Discussion in 'Off Grid Living' started by oil pan 4, Aug 13, 2017.

  1. oil pan 4

    oil pan 4 Monkey+++

    Looks like this is what I have to work with.


    I believe it's a 3 phase 10 to 15 horse 460v only hollow drive shaft with submerged pump. It doesn't have a pecker head to rewire the phases for high or lower voltage.
    Has anyone worked with pumps like this?
    I work with a lot of 3 phase 480v horizontal direct driven centrifugal pumps, but nothing like this.
  2. Tempstar

    Tempstar Old and crochety Site Supporter+

    Wow! Thought I had seen most pumps. What are you doing with it?
    sec_monkey likes this.
  3. HK_User

    HK_User A Productive Monkey is a Happy Monkey

    Start with a megger check and figure on replacing the bearings before you turn on the power.
    Witch Doctor 01 and Tully Mars like this.
  4. techsar

    techsar Monkey+++

    Is the shaft locked up?
    sec_monkey likes this.
  5. oil pan 4

    oil pan 4 Monkey+++

    It spins freely, almost too freely.
    All I know is I want to get water out of the ground.
    I am going to see what the local well shops.
    I was looking at the picture again toady and overlooked something.
    I think that might be a 6 pole motor.
    There is no name plate.
    Basically if it is 460v only then I can't use it. I'm going to have to find something that can be rewired for 230-240v.

    I'm going to go to one of the local pump stores probably monday and show them what I have and see what they say.
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2017
    sec_monkey likes this.
  6. techsar

    techsar Monkey+++

    The company's documentation states that most of the motors are dual voltage capable...but don't expound on that... :(
    sec_monkey likes this.
  7. oil pan 4

    oil pan 4 Monkey+++

    Yeah shopping around for vertical pump motors I found afew that appeared to be 460-480 only.
    Don't think I saw any 6 pole ones.
  8. Altoidfishfins

    Altoidfishfins Monkey+++ Site Supporter+

    Ought to see what you can get for it at an antique shop.
  9. arleigh

    arleigh Goophy monkey

    Need to find a good motor rewinding shop that can built it to fit your specifications IF you want to stay with it .
    I would take the whole thing out and look over the pump, impeller, chamber, and casing to see what other failures exist before investing any thing significant.
    If this is the configuration you intend on using , figure on building a frame over head for pulling the motor and pump from time to time. An A frame with an I beam and trolley and hoist so that you can load right from your truck to the well with out extra handling.
    I'd figure on building a shed for the electrical panel and make it a work shop for other jobs as well . if the pump must be removed by crane, make the roof removable.
    Believe me , if you've got to work on that in the winter you'll appreciate having a roof over it.
    I've worked on pumps like this only 600 HP . way too much fun.
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2017
    Gator 45/70 likes this.
  10. oil pan 4

    oil pan 4 Monkey+++

    I took the pictures to the pump shop and they didn't even know what it was besides an old vertical shafted pump.
    They said wells where that pump is are down around 200' and gave me the phone number of the company who likely have worked on it.

    Probably going to call the well service company that may have installed or worked on it. Have them pull it and see what my options are.

    Anyone who says living off grid doesn't cost anything is a pathological liar or just has no idea what they are talking about.
    Gator 45/70 likes this.
  11. ghrit

    ghrit Bad company Administrator Founding Member

    It is possible that the original well installer pulled permits that the county may have on record. If they do, it is possible that the pump data was retained.
    Witch Doctor 01 and Gator 45/70 like this.
  12. Ganado

    Ganado Monkey+++

    a good thought @ghrit but he lives in NM they barely track the wells much less the equipment =)

    @oil pan 4 i hope you keep us posted I would be interested in what kind of pump that is as well

    are you intent on using this pump and motor? sometimes if the well isnt too deep its just cheaper to go submersible
    Cruisin Sloth likes this.
  13. oil pan 4

    oil pan 4 Monkey+++

    I believe it's a multi turbine pump driven by a hollow shaft turned by the motor in the picture.
    The motor may be 460v only, and appears to be a 10hp to 15hp 1200rpm 6 pole.
    Pulling the whole thing our and dropping submersible units down there is an option.
    I'm not stuck on using this setup. It would be kind of cool if I could bring water to the surface at a rate of 10hp with less startup surge than a 1hp submersible pump.
    At this point I think I could need a motor that can be wired for 240v ($1,700) and for sure going to need a 3 phase variable frequency drive (1,500+).
    Gator 45/70 likes this.
  14. techsar

    techsar Monkey+++

    OP4, don't forget the drive bearings, too. Oil lubed or water lubed, either way they probably need attention and that is going to be a large expense.
  15. oil pan 4

    oil pan 4 Monkey+++

    Pulling out the irrigation gear and dropping in a submersible grundfos is an option.

    I had my wife look up the water bill. She says we use on average 2,244 gallons per month.

    That's about 27,000 gallon per year. Rain water collection could net around 20,000 gallons per year.
    Ganado and Gator 45/70 like this.
  16. ghrit

    ghrit Bad company Administrator Founding Member

    If my calculator isn't lying, you are approximately 40 gallons a day each. That's fair, but you can probably conserve some if you look closely. If things go egg shaped, you may have to.
    Gator 45/70 likes this.
  17. oil pan 4

    oil pan 4 Monkey+++

    That seems like a lot I think. I bet it's mostly her.
    We have a front loader washer and new dish washer. Dish washer runs once a week or so and the washer 2 or 3 times a week. The toilet I just put in is a low water use one.
    Gator 45/70 likes this.
  18. Witch Doctor 01

    Witch Doctor 01 Mojo Maker

    If you are going to spend the money...

    Check out these guys... I have a friend who swears by them (money doesn't seem to be an issue with him.... but his well is around 150')

    Advanced Power Inc | Leading manufacturer of solar water pumps

    Hoss pump....

    Prices start at $3950.00. Contact us for project-specific pricing.

    This deep well, high flow pump is made of quality, robust stainless steel construction for durability and a long life. This pump has serviceable parts. Peak power is obtained on DC voltage at 130v. This helical pump is compatible with the N1000H and K1000H systems or can go up to 4000 watts of power!!

    • Pumps 11-80 GPM with zero lift.

    • Includes a 2-year warranty, with extension available for purchase.

    • Starting at 3/4 - 5 Horse Power, appropriately sized for well conditions.

    • Up to 850 ft (368 PSI) lift

    • UL listed solar panel with extremely durable certified engineer stamped aluminum mounts.

    • High volt On/Off power switch
    • Maximum operating temperature in water: 122°F
    • 100’ of 10 gauge pump wire
    • 3PH AC Pumps
    • Minimum 5” well casing.
    • 4 1/2" OD pole for mounting.
    We have custom systems that can reach up to 850 gallons per minute. Please visit our custom page to contact us.

    Related Documents
  19. duane

    duane Monkey+++

    Used to live in Las Cruces and if Clovis is similar, the he** with the pump, if you have a well that pumped water at the rate that pump is capable of, have the water rights to use it, and it still has usable water at a reasonable pumping rate, you have pure gold. Even 40 years ago there were thousands of acres of cheap land available around Las Cruces that either had no water rights or the sub surface water was salty. There were small areas east of El Paso that were for most purposes abandoned when the water table either dropped to low due to over pumping or where over pumping lead to salt contamination.

    I have no idea what is going on in the area within 100 mile radius of El Paso today, but 45 years ago buying land was apt to turn into a snake pit and the buyer had better be very aware of problems. Just because you can see the Rio Grande or some other river or you can drill a well and hit water doesn't mean a thing. The land must have water rights, most of it will not have mineral rights, they can if they wish frack 100 feet from your house or build a road to a well through your land. Rights were sold many years ago. There may be no zoning restrictions, but then one of your neighbors spreads 3 trainloads of New York City sewage sludge a week on his land for fertilizer, may have stopped now, or they plan to build a low level radiation storage area, that may have failed also. It is not the beautiful retirement area the ads show you.
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2017
    Ganado and Dunerunner like this.
  20. oil pan 4

    oil pan 4 Monkey+++

    Talking to some people in the area are saying older wells like that one were not drilled deep enough. No 200' isn't enough any more. Back in the day that was plenty deep.
    They will pump for a little while then go dry till they fill back up.

    In another development, last week a water main broke in the middle of town. The crumbling infrastructure caused most of the town to lose water and a boil before drinking notice was issued, don't know how long it lasted.

    So rain water catchment is definitely on the table.
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