bug out gun thoughts...

Discussion in 'General Survival and Preparedness' started by monkeyman, Dec 2, 2005.


  1. monkeyman

    monkeyman Monkey+++ Moderator Emeritus Founding Member

    OK, since Katrina and such along with a thread I had read someplace (don't remember if it was here or elsewhere) I have thought a bit on this. While its good to be prepared for TEOTWAWKI, its a lot more likely that any of us will face things where we need to get through a situation like Katrina or a terror attack or some other incident that while a major disruption and a time when one would do well to be armed it isn't the collapse of the world and being SEEN armed could cause problems. Kind of like N.O. after Katrina, assuming you have to bug out on foot, if you were carrying a long gun openly then while it may deter some bad guys it was also likely to get tense reactions from neighborhood groups securing their areas and any cops that saw you would be likely to be trying to take the guns or at least give you grief which could become hostile due to the fact of carrying openly, much the same as if you walked down the side of a highway today carrying a long gun, its likely to attract undue attention.
    So the question is if you had to bug out, how would you avoid creating undue confrontation that being openly armed might create due to others thinking your party was a threat (as in aggressive)? Would you carry just handguns on you concealed with long guns left in the vehicle or packs? Would you leave the long guns at home, or would you carry them in the open and just deal with confrontations with cops, home owners and bad guys alike?
     
  2. Quigley_Sharps

    Quigley_Sharps The Badministrator Administrator Founding Member

    I would pack them all, big and small.
    How about you MonkeyMan would you pack a AK down the street?
     
  3. E.L.

    E.L. Moderator of Lead Moderator Emeritus Founding Member

    To me it would depend upon the enviroment. If there was a LE or military presence, then I pack concealed, more than likely just handguns. If not, then I am packing long arms too.
     
  4. melbo

    melbo Hunter Gatherer Administrator Founding Member

    If the Authorities are looking for guns, you should already be gone.

    I do think there may be the need for discretion when BO around others. You may be seen as a target of opportunity by good guys and bad guys. I've often thought that the Cowboy "Duster" 3/4 length trench with an AK slung underneath it would be a great way to walk around anywhere.

    If in a large metropolis, a 5 man team could prolly pose as a Band by carrying guitar cases and not get stopped. I think a "Mountain of a Man from MO" like you could just about do whatever he pleased :D
     
  5. E.L.

    E.L. Moderator of Lead Moderator Emeritus Founding Member

    This is where BDU's, shirts saying "Security" and and acting in a "professional" manner, fingers off of triggers, etc. might bluff your way through when they are looking for the street punks that seemed to be everywhere.
     
  6. E.L.

    E.L. Moderator of Lead Moderator Emeritus Founding Member

    Or a underfolder strapped behind your back with a long vest over it.
     
  7. ghrit

    ghrit Ambulatory anachronism Administrator Founding Member

    If you are down to walking, the duster works for me, even in summer. It would hide my 357 in the shoulder holster, and an AR carbine on the side or maybe even my back. I'm a scrawny ol' phart, and almost anything will print, so a guitar case might do --. MM, you could hide a Desert Eagle in your beard, and in BDUs, I think you would not run into much troubles --
     
  8. monkeyman

    monkeyman Monkey+++ Moderator Emeritus Founding Member

    It might depend some on the situation but most likely in a situation where I was gonna be on foot I would try and have it in the pack or with a folding stock under a long jacket in apropriate weather or something, but would have to think hard before would carry it out in the open if things had not totaly broken down. I would definatly have a hand gun at least some what out of sight. I just have kind of gotten to thinking in terms of even now, even being very pro gun, if Im driveing down the road, especialy in town (not talking out in the wilderness here) and see a group of people walking down the street carrying AKs, Im probably not going to assume they are friendly folks just going about their day, and any cop is DEFINATLY going to confront them (probably after the rest of the squad gets there for back up) even if they have not made any threatening moves other than the fact of carrying their long guns. Even a person haveing a gun holstered on their hip would not get as negative of reaction. Then there would be the thought that (in terms of a short term thing like Katrina or a terror attack) the main threats would be from disorganized groups at worst along the lines of gangs and mostly punks looking for easy pickings. These types would most likely look for an easier target regardless if being shot at with a .22 pistol or AK. So my thought would be to try and keep the long guns out of sight untill needed for hunting and such and use the handgun for defense.
    Like I say, for this one Im talking about a localized situation where things are disrupted but not fully colapsed, like N.O. a week after Katrina when they didnt have it safe but there were cops and national guard and such in place, or say N.Y. on 9/11. If it was total collapse then its a different situation and would be a lot more likely to have a long gun either shouldered or in hand, also if able to go by vehicle the long guns would DEFFINATLY be there in any situation. Im just thinking that long guns in some situations might get you into as many scrapes as they would avoid, most fire fights would be likely to be inside 50 yards and more likely inside 25 so the handguns would work, and the fights that the long guns might cause would be with folks who otherwise would not be a problem.
    A lot of this internal debate came from the fact I would most likely be bugged in and thinking how I would react to filks walking past my place let alone to the door (even if they may just be comeing to ask permission to pitch tents in the field for the night before moveing on or offer work for assistance) with long guns (especialy if they didnt have slings and the guns slung on the back as opposed to in hand or tacticaly slung at ready) as opposed to unarmed or holstered sidearms. Even as a gun advocate, a group of strangers comeing to my door with guns in hand would most likely be construed as agression and I figure lot of people would find it even more so. I guess a part of it might also be if carrying long arms openly are they in hand or slung over the thoulder since any gun (or any other weapon for that matter) IN HAND when aproaching others or even their teritory (home, land, whatever) is easily construed as agression.
     
  9. ghostrider

    ghostrider Resident Poltergeist Founding Member

    Definitely a handgun concealed, but I have thought about this, too. A rifle with a real folding stock, AK, Mini14 etc. will be a lot handier, the aforementioned slung across your back, rolled into your sleeping bag, is a lot easier to walf around with.
     
  10. ghrit

    ghrit Ambulatory anachronism Administrator Founding Member

    mm, you are thinking along the right lines. There are a lot of variables, very situation dependent. You almost have to prepare for any and all situations. The key is to prepare first for the most probably, and as time and money permits, prepare for the less likely.

    For my own part, if I have a BO sit, I am going stealthy, meaning avoid contact as much as possible. As I said above, I'm too scrawny to carry a lot concealed, so I need to stay away from times and places where I'd stand out at all. A couple members of the tribe on the move can be a little less careful. But, but, but --

    It is serious business, but fun in a way, to think some of this all over. Gets the brain lubed up.
     
  11. E.L.

    E.L. Moderator of Lead Moderator Emeritus Founding Member

    "Chance favors the prepared mind."
     
  12. BRONZ

    BRONZ Monkey+++ Moderator Emeritus Founding Member

    Tennis racket case :D
     
  13. Quigley_Sharps

    Quigley_Sharps The Badministrator Administrator Founding Member

    Hey bronz How goes it? Good to see you back!
     
  14. BRONZ

    BRONZ Monkey+++ Moderator Emeritus Founding Member

    Good Brother very good...
     
  15. monkeyman

    monkeyman Monkey+++ Moderator Emeritus Founding Member

    Could be but the first part of what I would please is to avoid being shot at as much as possible and second is to avoid haveing to shoot others if it can be avoided. :D
    I do have the duster like you mentioned and in cool or wet weather it would definatly be an ideal way to go since a long arm (even a moderatly short shotgun with normal stock) can be carried butt up under the arm with the sling over the shoulder out of sight. I wouldnt be to worried about printing and such, the bigest thing is that unless it was an openly hostilae enviroment (think like red neck walking through South Central LAs worst areas in the wrong color cloths or carrying a confederat flag:shock: ) I would not want to be carrying my guns in hand while walking down the street while there was military/LEO presence, and would not want to be carrying in hand and preferably not in the open when I would have to aproach others homes or camps.
    Thats another thing where I vary a lot from what a lot of folks talk about as a bug out plan. Unless you have a vehicle and can drive in one hitch to where you are going you will most likely have to find a place to toss up a camp for the night. In a lot of areas even in normal conditions its not the safest idea to get caught squating or trespassing on other folks land and I would imagine if there were looters and such abroad it would get a far less plesant response and most land is private so where ever you set a camp is probably someones back 40 if not back yard, I tend to figure it would be safest to go to the house in a non threatening way and ask permission to 'pitch a tent for the night down by the creek then be on our way in the morning...' or what ever than to meet the owner in the middle of the night when he comes out with the boys to see whos there. This is one of the big places where I could see being OPENLY loaded for bear as a detrement.

    Were should we be? If youre not sure what I mean by this take one of the ARs tomorrow, sling it over your shoulder or carry it in front of you, go to the nearest well traveled road in at least a reasonably urban area (not a place where you would be assumed to be a hunter) and walk down that road and see how long it is before a cop is asking you to put it on the ground and come talk to him while he squats behind the door of his cruiser with his gun pointed at you.
    In some areas, especialy if you are reasonably clean cut you may not have a problem walking around with a holstered sidearm carrying out in the open in town, but I dont see you walking through any but the smallest town (where folks know you and know you are takeing it out of town to shoot or some such) where you would not at LEAST be questioned and or challenged on it by LEOs. I somehow think this would only be more so if things were comeing apart at the seams but still in tact enouph for the cops and such to be there, and if not then residents in an area where you were a stranger would likely be even more so.
     
  16. melbo

    melbo Hunter Gatherer Administrator Founding Member

    One of those times ghrit, when the LOL smilie just doesn't quite convey what I just settled down from... Thanks
     
  17. melbo

    melbo Hunter Gatherer Administrator Founding Member

    Sorry, was referring to the Katrina type sit from your first post, not necessarily yours, (or mine) in a rural situation. If Rural, I think much of this would be a moot point.

     
  18. melbo

    melbo Hunter Gatherer Administrator Founding Member

    wb BRONZ
     
  19. monkeyman

    monkeyman Monkey+++ Moderator Emeritus Founding Member

    Yeah, thats kind of what I was refering to as well, assumeing you were in a more populated area like with Katrina. Say you had a solidly built brick house on comparitivly high ground and suplies and were going to ride it out but then due to the levees breaking and the kaos folowing you decided it was best to BO (this assuption since if you bugged out before that you could do it by vehicle and then the longarms can just be across the seat or whatever), if you were walking down the street most any time gun in hand it would draw unwanted attention, pre, post or mid emergency.

    :D lol Which that could also in reality work a bit to my disadvantage in a lot of situations like that. I know the fact that I generaly have long hair and a bushy beard has caused me a lot more interaction with LEOs than I would have had if more 'clean cut' and than what I have had in periods when I was more clean cut.
     
  20. Brokor

    Brokor Live Free or Cry Moderator Site Supporter+++ Founding Member

    Evasive action will enable you to decrease your chances of capture or even confrontation of any kind. Why should you run through a populated area when you can move at night or through a more rural area?

    I will pack all I can, weapons and all for sure. Of course...I look like the police (dressed in black BDU's and with tactical vest) and can easily pose as one if necessary.
     
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