is the population density: we are packed so tight many of us have 100s of people in a 3dimensional 100 metres radius at any given time. People around me are also more reluctant and scared to embrace people who are different, so being openly prepper-adjacent would have a bigger social price here

 

Welcome and don't talk so much, Any around you that don't prep will simply beg, borrow, steal your stuff.
The less they know the better off you are!
My English friends that drop by love a day at the range doing skeet and other stuff, Keep an open mind.

 

@accountability A very warm welcome! We hope you hang around and become more engaged in conversations than most from Europe.

"I expect life to be unrecognizable in about 10-15 years..."
Frankly, I believe you hit the nail right on the head! Sadly, I think especially Europe is coming close to the breaking point, so I certainly understand your position and it makes perfectly good sense. Thankfully, I think America has back away from that breaking point and slowing reversing course...we hope.

We hear are common sense folks, come from all walks of life, all sorts of professions, with a ton of knowledge and experience. We hope you can add to that experience and knowledge.

Lastly, what country in Europe are you? I spent about 20 years in Western Europe...

Welcome!

 

Welcome to the Tree from Coastal North Carolina.

Your population density sounds like the biggest challenge. In your situation I'd concentrate on things that can't be taken away from you, (Fitness, knowledge, practical skills) and quiet networking. Start with people-watching. Are there people who are away often? Where do they go? Might be important to know them. Who digs the graves in town? Who goes fishing? Are there old people who might need assistance? They have knowledge of local things that you may never find in a book.

The Larping sounds silly, but those folks are camping, making cooking fires, sleeping in tents, doing things in ancient ways, and are getting out of crowded urban areas to do it. They also beat on each other and strategize about battle. They make most of their own gear, and there are likely historians and craftsmen scattered among their ranks that you could learn much from.

I don't care for the term Pepper. I grew up like this. Sustainability, canning, gardening, fixing old stuff or making do without the latest gadget was how my parents managed to keep us fed. Living at the beach keeps us in practice for power and water outages, for a day to a week. I use non-electric lighting almost daily, and cook more meals on gasoline and kerosene stoves than on my new electric stovetop.

If there's anything I can't do myself, there's an excellent chance that I know a guy who can. It's like the "I know a guy..." network. Between the bunch of us we always seem to be able to get things done. It's this people power and network of abilities that gives me the most comfort.

There's a couple lifetimes of reading to catch up on here on the SM Forum. From basic fire starting to advanced off-grid solar power, and canning food the old way. Folks here don't just try this stuff on weekends, they live it every day.

Pull up a branch and after you do a couple pull-ups on a higher branch, have a seat and see what you can learn from just searching old posts.

 

Hey, I resemble those remarks!

 

Welcome to the Tree from Coastal PNW of BC Canada

 

Welcome.

"Operational security", usually called opsec is paramount as was previously mentioned. If things get bad people will want your goods, so keep it quiet.
I don't know the firearm situation where you are, but you must be able to defend yourself and your stuff or it's all for naught.

The pressure canner cost bothers me. What if someone sent you a pressure canner as a gift? Would the exhorbitant costs then apply? What about a "used" canner? And can you gather enough jars and lids, etc. to make it work?
You can water bath can some things in just a regular pot with a good sealing lid.

This place is a gold mine of knowledge, but do your own research as well.

I wish you the best.

 

"The firearm situation" and self defense in general sounds like a serious concern in the EU. Knife making and sharpening might even be questionable. Perhaps the OP could explore knife possession laws in their area and report back. I would hope that something short, but razor sharp like a Finnish Puukku birding knife would be permissible. Keeping in mind that in a world without rule of law the words permissible and allowed are meaningless, she has to tread a fine line and stay always gray.

I was wondering if mastery of the sling and staff sling might be possible during a trip away from crowded areas where there are plenty of free projectiles. I've always made mine from leather boot laces and old boot tongues. I practiced with both as a teenager and was quite deadly with them. We had no lack of stones then. It's a different story here on the beach where everything is sand. I have learned a new trick since moving here with the staff sling. By setting the pocket on the ground and filling it with coarse marl sand or a load of pebbles it becomes a formidable weapon against area targets. In close quarters, like a narrow alley, it would not be pleasant to be on the receiving end of an unexpected high velocity blast of gravel. It'll also hurl baseball size stones so fast that any imperfections whistle in the air. Slip the sling off the end and it's just a walking stick. A stout one for me, as a four foot shovel handle with a large screw run in flush in the bottom to prevent wear, seems about right for my height. I certainly never feel defenseless with it in hand.

 

Might want to look into historical weapons from the era prior to firearms (swords, axes, maces, war-hammers, long bows, cross bows and pole arms), also early firearms such as firelocks, matchlocks, flintlocks and percussion weapons might be available. Later firearms from WW1 and WW2 might be available, but ammunition could be hard to come by and expensive. However, you must be able and willing to use a weapon on another human for them to be effective.

 

Welcome from the soggy but beautiful Pacific Northwest (USA)!

There is much information here and several outstanding and knowledgeable contributors.

I would pay close attention to the experiences of FerFal (Argentina economic collapse and lawlessness) and Selco (Balkan War). Both survived urban collapse and lived to tell the tale.

Threads on them here: ferFAL Some first hand experience A brief story of Argentina and here: ferFAL Some first hand experience A brief story of Argentina

There are many facets of survival, but IMO the most important one is to abandon the concept that you can survive on your own. Too many skills and resources are needed for one person to maser. To whatever community you belong to currently ask yourself what the others would bring to the table should we face collapse? Medics, engineers, farmers, craftsmen, fabricators, mechanics, military, police, etc.. What would you bring to the table and how would you fit in? IMO any medical experience would make you valuable to almost any group. A hungry mouth that brings nothing to the table may have a hard go of it.

The only way you can go it alone or as a very small group is to be wealthy enough to have protection, food, medical supplies and have it all in position before things break down. Even then you will not go unnoticed and will have to fight or make alliances to protect it.

One thing I have noted is that while there is a lot off attention in preparedness communities to first aid, little attention is given to wound care after the situation has stabilized. It would be a shame to save a life with first aid stitches only to later see that person die of infection. A first aid kit is one thing, the knowledge and supplies for several weeks or even months of wound care is another,

FerFal interviews Selco: FERFal interviews Selco Begovic

Ferfal on Argentina: ferFAL Some first hand experience A brief story of Argentina

Again, welcome, and sorry for rambling on.

 

Years ago, I vacationed in Ireland and Scotland for two glorious weeks, Yeas later, as I was looking through some of the pictures I had taken, and found myself thinking that some of those castles, keeps, forts etc. would make excellent Bug-Out locations. Some ae quite large, some are ruins and some are not. Take the tours, take some photos and measurements, and try to figure a way to fortify any holes in the defenses. The better-known tourist attractions might not be a good idea, nor the piles of stones, but I saw many small forts and castles in both Ireland and Scotland that seemed to be abandoned (ex. a watchtower to guard a section of coastline from smugglers) but were in good repair. You would just have to get to the castle or fort, break-in, move in, barricade the door, and defend yourselves. You just have to be sure that the Sh*t has really and truely Hit The Fan (aka SHTF), otherwise you are in deep trouble!

 

Ok this is a very negative stereotype of what a US prepper is. It is also not very nice to come on to a site filled with US preppers and say it like this. I am a females, former military, volunteer firefighter/ EMT, full time engineer with a graduate degree, wife and mother and I am a prepper. I am not obese, or solitary and don’t enjoy larping as a navy seal. My husband is also not as you describe and he is also a prepper. Get that image out of your head. Learn to be extremely skeptical of anything the US media says. They are almost completely controlled by a single political ideology. I am sure there are some that fit that description but not a vast majority.

for who is an actual prepper here in the US, I know many military and former military lean that way, many first responders do a bit as well. I think some of this is due to job and life experience. Outdoors enthusiasts have a higher % of preppers as well. Rural or small town people do more that city people. It is not always conservatives that prep. Many have libertarian leanings as opposed to true conservatives. Some, like you, who seem more “ progressive” tend to prep for the climate change(tm) boogeyman. Some religious people prep as a tenant of their religion. Preppers in the US are a mixed bag. There are preppers that do for localized natural disasters like hurricanes, tornadoes, floods, blizzards, forest fires, earthquakes and volcanoes. This is usually how most preppers start out here in the US. We have much more extreme weather and natural disasters here than you guys in the EU usually see. Once you have prepped for that type of thing then continuing on to be prepared for other potential disasters is more of a natural progression.

if you are worried about climate you should take a look at space weather and the effect of the solar cycle on earth’s climate as well as on geological phenomena. If some of that doesn’t light a fire under you butt to prepare nothing will. People can cause pollution easy enough but we are at the mercy of our sun for how the weather really behaves.

 

Poof! From Chatty Cathy to nothing.

I was rather looking forward to hearing more about this "climate" thing. The only changes I've seen in the fifty or so years I've been hearing about it are the changing of the seasons. They're still absolutely in sync with the tourist season and are as predictable as the tides. The only visible changes I've noticed are that surf boards have gotten shorter, men's shorts have grown longer and women's swimwear has shrunk from what I thought was the bare minimum, to nearly bare everywhere. Historic sites along the coast still mark exactly the same high tide as they have for hundreds of years. Sands still shift predictably and I can show you where two old roads had been. One runs under the newest row of beach homes, the other is under the surf now. I have pictures of my car parked alongside that road forty years ago, before any houses lined the beach.

This is not climate change. It's slow and natural movement of sand that has been going on since the first ripple hit a beach. It makes news when a million dollar home crashes into the sea, but they knew this was inevitable, or certainly should have after talking to their insurance carrier.

 

I recommend moving to a place with less government/fewer people, and a climate that can support gardening. Move closer to the equator. I would get creative about what weapons you can own and not get in trouble.

 

Hy folks
I am a silent reader in this forum for some time. I am from Europe as well, more precisely from Switzerland. Lucky for me, we have a quite good gun law, means we can buy from hunting rifles, pistols up to full auto LMG's nearly everything with the right license. Optaining the licences is not too difficult. Weapons are more expensive than in the USA. We have a good system of shooting associations and the peoples voted seceral times against stricter gun laws. Regarding climate change we feel it with milder winters and less snow during the winter. Also summers tends to be drier and hotter.

 

Welcome ,there is a ton off info around here.
On this site a grumpy old man who seen to much of the stuff that hit the fan,living near amsterdam (ed). the sheep are not allowed to even carry a knife anymore.And false flag news is so old and trusted that i see no hope anymore.We are one of the most crowded places in europe,so living of the land works for 2 days then it looks like a swarm of locust was here and the big extinction start.