You May Be Strong . . . But Are You Tough?

Discussion in 'Survival of the Fittest' started by Yard Dart, Oct 4, 2013.

  1. Yard Dart

    Yard Dart Vigilant Monkey Moderator

    You May Be Strong . . . But Are You Tough? | The Art of Manliness
    GOG, Mike, Bear and 8 others like this.
  2. gunbunny

    gunbunny Never Trust A Bunny

    Yes, something like this: Once squatting 400+ pounds on the rack, but now lie broken in my back.
    A little Friday evening rhyme for you.
    Strong but no longer tough. Age doesn't help things (not using it as a crutch- just an observation).
    Mike and Yard Dart like this.
  3. Gator 45/70

    Gator 45/70 Monkey+++

    Beats me ?
    I do know that when my famous Cou-san Leroy broke a couple of bone's in my foot last January I opted out that he bring me to the local E.R.
    1. He was not going to drive or be keeping my truck.
    2. I was not going to pay for a 110 mile ambulance ride.
    3. I drove myself, Cruise control is your friend !
  4. Brokor

    Brokor Live Free or Cry Moderator Site Supporter+++ Founding Member

    I weighed 115 lbs. at 18 yrs. of age when I first went into U.S. Army infantry training. Needless to say, I made it with flying colors, and back then (over 20 years ago now) that's saying a lot. I've seen much larger guys bail out and break down crying. No cell phones (they didn't exist except for the ones in the bags which were too expensive), no outside contact, no liberties aside from a bi-weekly PX visit (chaperoned) for a haircut and a few supplies. It wasn't until our AIT period, much later in training when we actually received a few hours to visit the town. Things sure have changed. I made a trip to Fort Benning in 2006 to see the jump towers, and I was surprised at how there no longer exists a separation from military training and civilian life. Most recruits are never without their phones, and they do not experience the hardships we had to endure.

    Of course, I am not sure if being kicked and slapped upside the head and forced to low-crawl through fire ants makes you a better soldier. No need to worry now, though. I am sure the kids today will prove to be excellent soldiers regardless of their training...after all, they have the "warrior ethos" to memorize instead of actually coming into the military as an honest person and just recognizing the standard as typical.

    I've been out of service for a few years now, but I still recall not too long ago, running past a group of young men who were half my age, and by every right they should have left me in the dust. There they were, wheezing and complaining, still in the frame of mind of a civilian, wanting a better reality than the one they were given but too feeble to suck up the pain and drive on. A soldier follows orders, and performs every duty in a military manner. But, when that military is no longer sufficiently comprised of real soldiers, it's time to hang up the boonie cap and grab a beer, because that's no military I want to belong to.

    Most go into the military looking for careers. That is a good thing, but to place this diatribe in perspective, when I first joined, I wanted to train on the biggest guns, operate the deadliest armored vehicles, jump from planes, become a trained fighting machine, and serve with honor as a meat shield. Period. Times have changed.
  5. Yard Dart

    Yard Dart Vigilant Monkey Moderator

    First off... you skinny SOB at 18....I was 165 at 18 when I went in with a very similar story in 86. I put on 20 lbs in basic and AIT and discovered coffee on the firing it was the only thing warm in the middle of winter at Jackson. I dragged my knuckles doing push-ups on the cables at Benning and the first unit I hit at Bragg said welcome and we deploy in three days... whoo hoo. I was stuck carrying the guidon more times than I can count... but my lung capacity was greatly improved as I had to work harder. For many years I could out run, and road march most any fool trying to keep up... man has age caught up with me.

    I went back to Jackson for training and got to visit the basic barracks and interview the new troops.... man just in that 10 years stuff had changed so much. When I was in basic they were trying to get the drills to stop hitting us.... these new kids could flash a "I'm stressed" card and get off the hook- wow.

    I still relate stories once in a blue moon and the usual response by the younger generation is BS. Now I now what the Vietnam vets thought of us snot nosed guys coming in back in the day. You give all you got, and then you keep on humping... as that hot shower and warm meal is down the road....somewhere.
    Last edited: Oct 5, 2013
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  6. Brokor

    Brokor Live Free or Cry Moderator Site Supporter+++ Founding Member

    Ha! I carried a guy your size in first aid class and got a hernia from it. I kept on toting him, realized the next morning when I went to the latrine that my hernia was gonna cause a delay in training. After the surgery, I recycled back to week 6 and picked up there. I weigh in between 145 and 150 lbs. now, which is a good weight at 5' 8" I suppose. I sure do miss the early morning breakfasts (all you can eat) cottage cheese and fruit. I take my time eating these days, though. ;)
    Mike, Silversnake and Yard Dart like this.
  7. Troy brownrigg

    Troy brownrigg How my next home will be constructed!

    Strong tough, you got to be kidding me! I would rather be smart, and in good health. Smart enough to prepare for what's coming, smart enought to grow my own food. I can lift more with a push of a button than twenty strong men. Toughness can be replaced with knowledge. Snipers can rack up kills from a mile away, and are smart enough never to be seen. When I was 125lbs I was in gymnastics and was bench pressing 225 lbs and could walk on my hands for hours. Now I'm old and wouldn't attempt it. I work out every day I take a shovel out to the horse stalls and clean them, mend fencing on a 55 arce ranch and tend to a herd of goats. The I plant a garden in my spare time. When I get tired I try to learn something off the internet from sites like this. I order how to books in case I need them for future events. books on eatable plants, how to use plants to make some medicines one might need, how to survive a nuclear event. I would rather be smart and prepared, then strong or tough.
  8. Yard Dart

    Yard Dart Vigilant Monkey Moderator

    @Troy brownrigg welcome to the Monkey!!
    I agree that we would be much better served by being smart, skilled and in good health. Though we can not ignore the fact we need to be in good shape, and able to physically perform all the task needed to survive in your AO. Not just a gym rat, but actually getting out there and training or working in the environment, such as your lifestyle you spelled out above. Glad to see you here!!
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2013
    Mike likes this.
  9. Silversnake

    Silversnake Silverback

    To me, toughness has more to do with resiliency, heart, grit and the commitment to do what needs to be done regardless of the ugliness. I've been in a few situations where I look around at the rest of the team and said "I know this sucks. Somebody's probably gonna die, so let's get it over with, but accomplish what we came for". BTW, if you're the guy saying that, have the balls to be the first one to step into the fray. Just sayin'.
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  10. Troy brownrigg

    Troy brownrigg How my next home will be constructed!

    What I think is coming is an all out nuclear attack, followed by a civil war or the likes of. With seven million people in the Phoenix area and a million in the Tucson area the idea of getting it over with is not the answer. Better to be out of sight and not seen in the upcoming events, because the masses outnumber you badly. Be smart it will be the only way to save your families.
  11. Silversnake

    Silversnake Silverback

    You miss the point completely. You can be as smart as you want, but without toughness/discipline, you will get mentally, physically and emotionally overwhelmed, not to mention set a horrible example of how to persevere to those you are leading (your family). A leader who demonstrates toughness inspires it in those around him/her. Being smart does not show your kid you understand it sucks that he can only eat his ration. Or can't go out and play. Or has to say goodbye to his pet dog for good (EDIT: Old Yeller). Or has to shoot a bad guy, then help clean up the mess.
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  12. Troy brownrigg

    Troy brownrigg How my next home will be constructed!

    I grew up on a farm slaughtered countless aniamals for food. Spent twelve years in the military. Shooting somebody no big deal, eating a dog, I eat rattle snakes on occasion. I've hunted this area for forty years. I really have no emotions anymore. As far as my son goes 8 years in Iraq, he'll be a great plus. You can be as tough and as mean as you want, get out in this desert with the millions that will have too! is suicidal. We're talking 115 degrees plus no water and no transportation. The discipline is being smart enough to wait until this desert kills off 80% of those tough people. Physically I'm to old to last in these deserts for any lenght of time. Prepared for decades on how to survive in this area, and keep others out of harms way. I think I set a very good example, knowing the enemy is half the battle. Home turf which is sixty miles from anyone is a great plus. The Russians in WWII allowed the Germans to move forward hundreds of miles, then picked weapons from the frozen dead. Every year hundreds of imigrants try to cross this desert alot don't make it, when I was younger it was normal to have 300-400 dead a year. Now the border patrol saves them. No I don't think anything will overwhelm me or the group that will be here.
    Mountainman likes this.
  13. Silversnake

    Silversnake Silverback

    EDIT: This response sounds harsh, not meant to be offensive.
  14. Troy brownrigg

    Troy brownrigg How my next home will be constructed!

    No offense taken, glad to hear other peoples opinons. I've reseached many ideas, and reseached some history about this location. When the 49er's headed to Taxifornia, the loss of life was great across the death valley area. Therefore Those in Taxifornia will have no choice but to head north through Oregan / Washington were talking 35 million without resources. Seven million in the Phoenix area and a million in the Tucson area. Arizona gets it's water through the Central Arizona Project CAP from the Colorado river. Any major event and Arizona has no water and no eletric. You know whats in Arizona: old people and hospitals. My plans are simple stay out of sight as much as possible and don't engage the masses. Most people in Arizona are equally armed and know how to shoot. The numbers would wipe anyone out after a while, there is just way to many of them. What will work is to let mother nature kill off as many as possible, or let them fight it out. We have enough resources to hold out for a couple of months, enough trained people to secure this area against small numbers. I think what's coming is going to be very bad.
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  15. VHestin

    VHestin Farm Chick

    Well I guess it's a good thing the women in my family tend to be the tough ones. I remember my older cousin, one time he got a cold, and he carried on like he was on his deathbed. I suppose basically trying to homestead on our property here necessitates toughness. Alot of things around here I don't do because I want to exactly, it's simply if I don't do it, it doesn't get done. So I cope by being a potty mouth while doing it :cool:
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  16. wastelander

    wastelander Bad English, bare with me

    I believe all people do what they must do. Life will force them sooner or later and this toughness is what has brought us this far. We are all tough.
  17. Bear

    Bear Monkey+++ Founding Member Iron Monkey

    @Yard Dart I really like this read... Thanks for posting it... lot's of applications in a lot of different ways... another tool ... and another "tool sharpener" :0)
    Thanks again,
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  18. Chad Peterson

    Chad Peterson Monkey

    I hope I'm on topic here. Maybe you've heard of this book by Ben Sherwood, The Survivors Club. He dwells on an aspect of survival that keeps me intrigued. Top of page 63, "Is it possible to tell if your prone to behavioral inaction?" Also called negative panic or dislocation of expectation.
    The scenario was a plane crash. The most likely to escape the plane before smoke and flame consume the cabin (90 seconds) are the young slender men. How many young slender men would be willing to step over and on the older and maybe not so slender to escape.
    You have to read the book...........
    My point is that until the crisis hit I'm not sure how I'll react.
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  19. Bear

    Bear Monkey+++ Founding Member Iron Monkey

    That's a great book @Chad Peterson... Page 29 has the story of a 145 lb grandmother who lifted a 3,450 lb 1964 Chevy that had pinned her son... granted it was just a few inches but it was enough to save him.... There are lots of great books like Deep Survival that delve into the human mind under extreme stress... folks with years of training that have died when their training should have clearly saved them... but for one reason or another... the "event" cancelled out what they knew and their muscle memory and they perished as if they had no prior training.... there is another book that I can't remember the name of but it was written by a woman who interviewed some of the 911 survivors... amazing stories... people actually paused to tidy their desks and lost precious moments... others froze... inconceivable behavior as the survivors related their actions but they were overcome and their minds shifted somehow... That is what is so important about what was originally posted here IMHO.... Toughness takes practice... and awareness of how your mind will work... that old story about folks who die in getting lost in the woods... they die of shame... maybe that's true... Deep Survival has a story of a mountain rescue professional that died in the woods... he had all the training and gear... and yet he still couldn't save himself... it's a good read if you haven't read it... and the author also has a website as well... there's a review somewhere around here on the book as well... You are correct... I'm not sure we all know how we will react if a crisis hits... the point is to prepare yourself mentally so that the odds that you will react appropriately improve in your favor... Those are my thoughts FWIW... Thanks for posting...
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  20. Dont

    Dont Just another old gray Jarhead Monkey

    This whole thread has been informative and just great! Living out "there", I think "am I worthy" to live in the mountains.. I consider this when the plow blade literaly falls off the truck.. If a gen set fails up the hill at the well and I need to drag one up there on a sled.. It's all in how you approach an adverse situation and you know that there is NO not solving the problem.. I say I would like to have a warm shop to work in during the winter, then drag the welding bottles up to the plow and weld the blade back on in the snow bank.. Things just need to be done , so get to it...
    Bear and Yard Dart like this.
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