Discussion in 'Freedom and Liberty' started by -06, Oct 4, 2012.
The Nazi's would be proud of this. Considering the fact that 9-11 was an inside job to create war for profit and use terrorism as a platform to launch the largest police state and erect a modern prison control grid, this music video only supports these things by using patriotic propaganda. In fact, pretty much every modern war can be linked directly to the private banks and corporations who profit --from Napoleon to the Gulf of Tonkin, and even modern day Afghanistan.
If you want a people to die for your cause, raise a flag and tell them it is their flag. Inspire them to protect that flag against all enemies. Now, imagine an enemy who works for a secretive government and will also inspire religious fanatics to willingly blow themselves up on command. The secret government, with its CIA and numerous private groups created quite a monster, and the more patriotism in favor of another "allied victory" over a proliferated enemy there is, the better for the new world united nations.
DO YOU WANT TRUE INSPIRATION?
And the TRUTH shall set you free.
Amen Brokor, couldn't have said it better. That summed up my thoughts perfectly.
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Revisited: -06 I didn't mean to insult. Ordinarily, that would be a good song I guess. For most of my life I have gotten teary-eyed when I heard the national anthem and looked upon old glory. I love America, always will --but it's not the country I initially signed up to protect and defend, and it's not the nation it once was. Blind patriotism is dangerous, especially today with our abusive police state and corrupt government. Simply saying "we can change it and make it better" is not good enough anymore.
Ron Paul may not be an eloquent speaker, but his words are echoed by a growing number of patriots today who KNOW about the abuses of government and the corporations who have run our beloved republic into the ground. What we need now, more than ever is some Gadsen fever.
And less blind obedience.
I share my 97 year old mother in law's sentiments about flag waving and patriotic song singing. She is a survivor of the Jewish holocaust in WWII and found, as many others did, that as the flag waving increased, and the sounds of patriotism became louder and more strident, the fewer were the freedoms that the citizenry actually came to enjoy. Patriotism can too easily be harnessed by those who have the cunning and the power to manipulate the public space to do the most heinous things imaginable. When patriotism becomes indistinguishable from jingoism, and national hubris becomes the engine for patriotism, then that country is in dire trouble and is usually headed for a spectacular fall.
Ben Johnson (..."Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel."); Thoreau (" Patriotism is a maggot in their heads."); and many others through history, have been cautious if not critical of unbridled patriotism.
I do not subscribe to the dictum "My country right or wrong". If my country is wrong or does wrong, then I consider it is a moral obligation to challenge that which is wrong and that which my country does wrongly. In so doing that is a greater commitment to my country than doing a bit of ephemerally self congratulatory feel-good flag waving or song singing.
Yes, Australia has a national anthem (which is pretty lame, and relatively few people know more than the first few lines of), and it has its share of emotive songs that, usually, once a year on Anzac day, get an airing. Australia's flag is an historical anachronism, but few people can be all that bothered to change it to something more reflective of Australia's independance from the Old Country, and more reflective of what represents Australia as a sovereign nation in the third millenium CE. Patriotism to most Australians is not so much a matter of flag waving or song singing, but holding the achievements of Australia's and Australians' achievements in the past in reverential respect, acknowledging those things that Australia did badly, and making ammends for them; and actually living and suppporting the core values of Australian society.
For me....a digger's slouch hat serves better on a flag staff than the national flag (During WWII when Australian troops captured one of the Cyrenican port towns in North Africa (Bardia I think), an Australian flag could not be found at the time to run up the flag pole as a symbol of the Australians' victory and the Italians' defeat: so they ran up the flag pole an Aussie digger's slouch hat instead.)
As for patriotic songs.....and patriotic verse.....the following are as patriotic as I am inclined to go....
The following web page gives an interesting take on "patriotism"
Ah, Chelly, you've gone PC on us. "third millennium CE" should read "third millennium AD."
I realise you are probably only winding me up, Ghrit, but you do raise an interesting point.
Calendar and era dating systems are quite arbitrary and there is no sound reason to prefer Anno Domini over the usage of CE for The Common Era, particularly as the BC / AD system of dating historical events in relation to the putative birth of Christ did not originate until about 525 CE (when Dionysius Exiguus, originated their use in his computations for the date of Easter). In some senses, the BC / AD dating system is a nonsense in that it does not actually accurately commence at the supposed birth of Christ. (for details check out the link at the bottom of this post)
As a secular humanist I see no more reason to refer to 2012 CE as 2012 AD as I would Year 5774 (based on the supposed date of the creation of the earth in the Jewish tradition) other than the fact that bugger all would know what year 5774 was unless they were observant Jews.. No....it's not a matter of being PC, just that I don't subscribe to the Christian conceit that all of human history is relative to the birth of a man / god, for whom there is little evidence of his existence independant of the cobbled together texts of the Christian "New Testament".
Just because some cultural practices are followed because of "tradition", does not necessarily mean that those traditions are locked in concrete and can't be changed. After all, Christendom changed the Judaic tradition of dating world events from the commencement of the Creation as recorded in the Torah. Who knows, in the future, time will be be measured from the creation of The FSM - the diety with the noodly appendage....such a system would be no more or less arbitrary than any other method of dating world history in use.
For a more expansive discourse of the merits of using BCE / CE over BC / AD check out the following link:
CE. I stand corrected, always thot it was "current era."
both Current Era and Common Era are acceptable usages for CE as I understand it.
Well, as usual Chel. you have sidetracked another thread to suit your aggenda and ideals. Will go along with your "thunkin" and say that nationalism is a dangerous trap for any country to fall into. What makes America great is that we tolerate different values/beliefs/religions and supposedly aim for the common good. Anyone's opinion/words are just as valuable as another whether we agree or not with them--and that is as it should be. If a person does not support our country, constitution, ideals then they should seek another for they are not an "american".
I agree that is part of it. Another part which makes it great is the understanding that we are each sovereign and the government does not have the power to dictate.
Yup, such is the way of opinions.
Here we may diverge a little in our perceptions. One of the greatest rights of a free people is for them to "opt-out" of any allegiance or alliance. There is no contract signed by a natural born citizen; and there is no ideal which is to be held in the same light as a legal obligation, at least, not under the republic of these United States. There was a time when secession was often threatened, and previous to the unification after the Civil War, State's rights were primary. I still believe the 10th Amendment is grossly ignored. I do agree with you that we should each support our Constitution --it remains as the single greatest limiting document of our time and should not be brushed aside for modern cause. The concept of "Country", "Fatherland" or "Homeland" coming first is the same tactic used in the past by tyrants. This is why I find it critical for us to remember our history, Constitution and the Federalist Papers. As for not being classified an "American" by many today...meh. It wouldn't bother me one bit. Most don't even have a clue about what I just typed, let alone what it really means to be an American. Was it Jefferson who is quoted as saying we need a rebellion or revolution every so often to keep liberty alive?
It seems to me that blind obedience to a federal government is just about as "Un-American" as it can get.
Common fits it best.
As we can recall, there were great problems even envisioning the abuse of power associated with a federal government --and I feel like none were more prevalent than the concept of the use of our militias. As has been stated by Hamilton above, he was not a fortune teller. He couldn't even imagine the massive federal government, federal armies, navy, air force, secret service, FBI, CIA, NSA, BATF and more...he certainly did not expect individual states to acquiesce and for the people to give in to tyranny at every level --federal armies and agents, state agents and police and local police. He did stress the need for the States to keep the power in deciding and appointing officers. So much for that idea.
Everywhere we look today, our entire society has been militarized under "Homeland Security" and the Federal Government.
Hamilton's eyes would pop out of his head if he saw just 10 minutes of YouTube Copwatch news or Alex Jones.
seems to work?
Nah, strange. When I try to insert a link to a website in custom bb code like this: link here It gives an error.
And it worked this time.
Separate names with a comma.