Discussion in 'Tin Foil Hat Lounge' started by enloopious, Mar 16, 2018.

  1. enloopious

    enloopious Rocket Surgeon

    So I'm reading this "news story" about Stephen Hawking's final prediction. It kind of goes along with some of the patents that have been filed recently including AI, robots, self driving cars, etc.

    Stephen Hawking’s final Reddit post is going viral over its ominous warning about robots

    I would argue that we already have the technology for every person to be supported without having to work. So the question naturally arises "why are we still working BS jobs every day?"

    Automated Luxury Communism. That's a fun sounding term. This is the idea that even though there is no need to work, some people would be worth less than others and therefor be put to work. Essentially the wealthy would ensure that they enjoy the same amount of power and control over the rest of us as they currently do. Maybe more. This is the war that is going on right now. This is what we need to be focused on because our choice is currently between a world where the robots serve us or a world in which the robots keep us in line for a few wealthy people.

    How many robots are out there that we don't realize? Roomba? Self Checkout? Smart TVs? Self driving cars, planes, boats, trains...

    Google Patent Reveals Vision for Cyborg Eye Implant - Lovesick Cyborg

    US8996429B1 - Methods and systems for robot personality development - Google Patents
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  2. oil pan 4

    oil pan 4 Monkey+++

    Some one still has to fix the robots.
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  3. 3M-TA3

    3M-TA3 Cold Wet Monkey Site Supporter++

    I'd rather work than have the automation do it all for me, especially the thinking part. At some point the the AI driven system will recognize mankind as an impediment to efficiency and then remove it.
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  4. Dont

    Dont Just another old gray Jarhead Monkey Site Supporter+++

    Am I going to need to find another robot to repair my "Cherry 2000"? ;)
    Thought I was well prepared by stocking all those extra chips..
  5. Asia-Off-Grid

    Asia-Off-Grid RIP 11-8-2018

    At some point they will no longer need humans to repair themselves.

    We are fine, unti - err, unless they become self aware.

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  6. Bandit99

    Bandit99 Monkey+++ Site Supporter+

    This idea is overly simplistic. I am not saying it is a bad idea and I am not saying it is an impossible idea but there is a long ways to go. Frankly, and in general terms, with a small world population of say =<1 Billion then yes, I think it is would be highly probable, in fact very doable, but even then there would be a ruling class of sorts, probably, as stated, the providers of the robots.

    The first problem, which is actually two problems, both being physical, is the population of the planet is too large with the resources of the planet being too limited.

    The next problem, that comes to mind, is an inherit problem with mankind itself. We are a violent species with a need to possess power over others via physical or economy force or whatever manner bends them to our will. Now, mix that with the above problem set and we will not have to worry about robots or their rulers.

    The technology leaps will occur, that is certain; however, how much true intelligence when we talk about 'artificial intelligence' will occur will take gigantic leaps. I speak of things like 'creativity', the ability to create something new, not to improve or build from known ideas or plans - real intelligence. I personally do not think these leaps are possible unless an entire new means of processing is developed and even then doubtful, like I said gigantic leaps.

    I would agree with Hawkins:
    1. We need to get off this planet
    2. Whoever rules the robots rule - period.

    Currently, we are a world population of 7.6 Billion. I listened to a recent broadcast that stated by 2023 the world would no longer be producing enough food to feed the population. The immediate and interim solution is quite simple, produce more food, but it does not resolve the underlying main problem: population growth. This problem will not go away and has no solution given mankind's mindset and given the world is divided up in different countries, religions, cultures, etc. The real question is, what will happen when we reach 10 Billion and beyond? Obviously, this is the real question and one which will certainly occur much sooner than the robots that can provide our luxury utopia? Population and how mankind reacts to it - that is the showstopper.
    Last edited: Mar 16, 2018
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  7. enloopious

    enloopious Rocket Surgeon

    If the tech exists why can't we automate our lives so that we don't have to do the crap we don't want to? It can be done fairly easily too. Start naming your tasks that you don't like doing. I don't like vacuuming. There's way better robots out there than the Roomba.
    They WILL become self aware. I don't think this is an IF scenario.
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  8. enloopious

    enloopious Rocket Surgeon

    I am pretty sure population growth will solve itself. Jane Goodall did some fantastic research on this over the last 50 years. What happened with her chimps when the population got too large? The strong killed the weak. Problem solved.

    This is going to be a war and he who owns the robots will rule. This seems pretty self evident. How can you get rid of a ruler/criminal/despot/etc if you don't know they made the bot to begin with? If there is no wifi connection and the thing runs by itself how do you track its origin? What happens when all of the parts are cheap and easy to get as well as the programming and tech? I will tell you one thing, you might as well get started building your army now because if you wait for it to happen it will be too late. The parts ARE cheap and easy to come by. And if you think that the technology would take many many years to come by then you are way behind the 8ball. We are there now. A small team of builders and programmers could put together a kill bot that could wipe out a small town by itself. Instead of school shootings we will be seeing robot attacks in the next 20... maybe 10 years. Just wait.

    Robots in war: the next weapons of mass destruction?
    Why We Must Not Build Automated Weapons of War
    The future of war will be robotic - CNN
    A swarm of armed drones attacked a Russian military base in Syria
    Trained Police Eagles Attack Drones On Command
    The possibilities are limitless.
  9. Bandit99

    Bandit99 Monkey+++ Site Supporter+

    Yes, but that is pretty much a different problem set. It does bring up an interesting topic and makes one wonder how much money DARPA has into a robotic soldier. I cannot imagine they are NOT researching this as it would prove invaluable in certain incidences. I feel certain given the communication portion is already proven via Predator, as is FLIR and numerous other technology, it's doable, probably there's already working prototypes. Some of the robot designs are really interesting of late... No, I think you are correct in the role of robotics in future wars/conflicts. Actually, wasn't there a very prominent Computer Science professor, American, that created a video recently, a very good video, showing the destructive possibilities of drones and how if one loaded them with technology (to include photo recognition and, I think, DNA matching (some how)) and how they were extremely cost effective and a Force Multiplier because no longer did a country need to be able to build an F-35...just very small drones. I will see if I can find the video. I think someone actually had it here...

    Ah, yes! Here it is! This is currently doable as far as I can tell...

    enloopious likes this.
  10. Lancer

    Lancer TANSTAFL! Site Supporter+++

    Or turn them off...
  11. Asia-Off-Grid

    Asia-Off-Grid RIP 11-8-2018

    I am much happier having a maid, than a robot (of any kind) to clean my house, wash clothes, etc. I don't have to worry about the maid ultimately trying to take over the world and dispatch myself and the "Boss".

    Cruisin Sloth likes this.
  12. Bandit99

    Bandit99 Monkey+++ Site Supporter+

    "They WILL become self aware."
    I honestly don't see that happening unless some really huge breakthroughs in processing and etc., just won't happen.
  13. Tully Mars

    Tully Mars Metal weldin' monkey

    One to clean the cat boxes would be rather handy.
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  14. Motomom34

    Motomom34 Monkey+++

    I think Elon Musk has been warning about AI's plus Peter Theil also warned of AI. I was never a Stephen Hawkin's fan. IMO he looked down at people because he was smarter then the masses, or maybe he wasn't
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  15. VisuTrac

    VisuTrac Ваша мать носит военные ботинки Site Supporter+++

    As I figure out how to create graphite and carbon fiber bombs.
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  16. OldDude49

    OldDude49 Just n old guy

    IIRC there were many scientist that did NOT agree with his (Hawking) theories and if ya look around you can find a rather large list of just who they were...
  17. arleigh

    arleigh Goophy monkey

    It is a strange oxymoron ,
    We complain about technology using that very technology.
    Abandoning it puts one at a disadvantage in survival ways.
    Post SHTF those with technology will fare far better than those without .
    Medical practices and equipment,
    food production,
    water acquisition and or reclamation ,
    domestic chores ,
    security ,electronic surveillance,
    entertainment ,Music is one of the oldest forms of entertainment
    The list goes on and on, due to things we take for granted making life better, and deal with problems more efficiently.
    Which would rather , after being shot in the leg ?
    a. Amputate , which is what they did 150 years ago.
    b. Surgically remove the bullet/fragments and sew up the wound ?
    c. do nothing and let nature take it's course .

    Robotics are as simple as a toaster you've used all your life.
    Simple robotics do not require sophisticated electronics , and making things /robots to do survailance or other functions only takes some time and personal study some R&D and investment .
    I build stuff for my self ,mostly lifting equipment ,seeing I'm getting older, and it pays off regularly .
    What happens if I' don't ?
    I risk injury or must hire others to perform these tasks which still may require mechanical assistance .
    Washing clothes takes effort , lots of it if your doing it by hand ,lots of hard repetitive action . having a machine makes a giant difference . Do a few loads of clothes by hand and see just how much effort it requires.
    If you don't have a reliable source for water probably doing laundry is the last thing on your mind ,but clean linens are essential in home health care especially for the sick and injured.
    In the 30s lye soap boiling the clothes was the best method of being sure known illnesses were stopped in that path.
    Laundry soaps are good if you've got them
    Now days things are far more complicated with diseases and such, far more complex to deal with than it was 100 years ago.
    Contaminants the food ,water, and air are more complex ,and having the means to discover these things can make a difference .
    Books and tools are available now . but they won't be post SHTF .
    If your first response is ,"I don't know any thing about" , that's reason in it's self to learn something.
    I invest in things I know almost nothing about and or things I am vaguely familiar with , because I've learned that many things/skills can cross over into other skills no one had, here to for, had taken notice.
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  18. Asia-Off-Grid

    Asia-Off-Grid RIP 11-8-2018

    While I certainly agree with this, technology doesn't stop moving forward. Eventually, we will get to the point where computers no longer are like toasters. One day, those electronic brains will calculate that humans are no longer necessary. It may not happen in our lifetimes. But, I do believe it will happen. That is, if humans aren't stupid enough to destroy ourselves before then.

    I do not consider myself a gamer. During my life with computers, I've always felt a computer should be earning me money, while electricity flowed through its circuits. To just use one for games was a waste of time, energy, and money. But, I have always credited gamers with our advancements in new technology.

    Historically, gamers have been the main reason software companies attempted to develop more lifelike games. In turn, tech companies needed to develop more robust motherboards, faster processors, video cards, RAM, etc., to run those games. But, because of this driving force, this insatiable appetite for cutting edge technology, computers will continue to evolve, ultimately "thinking" for themselves.

    Try to tell that to a woman in Southeast Asia. The vast majority firmly believe washing by hand gets their clothes much cleaner, than by a machine.
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  19. Cruisin Sloth

    Cruisin Sloth Special & Slow

    Everyone NEEDS a Purpose to be !
    Everyone / Everybody -thing .
    My dog has a job & loves it because ,She feels she is part of the pack & contributes ..

    Someone asked me once if I was rich ?? Nope , im not , I work daily for my pack and enjoy .
    Im rich with Folks I know and the help we do together .

    Id say Rich is Friends , Family and a Purpose to be !

    As Paul stated , a Maid would be better here than a AI vacuum machine . The maid might know how to giggle a handle !!!

    As the new studies just came out last week , WIFi 2g and 3G have been reclassified to harmful and NOW schools will need to remove because young body's with small cells are effected . Hence why we have kids cancer !! NO SHITE ..And lack of brain thoughts ..

    So It goes deeper than all AI , Smart tv's to this Alexia thing in your wireless house !!

    Your living in a radiation BOX & expect to be healthy !!

    NOT I

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  20. oil pan 4

    oil pan 4 Monkey+++

    The time when we only really had to worry about terrorists crashing planes into buildings, suicide bombers, mad serial bombers and mass shooters will soon be refereed to as "the good old days".
    Brokor likes this.
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