1. The Topic of the Month for October is "Make this the Perfect Bugout Location". Please join the discussion in the TOTM forum.

Second Amendment SCOTUS Court Findings.... This IS SETTLED Federal Law....

Discussion in 'Bill of Rights' started by BTPost, May 22, 2014.

  1. BTPost

    BTPost Old Fart Snow Monkey Moderator

    Moral and Legal Considerations for Self-Defense Against LEO's

    What do you do when a cop oversteps his authority.
    Some things to consider:

    “Citizens may resist unlawful arrest to the point of taking an arresting officer's life if necessary.” Plummer v. State, 136 Ind. 306. This premise was upheld by the Supreme Court of the United States in the case: John Bad Elk v. U.S., 177 ...U.S. 529. The Court stated: “Where the officer is killed in the course of the disorder which naturally accompanies an attempted arrest that is resisted, the law looks with very different eyes upon the transaction, when the officer had the right to make the arrest, from what it does if the officer had no right. What may be murder in the first case might be nothing more than manslaughter in the other, or the facts might show that no offense had been committed.”

    An arrest made with a defective warrant, or one issued without affidavit, or one that fails to allege a crime is within jurisdiction, and one who is being arrested, may resist arrest and break away. lf the arresting officer is killed by one who is so resisting, the killing will be no more than an involuntary manslaughter.” Housh v. People, 75 111. 491; reaffirmed and quoted in State v. Leach, 7 Conn. 452; State v. Gleason, 32 Kan. 245; Ballard v. State, 43 Ohio 349; State v Rousseau, 241 P. 2d 447; State v. Spaulding, 34 Minn. 3621.

    “When a person, being without fault, is in a place where he has a right to be, is violently assaulted, he may, without retreating, repel by force, and if, in the reasonable exercise of his right of self defense, his assailant is killed, he is justified.” Runyan v. State, 57 Ind. 80; Miller v. State, 74 Ind. 1.

    “These principles apply as well to an officer attempting to make an arrest, who abuses his authority and transcends the bounds thereof by the use of unnecessary force and violence, as they do to a private individual who unlawfully uses such force and violence.” Jones v. State, 26 Tex. App. I; Beaverts v. State, 4 Tex. App. 1 75; Skidmore v. State, 43 Tex. 93, 903.

    “An illegal arrest is an assault and battery. The person so attempted to be restrained of his liberty has the same right to use force in defending himself as he would in repelling any other assault and battery.” (State v. Robinson, 145 ME. 77, 72 ATL. 260).

    “Each person has the right to resist an unlawful arrest. In such a case, the person attempting the arrest stands in the position of a wrongdoer and may be resisted by the use of force, as in self- defense.” (State v. Mobley, 240 N.C. 476, 83 S.E. 2d 100).

    “One may come to the aid of another being unlawfully arrested, just as he may where one is being assaulted, molested, raped or kidnapped. Thus it is not an offense to liberate one from the unlawful custody of an officer, even though he may have submitted to such custody, without resistance.” (Adams v. State, 121 Ga. 16, 48 S.E. 910).

    “Story affirmed the right of self-defense by persons held illegally. In his own writings, he had admitted that ‘a situation could arise in which the checks-and-balances principle ceased to work and the various branches of government concurred in a gross usurpation.’ There would be no usual remedy by changing the law or passing an amendment to the Constitution, should the oppressed party be a minority. Story concluded, ‘If there be any remedy at all ... it is a remedy never provided for by human institutions.’ That was the ‘ultimate right of all human beings in extreme cases to resist oppression, and to apply force against ruinous injustice.’” (From Mutiny on the Amistad by Howard Jones, Oxford University Press, 1987, an account of the reading of the decision in the case by Justice Joseph Story of the Supreme Court.

    Just so you Know.......
    oldawg, Hammerhead, tulianr and 8 others like this.
  2. Tracy

    Tracy Insatiably Curious Moderator Founding Member

    Knowledge is power.
    kellory likes this.
  3. nkawtg

    nkawtg Monkey

    Trouble now days is you may not survive defending your rights.
    john316, tulianr, Mountainman and 4 others like this.
  4. Falcon15

    Falcon15 Falco Peregrinus

    That is quite all right. If I don't survive, my wife will finish the job.
    oldawg likes this.
  5. Yard Dart

    Yard Dart Vigilant Monkey..... Moderator Site Supporter++

    And if the wife will not survive.... my son will live to fight another day....
    Falcon15 likes this.
  6. BTPost

    BTPost Old Fart Snow Monkey Moderator

    The "Idea" is to Make "Them" not survive the "Actions of Depriving YOU, of your Rights" ..... It is the Old Patton saying.....
    "No man ever won a battle, dying for his country, He won the Battle, by making the other Poor Bastard, Die for his Country."
    ...... YMMV.....
    oldawg, Falcon15, kellory and 2 others like this.
  7. Yard Dart

    Yard Dart Vigilant Monkey..... Moderator Site Supporter++

    The bottom line is we teach the next generation the value of our rights as Americans per the constitution.... and what it means to stand up to oppression to defend those values. And within that lesson, we breed tigers!!!
    Falcon15 likes this.
  8. kellory

    kellory An unemployed Jester, is nobody's fool. Banned

    American tigers are behind bars.....:rolleyes:
  9. tacmotusn

    tacmotusn Mosquito Sailor

    Not all of them by a long shot. I also believe the American Tigers outnumber the Military and LEOs who would be stupid enough to go up against the Constitution and them when and if it comes to that. jmho
    I further think that American Tigers stood down the BLM and the other A-holes attempting to skirt the Constitution and rule of law.
    oldawg and Yard Dart like this.
  10. Witch Doctor 01

    Witch Doctor 01 Mojo Maker

    Note:... It may not be murder but it is manslaughter... also case law is limited by states... i.e. Indiana state law may not be a valid defense outside of Indiana.... while this is interesting, I would not want to bet my life on it except in the most extreme situation... Just saying YMMV....
  1. Yard Dart
  2. GOG
  3. Yard Dart
  4. bmtm09
  5. Yard Dart
  6. marlas1too
  7. Salted Weapon
  8. Legion489
  9. Yard Dart
  10. AD1
    Thread by: AD1, May 18, 2016, 10 replies, in forum: Firearms
  11. BTPost
  12. lonewolf88
  13. Yard Dart
  14. Legion489
  15. Legion489
  16. fedorthedog
  17. Legion489
  18. Minuteman
  19. stg58
survivalmonkey SSL seal        survivalmonkey.com warrant canary