What would you do?

Discussion in 'General Survival and Preparedness' started by Hosster, Apr 23, 2013.

  1. Hosster

    Hosster Monkey

    Assuming there was no Marshall law enacted, there is no search warrant that could be provided, and you knew you weren't harboring a terrorist... How would you respond to this if this were your home?

  2. BTPost

    BTPost Stumpy Old Fart,Deadman Walking, Snow Monkey Moderator

    I would simply say, "Sir, You may NOT search my Property, without a Legally Signed, AND Executed Search Warrant, If you choose to force, this Unwarranted Search, You will be explaining it, to the nearest Federal Judge, when I sue you, for Violating My 4th Amendment Civil Rights. Leave my Property, NOW" and I would have a Video Recording, of the whole encounter, being made, by my wife. It is really that simple. My 4th Amendment Rights, Trumps their Warrantless Search, every time, in Federal District Court, and by Summary Judgement. ..... YMMV.....
  3. Hosster

    Hosster Monkey

    In many states you cannot record officers and use it as evidence. In some states it's illegal to even record them period. These guys seemed hell bent on entry and I am still baffled if there would be a way to stop them, or if a court would care given the circumstances. I certainly wouldn't want to allow entry though. Not that I have anything to hide. It's more a matter of my rights.
    Seawolf1090 and kellory like this.
  4. ghrit

    ghrit Bad company Administrator Founding Member

    Yep, it's a matter of rights. That said, facing arms and armor, you don't have a lot of pleasant choices. You do their bidding and cross your fingers that paybacks are indeed hell.
    kellory likes this.
  5. Motomom34

    Motomom34 Monkey+++

    These guys were going to search no matter what. Had you politely declined you would have been down & bound, with some very big guns to your head. No doubt in my mind these pumped up officers were not thinking about the Constitution.
  6. BTPost

    BTPost Stumpy Old Fart,Deadman Walking, Snow Monkey Moderator

    Actually there is are a Number of Federal Appeals Court Rulings, that say that when YOU are on your OWN Property, YOU may record ANY ONE, or ANYTHING, Period, Including any Law Enforcement action that may be in view. This issue has come up, a lot, in the recent past, and so far as I recall, SCOTUS has not taken a case, on this issue, but let the Federal Appeals Court Rulings, stand. I may have missed one or two but the Majority Opinion, is that on YOUR OWN Property, You decide what happens, on this issue, and NO LEO has the Right, to force YOU, to do, other than what YOU decide.
  7. BTPost

    BTPost Stumpy Old Fart,Deadman Walking, Snow Monkey Moderator

    Motomom... That may be true, but when they get HAULED into Federal District Court, they are TOAST, and they KNOW this as it is Drilled into them, during Training, and NO Federal Prosecutor is going to even allow this to get to the Federal Judge.... He is going to get those LEOs, over to your house, with Every conceivable excuse, trying to get the Lawsuit Dropped, because they can NOT afford that kind of Precedent to be set, in that Federal District. There is absolutely No Way, this makes it past Summary Judgement, especially if you have the whole encounter on Video. The FEDs NEVER want these things to get into Court, because ANY Precedent, Limits their Intimidation Abilities.... They would much rather, Pay you Off with a BIG Settlement, and non-Disclouser, Agreement, then ever have a to get into Court, on Civil Rights Violation.
  8. Motomom34

    Motomom34 Monkey+++

    That is all true and it sounds wonderful. BUT say that was my home in that video and I said no, I was removed, thrown to the ground, cuffed and hauled off.... all this in front of my children. Or yet, what would they subject my children to. Would they cuff them? Would they haul them down to the station? I would have stated that they were not welcome to search my home but how far do you push the popint and what would you be willing to subject your family to?

    I recall in a book I read the father was arguing his constitution rights and he lost, he lost his life in front of his family. Now this book was fiction but it is a very real scenario that could take place next week. That is how far we are gone.
    Seawolf1090 likes this.
  9. NotSoSneaky

    NotSoSneaky former supporter

    Not much one could have done without getting shot by the cops. *shrugs*
    Motomom34 likes this.
  10. Silversnake

    Silversnake Silverback

  11. Motomom34

    Motomom34 Monkey+++

  12. ColtCarbine

    ColtCarbine Monkey+++ Founding Member

    Agreed and anybody resisting the strong arm of the law would be considered an enemy of the state and who will be around to speak on your behalf.

    Nobody, dead men tell no lies. You will not have your day in court, period.

    If one were to resist one of two things would probably happen, either you are dead

    or arrested on charges for obstructing the duties of a law enforcement officer.

    So, who thinks the Patriot Act was a good idea now......

    The events in Boston should be labeled

    The Boston Civil Rights Massacre
    Motomom34 likes this.
  13. Motomom34

    Motomom34 Monkey+++

  14. ColtCarbine

    ColtCarbine Monkey+++ Founding Member

    The Boston Bombing is the day all of America lost their freedoms and liberties LIVE on TV and most do not realize it even happened.
    VisuTrac and Motomom34 like this.
  15. BTPost

    BTPost Stumpy Old Fart,Deadman Walking, Snow Monkey Moderator

    The place to deal with these type of ISSUES, is in Federal District Court, NOT on your Front Porch. You make your Statement, and then Shut the F**K Up.... If they are smart, LEOs, they will have a Judge Standing By on the Radio, and He will Issue a Search Warrant, in Short Order, which will then be transmitted to the Command Center, and brought to your Residence, and SERVED Legally on you. Then you MUST let them Search. If they are STUPID, they just Barge in, and conduct their Search, and if they are REALLY Stupid, they Arrest you for Obstruction Of Justice. If you are Smart, you Hold your Tongue, and Keep Your BIG Mouth Shut, and comply with any Orders they give you. After the fact, when you have an ATTORNEY, Standing in Federal District Court, or the Court that issued the Search Warrant, then is when you let your Schister LawDog loose, and he scewers the Judge that Issued the Warrant, on the Probable Cause Declaration made for the Warrant being Issued. If the submission for the Warrant was in ANY WAY enhanced beyond the absolute Facts, the Judge is going to scewer the LEO's BIG TIME, and they are Toast. If they conducted the Search without a Warrant, your LawDog is going to cause such a stink, the Federal Prosecutor, will very likely try and Pay you Off, long before the Trial Date, for reasons mentioned above. If they Arrested you for Obstruction of Justice, the Payout just goes up by Triple, and someone loses His/Her JOB. Civil Rights Violations, are dealt with VERY Seriously in Federal District Court, because NO Federal Judge wants to be overturned on a Civil Rights Case, and if you were calm, Not Shouting, or Causing a scene, but just said your Piece, and then were QUIET, the Federal Judge is going to issue Summary Judgement, and the US Attorney KNOWS IT. That is EXACTLY WHY he will NEVER let it get into Court. He can't win, the LEOs are Toast, and you are very much Richer... Yea, you might have been roughed up some, and they will Lie, Cheat, and Steal, to NOT get Caught, but in the end, They are going DOWN. Only YOU, can decide, if it is worth it to YOU......
  16. Motomom34

    Motomom34 Monkey+++

    It is always worth it but it is really hard. there has been times when my children will start begging, "please Mom no, just let it go." "Please don't do/say anything, just look away, just walk away, please Mom." It always works out okay but it is hard when you hear those voices. I know my role is to set an example and thus they will become decent human beings but some lessons in life are hard to live. You don't want to teach your children to be cowards but you also don't want a bullet in your head.

    You are correct BT.
    Silversnake likes this.
  17. VisuTrac

    VisuTrac Ваша мать носит военные ботинки Site Supporter+++

    Nothing worth fighting for is easy choice.
    tacmotusn likes this.
  18. kellory

    kellory An unemployed Jester, is nobody's fool. Banned

    It is much easier to stand your ground, when it is you alone in the crosshairs. When someone else is depending on you, it tends to tie your hands.
    NotSoSneaky likes this.
  19. Illini Warrior

    Illini Warrior Illini Warrior

    What comes to mind for me .... what if ..... these two on-the-run terrorists were black, former gang bangers, converted to Islam in prison and now on a crusade ....

    Instead of the almost all white neighborhoods and communities, like Watertown .... the terrorists are hiding out in their old gang haunts .....

    What would we see from the law? .... How would the all black hoods react? .... Would Obammy & Holder be reacting differently? ..... How much screaming from the NAACP? ..... Jesse Jackson & Rev Al ?

    It's only a matter of time til the terrorist is a black muslim ....
  20. fmhuff

    fmhuff Monkey+++

    Well as I was watching the house to house searches in Boston which was IMHO a point of defacto martial law in the way it was conducted, the thought came to me “where is the point we can consider the government Federal, State, or Local is at war with us”, citizens of this land? This is arguably what we were warned about as tyranny by our founding fathers.

    Don’t get me wrong I’m not advocating anything, just asking the question that was ask before by Martin Niemöller (1892-1984) who was a prominent Protestant pastor who emerged as an outspoken public foe of Adolf Hitler and spent the last seven years of Nazi rule in concentration camps.

    Niemöller is perhaps best remembered for the quotation:
    First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out-- Because I was not a Socialist.

    Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out-- Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

    Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out-- Because I was not a Jew.

    Then they came for me--and there was no one left to speak for me.

    I am concerned because every act of violence by criminals and terrorist is seized as an opportunity to illegally wrestle away from the public any civil remaining rights enumerated in the Bill of Rights. If in fact they are violating those rights, then they are acting in a criminal activity which if we as citizens participated in would be found guilty and punished in a court of law. Let’s not even get into their oath of office.

    When it’s OK for the government and not the citizen, then it’s tyranny. - Unknown

    Any government that is the exclusive judge to the limits of its own power is in effect a tyranny. - James Ronald Kennedy

    If you are afraid to speak against tyranny, then you are already a slave. – John Bryant

    I have saved over six hundred pages of quotes from various sources I have labeled “Freedoms Call’’. Some are from nefarious sources but most are from patriots. I can tell you for certain that those in power here this day are no patriots to this nation. So perhaps now we see a tyranny of government at war against America’s own people. At least that’s how it’s looking to me.

    WWTJD What would Thomas Jefferson do? [wannamesswitme]
    Hosster likes this.
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