US Ambassador to Libya Killed in Consulate Attack by peace loving Muslims

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by tacmotusn, Sep 12, 2012.


  1. tacmotusn

    tacmotusn Mosquito Sailor

    Another excellent mess, in a peace loving Arab Spring country. Obama's chosen brothers. Read on down Americans, the response by our head of state shows where his loyalities lay. My words will be show in Red where I can't stop myself from speaking my mind. As still allowed by the Constitution ......... or at least I think so. Tacmotusn.
    .
    http://gma.yahoo.com/u-s--ambassador-to-libya-christopher-stevens-killed-in-consulate-attack-in-benghazi.html
    .
    The U.S. ambassador to Libya died as Libya militants stormed the U.S. consulate in Benghazi.
    .
    The death of Christopher Stevens, 52, on Tuesday came as two American State Department employees were also killed in Benghazi as an 20 gun-wielding attackers stormed the U.S. consulate, angry about an American made film that depicts Prophet Mohammad as a fraud and womanizer.
    .
    Who gives a rats butt why these Murderers were angry. This make me angry as well. Very very angry. Do I have the right to go on a Christian Crusade and kill as many Muslims as I can until my anger calms?
    .
    Stevens, who was a career member of the Senior Foreign Service and served two tours of duty in Libya, was nominated by President Obama to be ambassador to Libya early this year. His term of appointment as ambassador to Libya began on May 22.
    .
    Anger over the film that some believe insults the Prophet Muhammad also provoked protests in Cairo Tuesday, where demonstrators climbed the walls of the U.S. embassy, took down the American flag and replaced it with a black flag.
    .
    A senior U.S. senior official told ABC News they are on alert throughout the region and fear there could be more attacks to come. One of the American State Department employees likely died of smoke inhalation Tuesday from the fire at the consulate, according to the U.S official.
    .
    The death of the second employee was confirmed Wednesday, according to the U.S. official. There is no word yet on how that employee died.
    .
    There were about 20 attackers with small arms who stormed the consulate. There was a firefight with Libyan security officers guarding the consulate, according to the U.S. official. One of the buildings was completely destroyed by fire set by the militants.
    .
    The group that attacked the consulate is called Ansar al Sharia, according to Libyan sources. The group has claimed responsibility for the attack, but did not mention the movie as motivation. The group is close to al Qaeda ideology and exists in east Libya.
    .
    "I condemn in the strongest terms the attack on our mission in Benghazi today," Secretary of State Hillary Clinton said in a statement released Tuesday night. "As we work to secure our personnel and facilities, we have confirmed that one of our State Department officers was killed. We are heartbroken by this terrible loss. Our thoughts and prayers are with his family and those who have suffered in this attack."
    .
    Screw the diplomatic platitudes. I want blood for blood. Why should the Arabs have all the fun. No feet on the ground. No follow up rebuilding of damages, or nation building, or policing. We have a target. See the bold black above. I want some smoking black holes in the sand and collapsed ruins of where these cretins once lived. No apologies or aid to follow, just the message, DON'T SCREW WITH THE USA.
    .
    Libyan President Mohammed Yussef Magariaf promised to coordinate additional support to protect Americans in the country, condemned the assault on the embassy and pledged his government's full cooperation, Clinton said.
    .
    and then, ..... In another friendly US ally country Egypt. Oh, also an Arab Spring country our great leader had such hope for.
    .
    In Cairo, dozens of protesters scaled the embassy walls and took down the flag from a pole in the courtyard. After trying unsuccessfully to burn it, they ripped it apart and replaced it with a black flag bearing Arabic writing. Reports that the black flag was from al Qaeda were not confirmed.
    .
    Victoria Nuland, a State Department spokeswoman, said today the United States was working with Egyptian security to restore order.
    .
    "This came up pretty quickly," she said. "[It was a] relatively modest group of people and the Egyptian security was caught off guard."
    David Linfield, an embassy spokesman, said that no guns were involved.
    "No one fired," he said.
    According to The Atlantic, the Wall Street Journal and Egyptian media, the movie is called "Mohammed, Prophet of the Muslims" and has been promoted by Terry Jones, the controversial Florida preacher whose Koran burning in March 2010 led to the deadly violence in Afghanistan.
    .
    Terry Jones is a moron, but again, this does not give every insulted muslim the right to slay anyone they see as infidels and unbelievers. Oh, I forgot, their Holy Religious Text, the Holy Koran gives them that right. Religion of peace my ass!
    .
    Jones said Tuesday in a statement that the film was actually titled "Innocence of Muslims" and was intended not to attack Muslims but to show the "destructive ideology of Islam."
    .
    "The movie further reveals in a satirical fashion the life of Muhammad," he said.
    .
    Egyptian media also reported that two Egyptians from the Christian minority Coptic group had helped with the movie. Clips in Arabic and English have been released on YouTube.
    .
    In a statement Tuesday, the U.S. embassy said it condemned "the continuing efforts by misguided individuals to hurt the religious feelings of Muslims."
    .
    &%$^&(&% WHAT THE F**K? ...... an apology? are you freakin kidding me?
    .
    Mitt Romney, the Republican presidential candidate, jumped on the embassy's statement with one of his own. "I'm outraged by the attacks on American diplomatic missions in Libya and Egypt and by the death of an American consulate worker in Benghazi," he said. "It's disgraceful that the Obama administration's first response was not to condemn attacks on our diplomatic missions, but to sympathize with those who waged the attacks."
    .
    Thank you Mitt.
    .
    Clinton said anger over a movie is no excuse for violence.
    .
    Very understated Hilary.
    .
    "Some have sought to justify this vicious behavior as a response to inflammatory material posted on the Internet," she said.
    .
    "The United States deplores any intentional effort to denigrate the religious beliefs of others.
    .
    Unless of course you are a Christian, and then you are the root of all evil, that's why everyone hates us, and no one wants to live in the USA.
    .
    Our commitment to religious tolerance goes back to the very beginning of our nation.
    .
    yadda, yadda, yadda yadda ......
    .
    But let me be clear: There is never any justification for violent acts of this kind."
    .
    Too little and totally understated Hilary!
     
    hank2222 and Alpha Dog like this.
  2. CATO

    CATO Monkey+++

    It is odd that they are blaming this on a movie (without substantive proof) rather than making a connection to the day - 9/11. Were the mobs in Libya and Cairo angry about the movie...or just Cairo (rhetorical)?

    I too find an apology quite ridiculous. It reminds me of domestic battery cases where the wife "does something" to force the man into beating her for it, then she apologizes for her behavior. It just makes no sense.

    See more here:

    http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Peace/2012/09/11/Hillary-Contradicts-Obama-on-Egypt-Apology
    http://twitchy.com/2012/09/11/unrea...sy-tweets-apologies-for-hurt-muslim-feelings/
     
    hank2222 likes this.
  3. CATO

    CATO Monkey+++

    These guys (radical muzzies) clearly DO NOT understand freedom of speech. I think most Americans would care less if there were satirical movies about the Pope, Lincoln, or anyone else. However, these a$$holes are willing to kill for such "insults" and THAT should not be tolerated by our govt. (nod to sec state clinton). When did it get to the point where murder, the result of international "insults" were to be accepted by this govt., yet, the Kenyan continues to insult Israel on a continuing basis.

    http://reason.com/blog/2012/09/12/how-would-americans-feel-if-films-insult

    If you have a Facebook account, check out this news site:
    https://www.facebook.com/AKNN.Media

    ...and further, read some of the translated comments. That is a completely different world where a lot of people want you dead just because. There is no way to ever negotiate/bring peace with ideology like that.
     
    hank2222 likes this.
  4. tulianr

    tulianr Don Quixote de la Monkey

    I agree. I'd like to see those responsible strung up. You can take diplomatic niceties too far. Sometimes you gotta go Dirty Harry on them if you want to maintain any sort of respect.

    What you don't want to do though is to play into the radicals' hands by blaming the religion for the actions of these nutcases, anymore than we blame Christianity for our own nutcases, like Terry Jones. I can go out and commit violent acts in the name of "middle aged white men everywhere" but it doesn't mean that all middle aged white men need to share the blame for my actions; nor must they, each and every one, make a public appearance to apologize for my actions. Terry Jones may blame his lunacy, and his ridiculous mutton chop whiskers, on Christianity; but it don't make it so.

    Personal responsibility used to be more important in this country. Now, Americans want to blame their parents, their church, their psychiatrist, their job, and the fact that they didn't get a bicycle for their sixth birthday, for their kids being ugly. Sometimes the buck has to stop at the tree from which the acorn fell.

    People are responsible for their actions, not their religion, or their parents, or their hometown, or their economic situation. The people who committed these outrages should pay - eye for an eye. They need to get a five o'clock wake up call from some of our best door kickers. We need to focus on these people though, and not play their game by engaging in ideological hatred.
     
  5. CATO

    CATO Monkey+++

    On one hand I agree with you. But, that's just going to add fuel to the fire.

    On the other, I think we should just exit that area completely...completely: no aid, no imported food, nothing. Would that cause oil issues with the Saudis? Perhaps...but, they have to import their food too.
     
  6. tulianr

    tulianr Don Quixote de la Monkey

    I don't know. You can get your butt kicked, or get killed, on any Saturday night by walking into a bar and talking about somebody's momma. It doesn't matter if you ever met the lady in question or not, most Americans are still capable of delivering violence to someone because of a perceived insult to their honor. Walk into a bar frequented by military members, spit on an American flag and throw it to the floor, and see if you walk back out the door under your own power.

    We don't get the outrage felt by most Muslims when the prophet Muhammad is insulted, but we're not part of that culture.

    Other cultures don't get our attachment to our flag. I participated in a joint flag detail with a group of British soldiers many years ago. At the rehearsal for the event, the Brits pulled down their flag and tossed it on the ground, under some bushes, in preparation to raise the ceremonial flag. There was almost an international incident when the other American military members and I harshly upbraided them for disrespecting their own flag. Their puzzled response was, "Calm down mate, it's just a piece of cloth."

    We don't necessarily have to understand the reaction of other cultures to to certain perceived insults, but we should try to be aware of those flash points, and be sensitive toward them. We don't have to understand the reaction of the bull to our dashing across his pasture wearing red bloomers, but we need to have our running shoes on, just the same.
     
    BTPost likes this.
  7. tulianr

    tulianr Don Quixote de la Monkey

    I agree that there probably are areas that we need to clear out of, but I'm not sure that it would be in our best interest to do so now, in Libya. We need to give the country a chance to stabilize, and to get their house in order. Changes in government are messy. When the dust clears, and the will of the Libyan people is expressed, and that will is to give us the finger; we should pack up, lock stock and barrel, and take our happy selves back to our own shores. I'm just not sure that the actions of a few crazies represents the general will of the Libyan people.
     
  8. ghrit

    ghrit Ambulatory anachronism Administrator Founding Member

    Nor am I sure the general population does not support the crazies. I say give them a couple weeks to find and handle the problems (and use the same time to find and target them.) If they don't deal with it in a timely fashion, we should, then leave the tribes to their own devices. It might be interesting (if not out and out amusing) to see the tribes carve Libya into small fiefdoms and dilute whatever strength they had on a global level. Whatever else he was, gaddi kept them all rowing the boat in the same direction.

    Where's Teddy R's resolve?
     
    tulianr and tacmotusn like this.
  9. Clyde

    Clyde Jet Set Tourer Administrator Founding Member

    When did we stop defending our consulates? I thought they were considered sovereign land and defended by the marines? There should be a bunch of dead invaders as far as I am concerned.
     
  10. CATO

    CATO Monkey+++

    I think there's a difference though: getting you @$$ kicked is a good lesson to learn to not do a behavior again** (or, be able to defend that behavior).

    So, spitting on the flag in a military is most likely to get you a trip to the dentis; but, if those same guys see some muzzies burning our flag on their soil on TV, they're not going to go find a local muzzie to be-head for the insult.

    These guys don't make the distinction between what one American does in regard to the whole. If one does it, we're all guilty. What they DON'T get is that most Americans could care less about Islam and would be OK never hearing about it again. So, when one person slights Islam in some *perceived* way, we're all held accountable AND apologies won't suffice with them. The only thing that makes them happy is violence against ANY American.

    ** As an aside, a buddy of mine (Marine) said the best way to get into a fight in San Diego was to go up to a squid and ask to buy an ice cream. NO!!
     
  11. CATO

    CATO Monkey+++

  12. Clyde

    Clyde Jet Set Tourer Administrator Founding Member

    I didn't read that they defended when you read the whole thing, it looks more like the retreated and evacuated (1 person of unknown nationality dead)......1 american dead and 1 injured in the hand......there should be multiple dead Eqyptians and Libyans flat, dead, and lifeless. If the marines can take Fallujah, then they surely can repel a mob with their arsenal.

    I read somewhere that the fact this seemed coordinated could point to an Iranian connection as some of the pictures seem quite posed and it was 9/11. This would not be surprising to me.
     
  13. CATO

    CATO Monkey+++

    OK...I misunderstood your initial post then. I thought you were stating "I thought Marines defended these places...why weren't they there slinging lead?" I was just stating that the Marines were there.

    In any event, I agree with you: 3 Marines should be able to create a lot of carnage. I'm guessing their rules of engagement forced them to retreat instead of taking care of business.
     
  14. ghrit

    ghrit Ambulatory anachronism Administrator Founding Member

    Also aside - Yep, that would work.
     
  15. DKR

    DKR Interesting ideas, interesting stories

    A FAST team was launched out of Rota Spain to beef up the now trashed Embassy in Libya. Too little, too late.

    On the other hand, if a fire-fight left 20, 60 or 1000 dead hadjis outside the gate, what would be the fallout? One is reminded of the outcome of the battle at the fort in Beau Geste.
     
  16. tulianr

    tulianr Don Quixote de la Monkey

    If the Marines stationed at embassies were under Marine Command, they could and would defend their posts; but they are under State Department Command. When I looked into embassy duty as a SNCO, the embassy duty "recruiter" told me that they had a sixty percent attrition rate in SNCOs, and that most of the attrition occurred once they were posted to the embassy. They either ran afoul of the State Department, by refusing to compromise their Marine instilled ideas about how to get things done; or they ran afoul of the Marine Corps when they allowed someone in the State Department to compromise their integrity. It was a no win situation; serving two masters. One tells you to defend your post, and the other tells you not to hurt anyone. After an hour long discussion with the recruiter, I decided that it was easier to serve the two masters I was already serving.
     
  17. tacmotusn

    tacmotusn Mosquito Sailor

    From the latest news I had heard on TV or Radio, no Marines were involved or present at the consulate in Benghazi Libya (it was not the Embassy in Tripoli). The security forces at Benghazi were Libyan. In Cairo, Egypt it was an Embassy, and Marines were involved.
    .
    and yes I read the Marine times link. It says;
    "“There are fierce clashes between the Libyan army and an armed militia outside the U.S. consulate,” Abdel-Monen Al-Hurr, spokesman for Libya’s Supreme Security Committee, told Reuters. “The American security guards inside the building fired at the militia as they were trying to enter and attack it.”
    .
    Maybe they were Marines, maybe private contractors. It does not say.
     
  18. CATO

    CATO Monkey+++

  19. Quigley_Sharps

    Quigley_Sharps The Badministrator Administrator Founding Member

    The drums of War are beating...
    They now have a reason to evacuate all of the Embassy's in the Middle East without giving away its really about the attack coming to Iran.
     
  20. Clyde

    Clyde Jet Set Tourer Administrator Founding Member

    All I can say is we had enough experience with embassy issues in 1979 with Iran. If I were one of these marines at other bases in the Middle East, it would be time to pow-wow with the other guys and determine how we are not going to let this happen on our watch......screw the state department.
     
survivalmonkey SSL seal        survivalmonkey.com warrant canary
17282WuJHksJ9798f34razfKbPATqTq9E7