The 22lr is badass and here is why

Discussion in 'Firearms' started by tacmotusn, Jun 25, 2012.


  1. tacmotusn

    tacmotusn Mosquito Sailor

    Okay, Okay, I am not trying to start an arguement. This is an interesting video that points out many valid points as to why the 22lr is or can be an acceptable man stopper. Keep in mind, that there are many reasons to consider this. Most important for all of us non millionaires is the cheap ammo price. I am not advocating you throw away or sell all your larger weapons. I just think every family unit should have several 22lr weapons (pistols and rifles) and a ton of cheap ammo. Now, please watch the video. thank you.



    PS: LEOs in large cities are probably aware that professional hit men like the 22lr for deadly head shots. Poachers use them for deer, and then the video brings up their use by the Mossad. Are all these groups of people wrong?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 29, 2015
  2. dragonfly

    dragonfly Monkey+++

    22's have been around for a long time and it does certainly have it's usefulness!
    Lightweight, relatively fast, and easily "muffled" report...not to mention the costs!
     
    William Antrum and tacmotusn like this.
  3. VisuTrac

    VisuTrac Ваша мать носит военные ботинки Site Supporter+++

    Before I saw who this was posted by I was thinking OMG GunKid is back! Whew!
     
  4. tacmotusn

    tacmotusn Mosquito Sailor

    22lr has more stopping power and does more damage than .25acp or .32acp
    .
    compare cost of those cartridges to price of 22lr rounds
    .
    starter training platform in rifle or pistol for newbies to firearms
    .
    can easily and effectively surpressed
    .
    weapons themselves much cheaper than centerfire
    .
    I can go on and on as to the positives. I very clearly said it was not meant to replace your big bore cannons, but instead to compliment or backup or supliment ...... etc etc
     
    William Antrum and NVBeav like this.
  5. Yard Dart

    Yard Dart Vigilant Monkey..... Moderator Site Supporter++

    We went out last weekend with a couple of the boys who brought their 22LR AR's and fired off a few hundred rounds thru. I was impressed with the caliber in just rate of fire on target and plain fun just firing it up at targets- on the cheap. I had been a nay-sayer on 22 LR but after that excursion I think for just plain fun, marksmanship training and the cost, I might go pick one up of my own.
     
  6. techsar

    techsar Monkey+++

    Ok...let me know when there are some valid points on his page.

    All he is going to do is get someone killed...and it won't be the perp.

    As far as Massad, poachers and pro hitters...these are highly specialized uses with (typically) suppressed weapons, using various tactics not commonly employed by Joe Average on the street.

    eta: 22s have a place in a well-rounded arsenal, but not as a primary defensive weapon. Just my $0.02
     
  7. Brokor

    Brokor Live Free or Cry Moderator Site Supporter+++ Founding Member

    GARRR!
     
  8. ColtCarbine

    ColtCarbine Monkey+++ Founding Member

    Did you even watch the video?

    Are you willing to prove that a .22lr won't stop you as an aggressor with no body armor?
     
    tacmotusn likes this.
  9. Pyrrhus

    Pyrrhus Monkey++

    I'm unhappy that my post, didn't. Here I go again.

    To borrow from MGen Rupertus' Rifleman's Creed, "My rifle and myself know that what counts in this war is not the rounds we fire, the noise of our burst, or the smoke we make. We know that it is the hits that count. We will hit..."

    Granted, we are talking handguns vice rifles, but the principal is the same. A problem with the study is that it is, in effect, comparing hits and misses. Molotov is saying that it is better to hit with a .22lr than miss with a .45 ACP, and I would agree. However, I don't really think that there would be any comparison between a double tap to the head with a .45 ACP and a double tap to the head with a .22lr. They would likely both result in the recipient achieving room temperature, but the .45 ACP would probably remove all doubt. And make a much bigger mess. Also, I don't think anyone would argue that there are multiple potential items a person could be wearing or carrying (layers of clothes, cell phones, etc.) that could easily defeat a .22 but that would only negligibly impact the effect of a .45. What it all comes down to is training.

    Another problem with the study is that it talks about the Mossad. I can't be certain on this, but I suspect when they talk about the Mossad, they are talking about covert, offensive actions. I don't carry a handgun for offensive, but for defensive purposes. If I were to be on the offensive, I would carry a rifle. There would likely be a big difference in the overall disposition of a person who is attacking me or my family and a person who was walking along, waiting to be shot in the head at close range with a suppressed weapon. The former could well be hopped up on adrenaline or drugs (both of which have been shown to make people harder to put down), whereas the latter would probably go down like he had been poleaxed.

    I don't have a hatred for .22lr, my sons each have a 10/22 so they can learn to shoot on the cheap. But there is no way I'm going to carry a .22 handgun for self-defense. For crying out loud, my wife is 5' and 100 lbs and she does just fine with a .40 S&W. I'd never be able to live it down.
     
  10. sgt peppersass

    sgt peppersass Monkey+

    my post didnt come up either.

    I said I wouldn't want to be on the recieving end of the 22lr, even though its small, it can still add a hole that you werent born with :)
     
  11. tacmotusn

    tacmotusn Mosquito Sailor

     
  12. techsar

    techsar Monkey+++

    @ ColtCarbine: yes I did watch the video. What he fails to even acknowledge is once the perp is hit and doesn't drop, the shootist is likely to panic and start throwing rounds willy-nilly - likely into innocent bystanders. One would think someone with his self-proclaimed credentials would consider this.

    As far as someone shooting at me, yes I would take cover...and then do my darnedest to take the perp out...and it would not be with a .22
     
  13. Silversnake

    Silversnake Silverback

    Proposing the 22LR as a viable choice for personal defense is antithetical to prepping. We don't really prepare for everyday stuff, we prep for bad scenarios. Everyday, casual criminals may be dissuaded by one shot with a 22LR, but what about the "bad scenarios"? What about the guy on bath salts trying to eat your kids face? Or the drunk, or meth head, or crazy, or raging pissed off, or determined not to leave a witness to his crime?

    You say "I can get a follow up shot". Right. Most handgun encounters happen at 10 feet or less. At that range and closing, you are likely to get one shot.

    You say "But the guy in the video says the stats support it!" Right. The stat he doesn't address is the failure to incapacitate with the first shot for the 22LR. Go look it up. Oh, alright...here it is...31%

    You say "But the Mossad uses it!" Whatever. So did an old CSM I worked with who, while assigned to SOG killed and NVA officer with a suppressed high standard through the ear. Still had the guys uniform. If you are as well trained as these types, then go for it. If you are Mossad and using 22LR, then I say "Shalom, out"

    The only practical way 22LR works for self defense is in a PSD EDIT: PDW akin to a FN P90 with a 50 round mag firing a 5 round burst at 1,200 rounds per minute. That's 200 grains of lead with 5 wound channels in 0.25 seconds with little felt recoil and 9 more bursts if needed.
     
    RouteClearance likes this.
  14. Witch Doctor 01

    Witch Doctor 01 Mojo Maker

    That means that 69% of the time it does stop an attacker on the first round... not to shabby... but the important thing is many folks would be more likely to keep a pocket .22 on them and actually have one if needed rather than carry a .45 with all the comparative bulk and weight that entails ... if you don't carry it with you al te time it probably won't be there when you really need it...

    Now knowing that i'm heading into indian country i'll pack heavy... if i'm only carrying a .22 i'd be more aware of my surrouindings because i was "under gunned" and prolly keep myself out of trouble that way...

    your point about the training that Mossad/SOG/etc have is accurate however with a .22 tyou can afford to train regularly something that i can't do as often as i would like with my .357 due to costs

    I do disagree on your statement about the .22 as a personal self defence weapon... as full auto takes more training to use and keep on target... (ifigure you are just being sarcastic...):D

    YMMV
     
  15. Gator 45/70

    Gator 45/70 Monkey+++


    22-velocitor.
     
    Dunerunner likes this.
  16. tacmotusn

    tacmotusn Mosquito Sailor

    My stash of 22lr ammo comes in at multiple 10s of thousands. Post SHTF I will still have 22lr ammo long after 95% of those with bigbore weapons have run out of ammo. I figure in and extremely long term recovery situation, my 22s and blackpowder firearms are going to carry me longer than anything else. Ammo for the others is just too damn expensive for those of us on a tight budget. jus saying
    .
    Do I want to have to rely on a 22 or my black powder weapons? Hell no.
    .
    Do I consider this preparing for the worst and hoping for the best? Within my limitted budget, You betcha'.
     
  17. Brokor

    Brokor Live Free or Cry Moderator Site Supporter+++ Founding Member

    I had a great response typed out, but what you saw earlier (GARR!) is because I posted and all that applied was a blank space. Very frustrating, lol

    Oh well.
     
  18. CATO

    CATO Monkey+++

    Go back one page and copy, then go forward (back to the blank post) and edit, paste, then save.
     
  19. Theocrat

    Theocrat Monkey

  20. Theocrat

    Theocrat Monkey

    GARR! same thing just happened to me, I tried what Guit fishN recommended and it still didn't work.
     
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