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TOTM - November 2019 World Economic Collapse

Discussion in 'Survival Topic of the Month' started by Dunerunner, Nov 1, 2019.


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  1. Dunerunner

    Dunerunner Brewery Monkey Moderator

    I started thinking, several years ago; what it would take to survive a World wide economic collapse. There would be no food production, no water treatment, no sewage treatment, millions of hungry people, no heat, no or little electricity, no electronic banking, probably few governmental services, and the list goes on encompassing everything we take for granted today.

    I've tried to think of a plan to survive this catastrophe but sadly I do not see this scenario as being easily survivable for anyone but the very well connected politically or the military. It could, in my opinion; spell the end of our representative republic and bring about a dictatorial government supported by the military.

    Total independence from any services or support could mean survival for a family or group if they could defend their resources or were isolated enough that overtaking said resources would be too costly, i.e.; remote Alaska.

    What are the thoughts around surviving the World being pushed back to late 1700's?
     
  2. Ura-Ki

    Ura-Ki Grudge Monkey

    This is a question best answered by a Russian, they have a lot of experience dealing with most of this! Actually, besides the fighting over resourses, the rest should sort its self out pretty well, just going to take time for folks to adapt to the new situation and be able to adapt as things change! I think surviving the first few steps would be the biggest challenge, and once you manage to survive long enough to seporate out of the major fighting, you would have a better chance and making a go at the rest!
     
  3. HK_User

    HK_User A Productive Monkey is a Happy Monkey Site Supporter

    Prep for what you know and then what you don't.
    No one will go untouched and expect a lot of death and destruction.
    Keep it simple and build what you can when you can.
    Forget any techie things in the near term.

    Guns, Ammo, Seeds, Medical supplies will not last long and be ready to bury your old, infirm and the young.

    This will not be pretty.

    Any pubs about SF out post will be a must.
    Waste disposal will be primary in the long term. SF Manuals will point the way in the why and how to. Do stock window screen materiel as it is a must for ventilation and insect control be it latrines or cooking areas as well as sleeping in some sort of comfort.
    Purchase only metal window screen.

    https://www.amazon.com/s?k=special+...648904&tag=googhydr-20&ref=pd_sl_659jesdlkj_b

    Most of these can be found free online,
     
    Last edited: Nov 1, 2019
  4. UncleMorgan

    UncleMorgan I eat vegetables. My friends are not vegetables.

    In the event of a general collapse with no electricity, fuel, food deliveries or or government services, at least 90% of the US population would be dead within a year--if not six months.

    If it happens at the start of a hard winter, make that about three months.

    About 90% of the US population consists of city slickers who have no preps, no survival training (in a Without Rule of Law context) , and no money.

    Most can't even lay their hands on $500.00 in Fraudulent Reserve Notes. They live hand to mouth, paycheck to paycheck, and get ahead by getting deeper in debt.

    Those people won't be able to buy time or additional options.

    Most people (including many preppers) simply cannot wrap their heads around the concept that having nothing means having nothing.

    During Desert Storm, the US went in and bombed the snot out of Baghdad. That included the municipal water supply. The citizens found themselves with zero water on zero notice.

    The ones that had water stored survived. The ones that didn't died--unless they could beg, borrow, buy, or steal water--or go someplace where water could be found.

    Iraq is a desert. New York City is a desert, as in Los Angeles. The major difference is that Iraq is a sand desert, and much of America is a concrete desert.

    Either way, when the water goes, there will be no water. None.

    The average citizen literally cannot imagine that. Many preppers cannot imagine that.

    If people really understood that the water could stop flowing, and they could be dead three days later, they would save every bottle and jar they could get their hands on (of any size ,shape, or description), wash them clean, fill them with water, and cork 'em up tight.

    I'm talking every beer bottle, soda bottle, catsup bottle, pickle jar, and milk jug. They'd have a "water pile" like an old-fashioned farmstead wood pile: cords of bottled water. And every bottle would have to be hidden somewhere.

    But they don't understand, so they don't act.

    And that's just water. Expand that need to food, as well, and you have a situation where it's simply much easier for most people to die.

    Of inaction.

    And die they will. In their millions.

    So we have become almost completely dependent on our artificial environment, and if that environment changes drastically, most of us will be SOL.

    What you prep for, and where, and for how long, is mostly a matter of how much reality you can comprehend--before you have to comprehend it all.
     
  5. DKR

    DKR Interesting ideas, interesting stories

    Consider this

    While the 'economy' may fall apart, the farms still exist, as do the factories and power plants etc.

    The US went thru this ( a deflationary collapse) in the 30's and came out of it whole. Mostly because the Government (at nearly all levels) stayed intact.

    A more current example of a monetary collapse would be Venezuela, yet (or still), the well off are doing just fine. The poor will always suffer the most - and be the first to light the fires. If you have nothing else to lose...
    Chili is now deep in the mire of unrest, again, due to a wide number of factors, not strictly all 'economic'.
    Much of Africa has been a basket case for decades...yet folks live on.
    .
     
  6. HK_User

    HK_User A Productive Monkey is a Happy Monkey Site Supporter

    Fuel and people is what it takes to keep the wheels moving.
    No Water, No Fuel, No Farm, No Nothing.
     
  7. duane

    duane Monkey+++

    At 81, I think in one sense your fears are justified, but in my lifetime, I have seen what you fear happen hundreds of times on an individual basis. I have seen very wealthy men, with businesses that were worth millions of dollars end up living in total poverty. One individual with an electronic company with 200 employees got caught up in the failure of the electronics industry in New Hampshire. His business went broke, the creditors took his house, cars, business, savings accounts and the bankruptcy took all of his assets and claimed anything he had in savings as "hidden assets" and took them also. The IRS took his 401K and pension money as they said it was a scam to escape his creditors and the IRS fines. He ended up with a heart attack, broke, living with his daughter, and unable to qualify for disability income as he was still able to "work" at a desk job. Worked with an individual that had owned 2 auto parts stores, a warehouse, and his own home, as well as a half dozen cars and vans. The bank he had his business loans with failed in the savings and loans crisis, the bank that got the failed banks assets "called" his loans, pay up all the owed money now, and of course the banking system was frozen at that time and he couldn't get a loan. He lost everything, GE Capital bought it up for about 10 cents on the dollar, and he never was late on a payment and had a couple months capital in the bank when the bank forced him into court. After the bankruptcy judge was thru with him, he was living with friends, and working on a machine as a machinist next to me in a factory.

    Medical expenses, divorce, illness, losing court cases with major judgements, failure of the local economy and loss of your job and income as well as health benefits, ability to sell your house and the rapid decrease in its cash sale value will force you to use your savings and any money you have put away for retirement and leave you broke. That doesn't even touch on addiction you or your family, lawyers fees in a criminal case, guilty or not, and so on. Having physical assets in the modern day cache of a trust or in some other way to isolate your ownership from the asset, having your bills paid etc, will help. But be aware that there is a whole section of our society that makes a very good living by taking other peoples money, they don't call it theft or fraud, they use the legal system to do it. I spend several times as much each year on lawyer bane as I will ever spend on survival items. Expenses for insurance, taxes, fees and such, are about half of my total income, but if I don't pay the Danegeld, they will figure a way to take everything I have and it will all be very legal.
     
  8. DKR

    DKR Interesting ideas, interesting stories

    re:
    water
    61°14'13.85" N 149°46'35.91" W (Google earth)

    upload_2019-11-1_10-3-2.

    Ship Creek, downstream from the intake point for the base water system. Runs all year round. About a 1 mile walk from the front door.

    I worry more about the cold weather than water....
     
  9. If fuel remains available I don't think we will run out of water here in the bight. Hopefully water co. employees will have enough sense to keep the pumps running, even if in manual. Chemicals, that's a different problem. Food? Heat?
     
  10. BenP

    BenP Monkey+ Site Supporter+

  11. DKR

    DKR Interesting ideas, interesting stories

    Thank you.

    I was in the former Soviet in 1994, part of a team of Alaskan's sent to help deal with the massive oil spill in the Komi Republic, CIS.

    I wrote a long article about the operations there
    Oil Spill in the Komi Republic - Disaster Recovery Journal

    The oil spills continue to this day
    The town that reveals how Russia spills two Deepwater Horizons of oil each year


    A link to a piece with photos of the region
    Oil pipeline and facilities, Usinsk region, Komi, Russia, 1998 | GRID-Arendal
     
  12. HK_User

    HK_User A Productive Monkey is a Happy Monkey Site Supporter

    We continue to support the Russian Regime no matter who the face man is.

    Some think the Cold War is over, I suggest it was all a ploy for more food for Russia and yet another way to enslave their people.
     
    Gator 45/70 and BenP like this.
  13. I agree with URA-KI, the former UsSR or the Balkans are good examples to go by. Even if all the oil ran out in a couple years, every country on the planet would figure out a way to keep the world spinning so to speak. Even if we have to go back to the Nina - Pinta and Santa Maria size boats trade would resume. You just need to figure out how survive the interim. Water purification, the growing of food & preservation of meat(think smoking and canning, or livestock) P.S a racoon tastes like pork ( LOL )
     
    Gator 45/70, chelloveck and BenP like this.
  14. techsar

    techsar Monkey+++

    To address these specific issues:
    Live in a locale where food can be grown year round
    Have water that doesn't require treatment
    Have a good septic system
    Be somewhat isolated from the millions of hungry
    Not require much heat...but have a renewable-source heat (such as wood) and the means to procure it
    Produce your own electricity
    Not need electronic banking or government "services"
    Start bartering with others in your neighborhood for goods and labor

    It isn't that difficult once you get out from under the repressive yoke of debt.
     
    Gator 45/70, 3cyl, chelloveck and 3 others like this.
  15. Merkun

    Merkun furious dreamer

    And if your BOL is located in a salubrious climate. Not so sure all of the prerequisites cited above co-exist on the planet.
     
    Gator 45/70 likes this.
  16. techsar

    techsar Monkey+++

    The biggest single issue is distance from the starving masses...the rest describe my current location.
     
    Gator 45/70, chelloveck and Yard Dart like this.
  17. DKR

    DKR Interesting ideas, interesting stories

    Gator 45/70 and chelloveck like this.
  18. DKR

    DKR Interesting ideas, interesting stories

    Detroit again
    [​IMG]
    some land reclamation is in progress

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
    in many cases, nature is doing the reclamation.
     
    Gator 45/70, Motomom34 and chelloveck like this.
  19. DKR

    DKR Interesting ideas, interesting stories

    Gator 45/70 and chelloveck like this.
  20. apache235

    apache235 Monkey++

    Once you get all the people out, Detroit will probably be a nice place to live.
     
    john316, 3cyl and Gator 45/70 like this.
  1. Dunerunner
  2. Sojourn
  3. Coyote Ridge
  4. DKR
  5. Dunerunner
  6. Coyote Ridge
  7. Dunerunner
  8. Dunerunner
  9. Dunerunner
  10. Motomom34
  11. Motomom34
  12. Motomom34
  13. Yard Dart
  14. Dunerunner
  15. Motomom34
  16. Dunerunner
  17. Dunerunner
  18. Motomom34
  19. Dunerunner
  20. Dunerunner
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