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The Backup is Back up

Discussion in 'Firearms' started by E.L., Dec 17, 2007.


  1. E.L.

    E.L. Moderator of Lead Moderator Emeritus Founding Member

    <table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="640"><tbody><tr><td colspan="11">[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, Geneva, Swiss, SunSans-Regular]The Backup is Back up[/FONT]![FONT=Arial, Helvetica, Geneva, Swiss, SunSans-Regular][/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica, Geneva, Swiss, SunSans-Regular]The S&W Model 40[/FONT]</td> </tr> <tr height="30"> <td height="30">
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    [FONT=Arial, Helvetica, Geneva, Swiss, SunSans-Regular]The best results still come with use of the sights, yet backup guns
    may be used in compressed environments and short-range fights.
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    </td> <td colspan="11" height="201" valign="top">[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, Geneva, Swiss, SunSans-Regular]Often I am questioned about the concept of a backup gun. Fundamentally this weapon is put into play when the primary defense tool has failed to do its job from a ballistic point of view or is broke or has run out of ammunition or maybe even because access to the primary weapon is impaired or impossible due to injury or physical contact with a threat.[/FONT] [FONT=Arial, Helvetica, Geneva, Swiss, SunSans-Regular]So could we say it might be a pretty important piece of equipment, like your life may depend on it?

    [/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica, Geneva, Swiss, SunSans-Regular]Best Backup Back
    [/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica, Geneva, Swiss, SunSans-Regular]
    This point is always arguable, but being a proponent of revolvers — for the right person for the correct job — I think the re-introduction of the Smith & Wesson Model 40 is great as S&W has brought the M40 back up online after a 30-something year hiatus. The steel-frame five-shot is probably as close as one is going to get for the near perfect revolving handgun for the purpose of being a backup weapon. New advances in metallurgy now allow the handgun to be made with a +P rating and the quantum leaps in projectile and ammunition technology over the last 10 years puts the handgun in a serious contender mode for its intended purpose. Is it a .44 Magnum? No, and its not a .45 Auto, either.

    Then again, I firmly believe a large percentage of people who have taken instruction from me over the years do not always carry the same gun on the street as they bring to the classes they attend. Call me silly, but a lot of people bring guns so they can shoot well and look like they know what they are doing, and not draw the attention of their peers while attending class. Trust me, performance anxiety is often a big deal to the students, but in all candor it’s in their head, not mine. I know my job, “Teach ya with whatcha brung.” So that said, the point is many people carry smaller guns and since they do they might wind up fighting with it.
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  2. Seacowboys

    Seacowboys Senior Member Founding Member

    I carry a Colt Detective Special in my front pocket or a NA .22 in my shirt pocket. These get brought out and practiced with religiously. I also prcatice with my Colt .25 pocket pistol.
     
  3. E.L.

    E.L. Moderator of Lead Moderator Emeritus Founding Member

    I have the NAA .22 Magnum and of course the Keltec .32 that I love to carry.
     
  4. Jerry68

    Jerry68 Monkey+++

    If I am wearing shoes, I am carring my S&W Model 38 (Bodyguard).
     
  5. Seacowboys

    Seacowboys Senior Member Founding Member

    I've been thinking about getting one of those little Keltecs; how do you like it? I used to carry a Colt Mustang but my wife took it away from me.
     
  6. E.L.

    E.L. Moderator of Lead Moderator Emeritus Founding Member

    I love my P-32. I carry it all of the time. It is very, very light, and has proven to be a lot easier to shoot, and more accurate than I thought it would be. I have yet to have a failure to feed, failure to fire, or a failure to eject. I don't have to worry about strapping on a holster, or a cover garment, I just stick it in my pocket and it is good to go. I think they are an excellent investment. I am seriously considering buying my wife the .380 version.
     
  7. CRC

    CRC Survivor of Tidal Waves | RIP 7-24-2015 Moderator Emeritus Founding Member



    That's what I used when I went for my CCW permit.....

    I just bought a new one recently, and it's what I carry these days....
     
  8. AlterEgo

    AlterEgo Monkey+++

    I have and carry as a bu a Kel-Tec P3AT (.380) every day. The only thing I have done is add a magazine extention to the mag for a better grip.

    Great little weapon.
     
  9. Blackjack

    Blackjack Monkey+++

    Rossi 357 snubby in the front pocket, very convenient, very potent. Almost never leave home without it.
     
  10. wambli

    wambli Monkey+++

    I've got a good old AMT .380 Backup in stainless steel. Makes a good front pocket gun for summer carry or as a backup to my PT145. Both are like that famous credit card, " Don't leave home without it".
     
  11. Mountainman

    Mountainman Großes Mitglied Site Supporter+++

    That's kind of funny, I used to carry a NNA 22 mag before I bought the Keltec 9mm. The only problem I had was the NAA would keyhole about every other shot at 10 yards or more. I know it is a very up close and personal weapon, but still want something good past 7 yards. I have the 1 1/8 inch barrel and maybe should have went with the 1 5/8. Have you had any similar problems with yours?
     
  12. E.L.

    E.L. Moderator of Lead Moderator Emeritus Founding Member

    I carried the NAA until I bought my Keltec also. I don't remember having any problems with accuracy, but then again I don't remember shooting it at a target past about 15 or 20 feet. My biggest problem is that I bought the model with the birdshead grip, and I have to regrip the gun after every shot it seems. It has been a good while since I shot it.

     
  13. ColtCarbine

    ColtCarbine Monkey+++ Founding Member

    It was always my understanding that the Kel-Tec was a POS and to avoid them like the plague, unless you were short on funds and couldn't afford much else. However, I'm seeing this isn't the case and am hearing that there are satisfied Kel-Tec owners here.

    Have there been improvements to these pistols or was I just listening to BS from others? If there used to be issues with Kel-Tecs, then what year of manufacturing did these improvements take place?

    On more than 1 occasion I've turned down buying a Kel-Tec for dirt cheap. Sounds like I'll have to not turn my nose up at one of these little guns in the future. Crud I think I could carry a few of these without anybody noticing just in my Carhatt jacket alone. Forget extra mags. [booze]
     
  14. E.L.

    E.L. Moderator of Lead Moderator Emeritus Founding Member

    I always thought the Keltec's were cheap crap, but the little auto's shoot extremely well. The .32, and .380 are so popular dealers cannot keep them on the shelves. I really like mine, and I have friends that love theirs also. Now keep in mind, I don't mind spending the cash on a carry gun, my Les Baer TRS was about $1800, don't let the price of the Keltec fool you.
     
  15. Mountainman

    Mountainman Großes Mitglied Site Supporter+++

    I have the same grip with the same recoil problem. I shoot right handed and got around it by using a 2 handed grip, using my left thumb to cock the hammer and then putting my left thumb down to the left of the hammer on the grip and strap to hold it down. It seems strange to cock the hammer with your left thumb, but with a little practice it works and can be rapidly fired.
     
  16. Mountainman

    Mountainman Großes Mitglied Site Supporter+++

    They are lower quality and not smoothed out like the higher end pistols, but I would put my life on the line with the one I have, not one problem. I don’t know how the older models functioned since I bought my P-11 new at the end of 06’. The one thing I did do before even firing the pistol is the “fluff and buff” in the Tec Werks link below to smooth it out. I researched the pistol, along with many others, before buying it and the smooth out was highly recommended unless you wanted to do it by shooting a couple hundred rounds through it. If you run into any more dirt cheap ones and don’t want to buy them let me know.
    Tec Werks http://www.ktog.org/tecwerks.htm
    Kel-Tec Owners Group http://www.ktog.org/
     
  17. ColtCarbine

    ColtCarbine Monkey+++ Founding Member

    Coming from you, somebody who knows firearms considerably more than myself, I'm listening. I don't mind spending the cash on a quality firearm myself because with all tools sometimes you get what you pay for. It's good to hear that there is a thrifty option that functions well.
     
  18. ColtCarbine

    ColtCarbine Monkey+++ Founding Member

    I guess I'll have to do some research and check out if it's just the newer models that everybody is satisfied with or what. Shame on me for being a Sig and 1911 snob.

    Thanks for the tip on the fluff and buff to smooth it out. I can't wait to see the look on my buddies face when I bring him a Kel-Tec to work on. [booze]
     
  19. monkeyman

    monkeyman Monkey+++ Moderator Emeritus Founding Member

    The main problems I have heard about from anyone that has owned them is that they arent a shooters gun, as in (from what Ive heard at least) they will tend to malfunction more if they wear out and they tend to start doing so after a few thousand rounds, BUT they have a lifetime warranty and I have heard nothing but good as to their service and honoring it. So basicly if you want one to carry and just put a mag through now and then getting one is great, if you want something to take to the range and run a few hundred rounds through every couple weeks buy 2 (for less than 1 mid to high end handgun) set one back and shoot the other like you stole it then when it wears out switch to the other while the first is being rebuilt free of charge.

    Now the main reason I personaly dont like them has nothing to do with reliability but they arent real comfortable in my hand (big old paws) and I also MUCH prefer single double actions and all of the Kel Tecs I have come across at least are DA only. If your comfortable with DA only and you get a crack at one cheap then I would jump at it at least as a BUG. If you like the DA/SA and want one thats reliable on the cheap then Bersa is REAL hard to beat. Their Thunder .380 is super comfortable, accurate and easy to drop in a pocket with 7+1 capacity and the Thunder (or Firestorm is exact same gun off the exact same line) 9mm Ultra Compact is just a touch thicker and heavier than the .380 but totaly ambedexterous and has a 13+1 capacity and the newer ones come with a spare mag. I just traded a Tauras .45 that didnt work for me for the Bersa Firestorm 9mm UC and it was marked (NIB) at $325. Its the one pictured in the holster I made in the leather working thread.
     
  20. E.L.

    E.L. Moderator of Lead Moderator Emeritus Founding Member

    I would be in a pickle if I had to get off accurate follow up shots with it. I tend to think of it as a arms length shot pistol. Of course the Keltec just serves this purpose so much better. Not only is it more accurate, but I can dump the entire mag pretty quick. What I do like about the mini revolver, is that it is built like a brick outhouse. It is just nice to see that kind of craftsmanship miniaturized. It is also a great conversation piece. Everybody wants to see it, hold it, etc.
     
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