What if Scenario: Economic Collapse

Discussion in 'General Survival and Preparedness' started by Clyde, Aug 11, 2005.


  1. Clyde

    Clyde Jet Set Tourer Administrator Founding Member

    I spent this morning reading about gold and silver on another BB which is solely on that topic. One respected member said they believed gold/silver would be valueable and needed after a SHTF situation, but he felt the immediate needs of food, fuel, shelter, and water would far outweigh the interest people would have in owning gold or silver. What are your thoughts? Do you own precious metals?

    I have been outbid consistently on ebay the past week on 10 oz lots of silver maple leafs. I can't make sense of how people are purchasing when they end up with an ounce costing $10.50 after shippping when the spot prices is $7.05.

    Personally, I would find sow, ewe, cow much more "precious" than I would find gold or silver.
     
    melbo likes this.
  2. monkeyman

    monkeyman Monkey+++ Moderator Emeritus Founding Member

    I tend to think that food will be the top imediate item sought after along with tools, especialy quality ones. The majority of folks dont even have a decent knife unless they may have a decent set in the kitchen, to many folks dont have any kind of guns, few have non electric tools like drills and other hand tools, axes and hatchets would also be in demand as well as shovels and sensable cloths and shoes. Some of these things would come into demand sooner than others but in a prolonged situation all of these, IMHO, would be far more valuable than precious metals, along with ammo being at tthe top of the list and only becomeing more valuable as time goes on, even most folks who have guns dont have even 100 rounds of ammo, many will have no more than 2 boxes per cal. so that would be used quickly as demand goes through the roof and suply dwendles.
    Lets face it, what use is gold if you are starveing or freezing to death and being chased down by MZBs?
    As far as a form of curency cash would be more valuable since it could at least work as TP or to start a fire and is easier to carry. In my story in the reading room the locals decide they need a way to have barter credit or currency so they can buy small items from several folks with pay for a steer or whatefever and ease of use so they develope thier own new form of currency. Ill leave it at that as a teaser for anyone who hasnt read it yet.
     
  3. melbo

    melbo Hunter Gatherer Administrator Founding Member

    I think Gold and Silver will always be of value to some extent. Gold is recognized world wide as a valuable metal and has been forever.

    However, in the beginning, (say, 1st year) of a Major collapse that sends us back in time, There are other items that would be more useful and sought after than Gold. Especially to those who had no hand tools, weapons , ammo etc.

    People with extra might be able to collect some gold during that time. Yeah, Th's why I buy so much ammo. I'll be a post SHTF Ammo Dealer....

    good thoughts
     
  4. monkeyman

    monkeyman Monkey+++ Moderator Emeritus Founding Member

    A couple other items that Im sure would be in extreeme demand after any SHTF situation, tobacco for all of us smokers, and alcohol for most folks. In a situation like that stress would be extreeme which only increases smokeing and a lot of folks would want the temporary escape of a good drunk as well as medicinal use of alcohol and both would be in short supply soon. Think about it, in any war zone (which is basicly a SHTF zone) two of the most valued trade goods are alcohol and tobaco (and TP and chocolate) from what I have heard from most vets that have been in those areas.
     
  5. ghrit

    ghrit Old, mean, and nasty Administrator Founding Member

    It seems to me that early in a SHTF situation, cash would do well enough. As things progress, cash will have less and less meaning as it's value becomes uncertain. So all it is anyway is a medium of exchange. Precious metals are used the same way; that is, it allows establishment of an equivalence between the goat, cow, gallon of fuel, or whatever, and allows a subdivision of values so you don't have to barter a whole cow for a tank of water, you can obtain reasonable size lots of necessities. I ain't about to swap a pound of gold for one goat. Somebody in the group has to have a small balance beam in their kit. Say like a reloader's scale, so that the metal can be accurately measured.

    Yeah, I said balance beam. Batteries are likely to be scarce. [troll]
     
  6. E.L.

    E.L. Moderator of Lead Moderator Emeritus Founding Member

    I would think that ammo and batteries would be more vaulable than gold.
     
  7. TLynn

    TLynn Monkey+++ Moderator Emeritus Founding Member

    ghrit - now I know why I hold on to old stuff. All those battery operated things do tend to have a slight problem if you don't have the batteries to make them work.
     
  8. magnus392

    magnus392 Field Marshall Mags Moderator Emeritus Founding Member

    IMO food and water will be the most in demand items. Closely followed by ammuntion and guns.

    Depending on the depth and type of SHTF scenrio, terror attack and chaos in the streets, but Government still in power....they will likely try to take gun if folks hit the street looting, rioting, and what not.

    Now total collapse, little to no government....I want water, food and Ammo, lots of ammo to get me to my dissappear in the woods spot.
     
  9. monkeyman

    monkeyman Monkey+++ Moderator Emeritus Founding Member

    I figure the best bet is, if you have money to invest for what would be valuable if SHTF just buy extras of the stuff you will need, guns, ammo, knives, all the supplies. There will be lots of folks that didnt get any and you can sell to them for whatever medium is being used and not have a useless one you invested in. Hord inventory.
     
  10. E.L.

    E.L. Moderator of Lead Moderator Emeritus Founding Member

    With guns, mags, and ammo, you can take as much food, water, gold and silver as you need. Desperate situations call for desperate measures. Hopefully all of us here will be prepared for anything that comes our way. Having lots of food and water won't help much when you can't prevent someone else from taking it.
     
  11. Bear

    Bear Monkey+++ Site Supporter+++ Founding Member Iron Monkey

    Yup... Gold and Silver are for a while after things HTF..... I think the hard consumables like food, water, fuel, bullets are tops.... a good shelter etc.... you cant eat or drink gold and silver nor fire it at someone and its heavy as hell and you have better things to be carrying around.... I also think 90% Silver is a better way to go if you're prepping....... people will recognize it and barter or exchange will be easier.... also remember that bullion is always suspect... people drill out those 100o.z. bars and fill them with lead... it was a problem in the past... if you have to... buy smaller denominations as well.... if all you have a 1o.z. gold krugerrand or maple leaf then that's what that can of soda or loaf of bread is gonna cost you ... Gold and Silver IMHO is for when things haven't quite gone bug out and a while after the SHTF or TEOTWAWKI.... all portfolios should have a percentage of hard assets.... but also remember unless you take delivery and store it where you can get it.... you probably won't be able to get at it very easily or at all if things go bad..... JMHO....
     
  12. Seacowboys

    Seacowboys Senior Member Founding Member

    There is one single compulsion stronger than the need to survive in man and that is greed. Gold will blind one to many realities and that's just a simple fact. GOld has bought food when wheel-barrels of paper currency wouldn't buy a loaf of bread. People kill for gold, so don't think they wouldn't sell their children for it, even for lunch. That may sound cynical, but if you don't account for the human greed factor, you are unprepared.
     
  13. TLynn

    TLynn Monkey+++ Moderator Emeritus Founding Member

    You are correct Seacowboys in regard to gold and the lust many people have for it and how many people have died over it.

    When you can't even eat it or keep yourself warm with the dang stuff.

    But it can be useful to keep the greedy ones in check if need be.
     
  14. ghrit

    ghrit Old, mean, and nasty Administrator Founding Member

    Only if you drop it on their heads.

    So far as magazines, ammo, and armament allowing you to "forage " for what you need, sure. BUT consider the size and armament that you may be facing. When (and if) it comes to that, people greeting strangers (you) at the door who may wish to "borrow" a cup of sugar might just have a few folks backing them up. Fact is, that has to be SOP for us as a group.
     
  15. TLynn

    TLynn Monkey+++ Moderator Emeritus Founding Member

    ghrit, sometimes people do the most stupidist things when it comes to that shiny stuff. At least in the beginning. They don't realize that gold and precious metal for the most part don't do you any good until the economy is in a position where it is stabilized enough.

    So yes it can be a bartering tool of some degree for people. Personally I prefer ammo and foodstuffs. 22 ammo is a good bartering tool. It's needful because you can use it to get game (small game which if you think about it is something that will feed you just as well as that big game and more plentiful in the long term). Depending on where you are you'll definitely have to learn trapping skills big time and it would be good to have a bunch of hooks and line on hand with you for fishing (good knives and axes, extra axe handles if you can) so you can create your own primitive fishing poles.

    Biggest thing people should consider is a source of salt - it's a definite commodity and a precious one. Going to be needed big time.
     
  16. monkeyman

    monkeyman Monkey+++ Moderator Emeritus Founding Member

    it would be good to have a bunch of hooks and line on hand with you for fishing (good knives and axes, extra axe handles if you can) so you can create your own primitive fishing poles.


    Actualy if you are in an area where you could do a bunch of fish here is a place with better gear for that. www.fishnetco.com The sell the nets and such to do large amounts of fish rather than a few here and there and a LOT better than poles if you are going to be there a few days or perminant since the nets/traps for the most part will fish while you do other things. Though in current times you have to get a special lisence to USE these items other than possibly in the ocean.

    The way things are going gas may be more precious as a barter item than gold in a SHTF especialy for the first year or so.
     
  17. Bear

    Bear Monkey+++ Site Supporter+++ Founding Member Iron Monkey

    "it would be good to have a bunch of hooks and line on hand with you for fishing "

    The hooks and line are also good for getting birds and small animals... bait it the same way... hide the hook... tie to something... and voila.... kinda a last resort... but hooks have alot of varied uses even if you're not near water or fishing.... they're not heavy... they're compact... Line is the same way... get some of the new kevlar and spectra lines along with the nylon stuff... the line has a ton of uses as well... small 2x3 heavy duty zip lok... 6mil... and yer set to go with hooks and line.... If anyone here wants a set up.... let me know.... I can put a few together for my buddies here..... and send if off..... [beer]
     
  18. Minuteman

    Minuteman Chaplain Moderator Founding Member

    For survival fishing don't forget the most basic and oldest method.Hand fishing.Grappling or what we call noodling in my neck of the woods.I can go out in one day and get a couple hundred pounds (uncleaned) of catfish.
    Also those auto set spring loaded reels are great to have too.

    Another use for hooks. Take a treble hook,attach about 6" of fishing line, any test. On the other end attach an "alligator" clip. spray paint the hook and the clip green.
    Wrap a dozen or so of these rigs around a short piece of wood.If you are in the woods, in a bug out situation, and being followed or pursued, as you are on the move, remove hooks and clip onto branches so the hook hangs at about eye level.Garaunteed to deter if not stop any pusuit.
     
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