What is this brown stuff...?

Discussion in 'The Green Patch' started by Bandit99, May 31, 2016.


  1. Bandit99

    Bandit99 Monkey+++

    I realize this is a gardening place but I because of the good wisdom and experience I have found from fellow monkeys - well - I hope no one will be offended with a question that is a bit off topic.

    I live in the Northwest, Northern Idaho, to be exact. I have 5 acres of beautiful pines and fir.
    Around the area lately, I have noticed lots of dead trees, all brown, gone. I have a few trees that have individual limbs that have gone brown (see photo)

    1) What is this brown stuff?
    2) should I cut off the brown limbs in hopes of saving the tree?
    3) Maybe these brown limbs are normal? And, this not what I have seen like the dead brown trees in the area?

    I am going to ask around here also as know 2 excellent master gardeners one of has a lot of experience with trees but not sure I can hook up with him in the next few days so looking for all insight I can find.... Thanks!

    Brown limb on tree.
     
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  2. Motomom34

    Motomom34 Moderator Moderator Site Supporter++

    Regarding the all brown trees, have you checked to see if they are beetle infested? Your tree looks basically healthy except for that one branch. Any holes in the trunk?
     
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  3. tacmotusn

    tacmotusn Mosquito Sailor

    ditto, pine beetle attacked trees start out like that. Almost all of the attack goes on in the outer 1.5 inch bark and just below layer. The bark will be perforated with 1/16th inch holes and flaking off. I think they feed on the sap.
     
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  4. Motomom34

    Motomom34 Moderator Moderator Site Supporter++

    Thanks @tac for your second opinion. @RickR skin some bark off.
     
  5. azrancher

    azrancher Monkey +++

    Oh yeah that's pine tree beetle, what you need is Lindane... Oh wait, they only sell that in Australia because the EPA said it's bad stuff, good luck your trees will die.

    But the EPA saved us from ourselves.

    Rancher
     
  6. Motomom34

    Motomom34 Moderator Moderator Site Supporter++

    Not all your trees will die. I lost three in a triangle to beetle kill. I could hear the bugs. Walked by and my tree was making a clicking noise. The forester told me that was non-sense but I know what I heard. When you start seeing the white puss balls then drop and tarp them. You can get the rest of your trees sprayed.
     
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  7. AD1

    AD1 Monkey+++

    We have the issue in Arizona. With the drought, there is not enough water for the trees and when that happens the tree has less sap. This allow the beatles to burrow into the tree under the bark when normally the sap would flush them out.
     
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  8. Bandit99

    Bandit99 Monkey+++

    I checked the limb itself and up and down the trunk. No small holes and no clicking sound. And, yes, @Motomom34, sometimes you can hear the bugs at work in trees or a wood pile, etc. I have heard them, don't know what the heck that guy was talking about... Anyway, even the limb itself looks healthy.

    Maybe I should cut a piece of bark off that brown limb and look at the wood underneath? I mean, looking at it one would think that limb is dead but it isn't...

    I had a huge pine in early March that had a limb do the same thing, brown, but I was too busy to worry about it and just lopped the limb off. I just went out and checked on it and everything is all green. So, do you think I should take off the limb? Take down the entire tree?

    @Motomom34 Can you please clarify this statement, "When you start seeing the white puss balls then drop and tarp them. You can get the rest of your trees sprayed." Do you mean that the bark will actually have white balls that resemble puss? And, 'drop and tarp them' means to then cut the tree down and put into a tarp so as not to infect other trees? We can burn here so we'd just cut it down and throw it into the fire pit. I have a huge one as constant burning limbs and etc...
     
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  9. AD1

    AD1 Monkey+++

    Pine beetle-killed trees decline in Idaho as insects find fewer good targets


    IDAHO FALLS, Idaho (AP) — U.S. Forest Service officials say the number of trees being killed by pine beetle infestation is on the decline, in part because the insects have eaten themselves out of house and home.

    The beetles burrow under the bark of pine trees to lay eggs. Once the eggs hatch, the larvae eat the inner layer of bark, killing the tree. An aerial survey in 2010 showed beetle-killed trees on 9.2 million acres of public and private land in Western states, including nearly 2 million acres in Idaho.

    The number of infested acres in Idaho has dropped 63 percent in the years since, to about 719,000 acres in 2012.

    Experts feel confident the decline will continue.

    "[It] is declining for multiple reasons, but the main factor is they've killed most of their suitable hosts," U.S. Forest Service entomologist Carl Jorgensen told the Post Register.

    Once a tree is infested, it can't be saved.

    "There's nothing we can do for it at that point," said Tom Eckberg, Idaho Department of Lands Forest Health Specialist.

    The beetles prefer lodgepole pine, whitebark pine and ponderosa pine. They seek out trees with the thickest layer of phloem — the inner layer that larvae feed on — and that means they typically attack trees that are at least 8 inches or larger in diameter, that are 80 years old or older, and that are growing at an altitude of 6,500 feet or lower.

    When adult beetles find a suitable host, they send out a pheromone to signal other beetles to the tree, Eckberg said.

    After the tree is full of beetles, another pheromone is sent out telling new insects to find another home, said Sandy Kegley, a Forest Service entomologist.

    "They will continue to kill trees until they run out of suitable hosts or very cold weather kills a large portion of beetles," Eckberg said.

    Last year's massive wildfires, which burned about 1.7 million acres in Idaho, also may have contributed to a decrease in the acres lost to beetles this year.

    "The fires could have killed the trees the beetles would have eaten," Eckberg said. "But that's uncertain."

    ___
     
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  10. AD1

    AD1 Monkey+++

    image. image.
     
  11. Bandit99

    Bandit99 Monkey+++

    @AD1 Thanks! I will have to assume that is the problem. My neighbor across the street whole huge tree has gone brown. I think it's a white fir but will have to look again. I am going to cut the limb off and keep an eye on it and if any other limb starts to turn then I will take down the tree and burn it.

    EDIT: I changed my mind. The limb has some green in it so I am going to leave it for now but watch it like a hawk. I will get in touch with my tree guy this week and if he confirms then I will take and burn the tree. Thanks all!
     
    Last edited: May 31, 2016
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  12. Motomom34

    Motomom34 Moderator Moderator Site Supporter++

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  13. Bandit99

    Bandit99 Monkey+++

    Whew! I hope so... strange that just the one branch goes...and it's right near the top...so much to learn.
     
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  14. kellory

    kellory An unemployed Jester, is nobody's fool. Banned

    Sounds like they need to start research on these two pheromones. The first to make them leave the tree, and the second for a trap.
    Good luck with your tree.
     
    AD1 likes this.
  15. arleigh

    arleigh Goophy monkey

    Dad said the tree/roots lack enough water to make the sap to push out the tree beadle . that's all I know.
     
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  16. Cruisin Sloth

    Cruisin Sloth Special & Slow

    Caused by chemtrails & the flying of aluminum being dropped .
    I see this daily ,

    many of our trees are also dying , 200 years old to 600 .. Im mid 60 and this was not Before when i was a kid ..
    Ask why they spray the skys , LOOK UP & out of your phones . Smile & look me in my eyes , I might be buying
     
  17. svjoe

    svjoe Angry Monkey

    Lose the limb, better than the whole tree.
     
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