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Personal Defense Ammo...What R U using?

Discussion in 'Firearms' started by Bandit99, Aug 22, 2018.


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  1. Bandit99

    Bandit99 Monkey+++ Site Supporter+

    So, I was nosing around my favorite sports shop today looking for some 9mm 124gr. Gold Dot but, like always, it's not to be found anywhere around here, for love or money, as it grows wings and flies off the shelf.

    They had some Sig Sauer V-Crown 9mm JHP 147 gr. on sale and having never shot anything over 124 gr. I picked up a couple of boxes. I have not looked up the ballistics but am wondering why the 124 gr. wasn't on sale while the 147 gr. was...Hmm? Anyway...My intent is to use this in my Glock 19 and my Glock 43.

    Question: On the smaller frame guns like M&Ps Shields and Glock 43s is there any negative side to shooting the heavier grain rounds besides the fact of more recoil?

    Question: What Personal Defense Ammo are you using in your EDC firearms and why?

    I'm just curious... The reason might be availability (like me as I want Gold Dot but impossible to find), cost, ballistics, or the fact that as long as it's a Hollow Point who cares. I used Independence 115 gr. HP for a long time because it is reliable, fairly priced, and I'm accurate with it.

    Anyway, I will shoot a box of this 147 gr. this weekend but I am betting that I will purchase the 124 gr. for the smaller G43 but, we'll see... Currently, I am a solid shooter at 30-35 feet and training at 45 foot (which is a different ballgame, so not so solid) so I will be able to see fairly quickly how this heavy ammo affects my shot groups.
     
  2. Kingfish

    Kingfish Self Reliant

    I have no special types of ammo. I buy what I can afford. I do have some high end .22 BUT Most of my 5.56 or .223 IS either Eagle or PMC I have some Winchester green tips. 30-30 and 30-06 are all Federal Power shock. Have few Winchester . All Winchester shotgun shells.
     
  3. ghrit

    ghrit Bad company Administrator Founding Member

    To take an uniformed guess, the 124 have better performance numbers, and I do NOT know why. To go further with guessing, the 124s probably come close the 357 cal 125s, which I favor for SD outside the house when packing the revolver.
     
  4. VisuTrac

    VisuTrac Ваша мать носит военные ботинки Site Supporter+++


    I went with this one after testing a box. Recoil in Sig P6 was negligible or at least way less than hotter SD rounds. I could dump a mag in short order into a small pie pan at 10 yards.

    so based on my firearm I figured I'd just keep dumping rounds into the same location perps still don't like to leak from new holes.

    performance is generally the same out of the walther pps m2.

    YMMV but for my intended use, it'll work. in winter I'll just aim for the neck head to make up for the lower penetration.
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2018
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  5. Ura-Ki

    Ura-Ki Grudge Monkey

    Intresting observations and good questions!
    Firstly I will point out pistols, speciffically compacts or any thing smaller then a full size. A lot of ammo is only made for "Full Size" combat type/spec pistols, like the Beretta M-9 and the ammo will not likely function well in short barrel pistols, too slow ( to much loss of velocity) and you will likely see a failure to expand properly!
    In 9mm, the most common weight is a 115 and 124 gr. Weight, mainly for recoil and to also gain back speed in the short barrels. The 147 gr. Are usually intended for full size pistols and sub guns, and they are usually near to top of the range speed wise, but not always! Those SIG V-8crown should do well, but I'm curious to see who they do in the shorter barrels.
    I usually carry Hornady Critical defence 124 gr in my Para Warthawg double stack compact, and I carry 147 gr Remington Golden Sabers in my M-9 ( Beretta 92) that are hand loaded to +P++ specs.
    Same bullet in 10mm/.40 180 gr loaded nuke um hot! I find most hollow point ammo works best at max speed. For .45, I run 230 gr. ball, there just isn't much reason to expect such a big and slow bullet to penetrate and then expand, so I go for depth and impact shock energy transfer!
    The Remington Golden Sabers are about the best( and nastiest) hollow point bullets currently available, but almost no one carries them, and when they do, there in the more common flavors and weights, so I have to ether order factory loaded ammo if it's even offered, or I order the bullets and hand roll my own. The Golden Saber also seems to really like being driven to the max speeds the calibers are capable of, but in the case of the .40 S&W loads, still work well at the much slower speeds that chambering generates!
    There is a pretty good sight www.ballisticsbytheinch.com thay shows all the common ammo brands and types, they are awesome, but a little slow in testing new stuff, so be patient!
     
  6. sec_monkey

    sec_monkey SM Security Administrator

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  7. Ura-Ki

    Ura-Ki Grudge Monkey

    One note on Glock pistols, they generally don't like the "Hot" side of ammo, they don't have supported chambers and thay can cause issues up to and including broken extractors and in rare cases, blown slide stops, so be careful! Most other pistols don't suffer quite as dramatic failures when run hot, but again, use your judgement! I have a Glock Gen 1 G-20 full size 10mm, and I cannot run any thing close to hot through it and expect to have reloadable brass after. Even then, the re ally good stuff is reserved only for the fully supported 1911s! Interestingly, both the Browning high Power and the Beretta M-9/92s can take full zoot ammo with zero issues! We havnt tried the really hot stuff in the wifes S&W 2.0 .40, but then again, she don't have a real need to go that hot with ".40 Short and Week"
     
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  8. 3M-TA3

    3M-TA3 Cold Wet Monkey Site Supporter++

    I wouldn't worry too much about felt recoil in a Shield. My shield shoots much softer than my full size 9mm M&P even though it's much lighter. I think it may be due to the smaller size as the barrel is lower in the Shield in relation to the grip, so there is less leverage to raise the barrel as it recoils. The Shield was also designed initially as a .40 S&W, so even the hotter 9mm loads should be fine. I shoot Speer Gold Dots and Remington Golden Sabers in mine for defense. I switch back and forth depending on availability. The bullet designs are very similar and both are carried and trusted by LE.
     
  9. oldman11

    oldman11 Monkey+++

    Just about anything in .41 mag,.45 acp or .44 mag.or .45-70 in my rifle. Anything big and with a big flat point will do. I have smaller guns in 9 mm.. 32 sw,.32 hr ,.38 and .357 for play. Get you something big that will make a hole thru and thru,they bleed out faster that way.
     
  10. Ura-Ki

    Ura-Ki Grudge Monkey

    I like the way you think, hit um with a sledge hammer reather then a toothpick! Lol!
     
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  11. sec_monkey

    sec_monkey SM Security Administrator

    [winkthumb] @Ura-Ki

    now this is a sledgehammer

    [​IMG]



    this knocks em down ever bttr :D :D

    [​IMG]


    if ya wanna knock em down get a 7.62x51 or 12.7x99 or .338 Lapua Mag
     
  12. Ura-Ki

    Ura-Ki Grudge Monkey

    Yup, .30 cal and up, especially .338 Lapua Mag, that does a bang up job on lots of stuff and things! Got a couple of .50s for when things get especially sporty, but only one is the .50 BMG, cause, only need One!
     
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  13. oil pan 4

    oil pan 4 Monkey+++

    Always use ball ammo.
    I was watching murder porn the other day and a wife killed her husband.
    She obviously murdered him in cold blood, no powder burns or gun shot residue on his clothes or body despite shooting him 9 or 10 times.
    The prosecution said she shot him in the back with every shot.
    The defense said she shot him as he was coming at her with a knife.

    Let's say you are forced to shoot some one that attacks you, you shoot them one time they stumble away or fall down and it looks like they are coming back at you and you fire again and in the dance of death you shoot them in the back one time. We'll the prosecutor is going to say you shot them in the back to finish them off as they were running away.
    Wouldn't you rather not go there?

    The only time you can shoot some one in the back and get away with it 98% of the time is if you are a cop.
     
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  14. Bandit99

    Bandit99 Monkey+++ Site Supporter+

    @Ura-Ki "A lot of ammo is only made for "Full Size" combat type/spec pistols...Those SIG V-crown should do well, but I'm curious to see what they do in the shorter barrels."

    As always, you're a wealth of knowledge. I will let you know. I didn't get a lot of it because - well - I'm cheap! I want to be sure the stuff will be reliable before I start purchasing blocks of it. I got 40 rounds, 2 boxes, more for an experiment with the 147gr round than anything else. This and all the posts got me a bit interested and I did a lot of reading today and think I want to test out the 9mm 124gr Federal HST round also...strangely enough, there is a lot of it around here. I think that will do well in the G19 and my smaller G43 but we'll see...due to storage space if I can find one round to standardize with it would be better.

    "One note on Glock pistols, they generally don't like the "Hot" side of ammo..."
    I will then be very leery and proceed cautiously. I normally don't shoot hotter loads, just standard. The Sig V-Crown stuff (both 124gr and 147gr) are standard loads, not sure about the HST. I will have to check them as they might be +P or something...

    @3M-TA3 "I shoot Speer Gold Dots and Remington Golden Sabers in mine for defense."
    I have put the Remington Sabers down on my list, as you and Ura-Ki both seem to favor them so...

    @Kingfish Long time no see! Glad to see you're still around this neck of the woods! :)
     
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  15. AndyinEverson

    AndyinEverson Black Powder Monkey

    I usually keep my Colt Series '70 loaded with 230 grains of Speer Gold Dot for social work..
    I like this loading because it feeds and shoots well from my pistol.
    That said... this time of year with grouse season nearly upon us I also have some 2 3/4 #3 buck shot for one of my 20 gauge shotguns handy.

    Yes its a bird gun and yes it has a "long" 28 inch barrel....but
    One : my favorite modern shotgun is my 870 Wingmaster...its from 1962 and the current 870 barrels will not fit ..so buying a new short barrel isn't in the cards...nor is cutting the original barrel as it is my first gun given to me , by my Granddad.

    Two : its the shotgun I shoot the best with...plus I am used to barrels and guns being much longer....so this 870 feels almost like a "Carbine" when compared to many of my muzzle loaders....

    Three : I have practiced with this gun in my house...so I know how to maneuver it thru my house..is it ideal...no , but it does work.

    I just mention the above not to sound argumentative ...But just because in other forums or discussions I have been "taken to task" or worse for my choice.
    Andy
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2018
  16. Bandit99

    Bandit99 Monkey+++ Site Supporter+

    @oil pan 4 "Always use ball ammo. I was watching murder porn the other day and a wife killed her husband..."

    Errr… I assume you use ball ammo because it will go through (in and out)? You didn't mention your reasoning and "the world wonders." :)
     
  17. Ura-Ki

    Ura-Ki Grudge Monkey

    Never! Those who doubt have no experience, and they just talk to hear them selves and sound important and stuff! Mostly, me thinks they are jelly due to your extensive collection of Cool Guy Stuffs! Lol
    Don't pay them no mind! Those that do know, know you have more experience then most would ever glean in 2 lifetimes!
     
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  18. oil pan 4

    oil pan 4 Monkey+++

    Yeah she shot him in the back 9 or 10 times and prosecution couldn't prove that she shot him in the back even one time.
    Because the bullets all went straight through.
     
  19. Bandit99

    Bandit99 Monkey+++ Site Supporter+

    @AndyinEverson "...because in other forums or discussions I have been "taken to task" or worse for my choice."
    It never fails to annoys me how many so called experts are out there that never really smelt powder on a bad day. True story time... I was in Alaska, logging as a kid, and I was waiting for a bush plane to take me out to one of the camps but had a couple of weeks to kill so I drove cab for this guy. Easy money, free bed and board, one main road, only about 600 people in this village...So, I go out to this place in the boonies to pick up this old lady, she's native Alaskan, 70ish, it's pitch black out and I pull up...and the entire front porch is loaded with Brown bears, mama, papa and even baby bear, big ones! I freak as no way I am going to go knock on her door so I try the horn...of course, it don't work as car is a piece of junk. So, she opens the door and starts banging some pots together. I swear to God! She is staying there banging some pots together as cool as the breeze...and the bears walk away. She closes and locks the door, climbs in the car and I spent the rest of the evening trying to figure out if I was hallucinating or if she was a witch. The moral of this story is one should use what one knows will work when defending their home. You have faith in it, you know it, it's part of you (all that helps the pucker factor also) and you don't have to think to use it.
     
  20. sec_monkey

    sec_monkey SM Security Administrator

    @Bandit99 some prosecutors have used the choice of ammo against defendants

    ball ammo will get ya in a lot less trouble most of the time, because they cannot claim that ya was using ammo prohibited by the Geneva Conventions or other international agreements

    that is one of the arguments anyhow .. YMMV ..
     
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